Terrorists' vandalising Stone Henge and trying to force govt policy

[FoxJTT047101111]

We need the security services to shut the group down when they are carrying out what can be described as terrorist methods to influence govt policy.

Once it’s gone, it’s gone forever.

Well, quite. Orangutans are critically endangered and expected to become extinct by 2029, largely because of the demand for palm oil. Once they’re gone, they’re gone forever. I don’t understand the outrage over a painting or Stonehenge. Yes, they’re beautiful things, but so are the things being destroyed by human activities every day which for some reason don’t provoke such strong emotions.

https://www.bbvaopenmind.com/en/science/environment/the-hidden-environmental-toll-of-smartphones/

People in glass houses..

Rather like vegetarian and vegans who drink ordinary wine rather than veggie-compatible wine. Or anthing with gelatin in

Perfect response and absolutely correct aswell

Oops wrong post attached lol although i do agree with the sentiment there's only 1 earth too however this is not the way to deal with the situation. It's criminal

It's certainly getting people to talk about their views on the protestors. Talking about their position on climate change .....less so.

Absolutely correct

This is where I have mixed feelings. I don’t like what they’re doing, but am grateful those brave women took action on my behalf, a 100 years ago.

Sometimes adverse actions are needed?

To compare them to the Taliban is ridiculous, even by mumsnet standards.

Totally agree. Even Greta Thunberg has said that how these people protest actually harms the cause because everyone just gets angry with them and then view the cause in a negative light. All publicity is good publicity is a load of bollocks- it’s actually made me switch off to their concerns as I just can’t respect these people

To get people to realise and be persuaded by their message you don’t go and vandalise something people hold dear , it closes people’s minds to what they have to say. They are preaching to the unconverted remember- so the world maybe burning but that message won’t get through if you vandalise what people hold dear above the future of Earth before you’ve converted them .

In addition to being disrespectful to all the people who have been murdered, tortured and oppressed by the Taliban, this is a false comparison. The Taliban completely destroy objects of beauty, because they want the people to live in joyless servitude. They don't throw cornflour on things to make a point. It's an idiotic way of making the point, but that comparison is even sillier.

I have never found orange cornflour terrifying, so I do not regard them as terrorists. They do not strike fear into my heart.

They are environmental vandals. I'm sure Wiltshire police will arrest them, inconvenience them, charge them and then bail them. The security services will already have them on radar, lest they try to glue themselves to the M25 in rush hour.

I can't get too worked up about them really.

Everyone needs make judgments on causes that they don't have the time or expertise to evaluate robustly.

One of the heuristics I think people use is: "do I keep hearing about this because it's real and serious, or because it's a fad or a hobby horse for some group?"

If XR makes the latter explanation more convincing, it could well lead rational people to be less convinced by the cause.

A parallel:

Why do I keep hearing about trans genocide? It is because there's a genocide of trans people or because there is a noisy group of slightly lunatic obsessives pushing that line?

If there are no lunatic obsessives to be seen, the former looks relatively more plausible, if there are, the latter.

Not a big deal re damage and an important message to deliver. I think they're smart and brave with these non-damaging but headline-grabbing tactics.

a bit ott to call them terrorists!

not fully sold on their methods but I think we can't afford to stick our fingers in our ears and sing lalalala while our planet is destroyed.

Yabu - global warming is already killing people in third world countries and is going to cause horrendous suffering in years to come.

They are not hurting anyone. There will be no one alive to see Stonehenge in 100 years if we don't act collectively to reduce carbon emissions globally.

@Gruffling how many people will suffer if you turn off their supply of power tomorrow

Yes, I mean if you inhabit the earth, surely climate change is your ‘cause’ unless of course you inhabit the mindset of the climate change deniers, in which case there is really no point in trying to engage!

Not in your lifetime

Who the fuck is Lord what not and why are we listening to him again- he sounds very, very important…

Sorry don’t know what your short reply means.

It’s not your cause it’s ifs not going to affect you

Well, many would certainly argue that it was the support of women during the First World War that was the primary factor in women gaining the vote, not the suffragette’s earlier militancy. The suffragists felt the suffragette’s violence only worsened the chances of female suffrage, so it’s not as if all thought it was helpful. Both the major suffrage movements called off action when war was declared and dedicated themselves to the war effort in auxilary roles. This was cited by politicians, even in 1918, as justification for women’s enfranchisement.
The suffragette’s militancy was off-putting to many.

Just as the actions of Just Stop Oil are off-putting to many.

How do you know it won’t impact me, do you know me? This is the denial I’m talking about- in all honesty it is completely irrational.

I’m not talking about you in particular, im saying in general, people dissociate

@Goldenbear there’s 8 billion people on the planet, probably more than 7 billion less fortunate than you and not worried about climate change….not necessarily denying

That’s one argument but not all historians by any means agree with that, it is not an absolute!