There's no such thing as an independent female

[Yoyodiet]

I'm so wound up! Earlier, DP said to me he thinks I would benefit from signing up to Andrew Tate's academy course or whatever it is (I like learning about making money online, more out of interest than actually doing it myself). I said probably, but I wouldn't want to fund him as I don't like him. He asked why and I said he's not very nice to/about women. He was aghast and we went back and forth, defending him for the most part when I was reading bits off to him from a BBC article to prove my point. I read the following -

In that same video, he described women as "intrinsically lazy" and said there was "no such thing as an independent female".

...and he was like 'yeah, no women can be independent, you need men'. I couldn't believe it! I won't bore you with the heated discussion that ensued but he genuinely believes that not just I would crumble without a man (him), but all women on the planet if men suddenly disappeared. We would apparently perish in good time because we 'cannot hunt, do electrics, fix a roof or change a tyre'. (To add insult to injury I have qualifications in electrical installation and engineering, I'm pretty sure I could also change a tyre if push came to shove).

Also, I said I think there would be less wars without men - he said there'd me more because women are bitchy?? I said I'm pretty sure men have started a lot more wars than women in history. He pointed in my face and told me women didn't even fight in wars til recently. I reminded him that men made those rules.. 😂

He genuinelyyyyyy believes I'd fall apart without him. Our relationship has been rocky lately but this really made me see a different side to him. He really made me feel like a lesser person and it's made me feel really disappointed since. AIBU to be lying in bed awake stewing over this???

Tell him to come and speak to me. Mortgage free, live alone, manage just fine, ta. Or to speak to my neighbour, 90, lives alone, manages just fine. Or speak to any of my single, happy, independent friends.

Tell him to come up close so I can bop him square between the eyes!

Men. They are always the problem. That's why us independent women are so much happier living without them. You may want to give it a go, OP!

Lots of men can't do those things and hire people to do them for them. No one, male or female is capable of performing every role needed within society

I've just discovered I don't exist (lesbian who lives alone).

I couldn't be with someone as stupid as him op. Sexism/misogyny aside even.

Flaws in our lady brain 🤣🤣🤣

I think as human beings we all depend on one another within our groups. It's nothing to do with gender. We would not be happy functioning alone, beubg self sufficient forever. Your husband needs to cancel his Andrew Tate subscription!

I think it's true men are generally better at some things but so are we

I know this is not really the point of the post but can I add Steve Harvey to the mix who has got to be the biggest hidden misogynist out there.

He says things like a man can't be friends with a woman without wanting to have sex with her (because obviously she has nothing else going for her than sex appeal), and worst of all - his audience (including women) clap along! 🤢

As a species we're interdependent on each other, but only insomuch that we can't be experts in everything so we need help from others for some jobs. But women absolutely could function well without men. We may not be as physically strong but that's largely irrelevant with labour-saving machinery and devices, and if a task is too physically challenging we just get creative!

Women can farm, hunt, drive heavy machinery, build, etc, just as well as men given the training. Hasn't he heard of the Women’s Land Army and Women’s Timber Corps?! 🙄His argument is ridiculous as most men can't do the things he mentioned, and there isn't a special man brain for "man jobs". Dickhead!

Such as?

Reading so many threads today where seemingly intelligent women are actually sharing their time and thinking of sharing futures with these misogynistic arseholes! Have they no arsehole radars?

I think without women there would be a lot of illness and weak children from unhygenic conditions and malnutrition

I don't want to derail your thread OP by debating the merits of JP vs AT. JP doesn't need me to frankly.

Suffice to say - I don't really like groupthink that we're 'supposed to' dislike someone like JP as an entity. I can like some of what he says while completely rejecting other bits. We're all quite complicated and inconsistent at times. It's rather patronising to imply that I could only agree with him on some things because my sweet ladybrain is all bamboozled by his big words.

His biggest issue seems to be his wide fan base so some of the videos are titled provocatively ('JP DESTROYS feminist! JP SLAMS lady!') and then you watch a perfectly polite exchange of differing viewpoints. It's just the channel creator using key words to drive traffic.

If I was forced to recommend one manosphere dude to teenage boys and men I would 100% pick the guy who tells them to take responsibility for themselves and be better. However OP your husband is presumably a grown man. I would be disgusted too, would robustly challenge him and then get on with being awesome - with or without him!

I’m straight and have never relied financially on a man. I paid the mortgage for my ex husband and I until I kicked him out. He pays no child support. I now live with a partner and pat two thirds of the mortgage (because I earn nearly three times what he earns. In what world am I financially dependent?

How would I be less dependent if these were women as opposed to men?

It's such a stupid divisive attitude as well because most men aren't independent either as they need other men to do those so called manly things for them.
What super independent survival things can your dh do? Can he farm? Grow crops? Do the plumbing and electrics in your house? Build an extension? Build a car?
Women can learn those skills just as well as any man could.

My response to this would be if you really think I can't survive without you boy are you about to find out exactly how much I thrive without you.

My husband is well aware that women are the superior gender and often tells me that if women ran the world there would be far less war etc.

I could be wrong but I think their whole point is even if you're financially independent, you are still living in a building probably built by men, using roads and transportation built by men, using electricity coming from cables laid by men blah blah blah

I mean it's totally ridiculous. Even if you believe totally in male and female roles and think people should stick to them...then men aren't independent either. They are birthed by women who are assisted generally by midwives who are women, and are educated in school by usually female teachers.

It's all nonsense

In this situation you really do need to just throw the whole man away. Plus then he can see how well he lives and gets on without a woman being "dependant" on him 🙄.

Poor kids, I hope they got their mothers IQ.

What absolute bollocks.

@SquirrelSoShiny

Also don't want to de-rail the thread but did want to apologise and clarify what I meant.

I was referring to what I see as an unpleasant zeitgeist gaining traction mainly due to the Internet and its sophisticated psychological button pushing algorithms.

The flippant "ladybrain" comment comes from seeing what I believe is termed evolutionary psychology used as another tool to entrench positions of men versus women in the "sex wars" . It's pseudo science and being used as a get out clause to try and bring back a more "traditional " societal model. It's trying to suggest that the ills of society can be solely laid at the feet of Mother Nature (ha) and that despite powers if logic and reason we are doomed by our wiring.

FWIW I agree that encouraging both sexes to take responsibility for themselves and their well-being via simple steps that modern society has over-complicated is not a bad thing, but if "Tidy your room" is seen as a revelation to young men because a man said it, versus mothers begging for their offspring to do it for aeons, it proves that there is a general attitude to women and their wisdom that it is somehow "lesser".

I really didn't mean to be patronising - my words were reflective of what I see going on in the world, not aimed at you per se.

Anyway - sending best wishes - I appreciate a robust debate and the opportunity to reflect. We all have something to bring to the table 😊

Time to go prove woman can be independent I think!

It's actually quite amusing. These types think they're supremely intelligent and that they have unearthed some amazing theory. All they have deduced is what everyone knows anyway which is that everyone in society performs a specific role and is inter dependent.

Imagine him making the same remarks to your daughter and him trying to limit her life and aspirations in that way. And imagine your son’s view of women being shaped - in his own home - in the same way as your husband and AT. And then make a decision. It will be a very hard one, I’m sorry.

If you’re both not careful, your son will absorb these things and one day parrot them back to another poor woman, and the toxicity will live another generation. And your daughter might find herself saddled to a man who thinks the same way, and treats her accordingly.

Both situations would be tragic.

I could be wrong but I think their whole point is even if you're financially independent, you are still living in a building probably built by men, using roads and transportation built by men, using electricity coming from cables laid by men blah blah blah

Ah, so he means we're all interdependent on other people.