To be AMAZED at this cms calculation?

[whatnowws]

Recently split from DS’s dad. He won’t communicate or see ds, so after several weeks I contacted cms. They are getting in touch with him but… the claim is for 730 a month?!? He earns almost 80k? How can this be right?

meanwhile, I’m earning 46k and paying 1,700 in nursery costs and all other costs for ds?

how on earth is that supposed to be fair?! This calculation is also assuming he continues not to see ds. If he wants him a night or more then costs reduce further… basically he can do what he wants and I’m expected to pick up the financial pieces no matter what.

Wow this thread is a race to the bottom. No you shouldn't have to be grateful he pays more than £7 a week!

The child maintenance system is completely messed up. Not including childcare forces resident parents (usually mums) out of work and onto benefits, which then means the taxpayer is having to pay out rather than the father. The whole thing increases child poverty. I don't understand why there's not a stronger political will to fix this, the system benefits no-one except absent parents.

The CMS calculation is loosely 15% of their take home (assuming no overnight stays) so that’s exactly the calculation I’d expect on that salary. It doesn’t matter that us Mums spend 80%+ of our take home pay putting a roof over their heads, paying for childcare and providing for them, that’s by the by. We’ll only spend the CM on going out and getting our lashes done anyway. 🙄 It is all so so wrong.

It's appalling. But instead of women coming together to do something about it, the masses tell anyone who will listen it's not fair because Lisa down the road gets £100 more...

I know!
If you get any election candidates on your doorstep op, ask them about it.

I'm so sorry. The amount CMS expect non resident parents to pay is pathetic and nowhere near half the cost of raising a child. Unfortunately you won't get much sympathy from some people because lots of others are worse off. That doesn't mean you are fortunate though, it just means you are a bit more fortunate than other people.

Average nursery costs in England are £1140pcm. If the OP is anywhere in the southeast £1700 is completely normal.

presumably OP selected the nursery in conjunction with her ex as they felt that was best for their child. And I’ll bet ex still thinks it’s best but would prefer not to pay for it. Why should she put him in a less good environment just because her ex is stingy.

Do you really think that she's paying those high fees for fun and that there is another nursery around the corner hundreds of pounds cheaper? I was paying £1500 a month 12 years ago so I can well believe it. And childminders were not cheaper in my area, believe me I checked. I also doubt that moving a child who has just had an upheaval in their life is a sensible thing to do for their wellbeing.

Also @whatnowws - if they’re only just getting in touch with him don’t bank on CMS actually getting any money out of him quickly.

They are shit. I worked there briefly and they’re just dire.

Hopefully he’ll just pay up when they get in touch with him, but they can be rubbish at actually getting payments from him.

Also keep in mind that he may, if he hasn’t already, max out his pension contributions to lower the amount as it’s calculated post pension.

My ex earns over £90 grand and I get £534 for my son. We have had to rent a room out to a lodger to make some extra cash. My ex sees him 2 weekends a month but cancels if he ever feels like it. Cms is never going to be half the cost of raising a child unfortunately.

Are you really so dumb or just playing?

OP wants to work full time?
Maybe dad should stop working and care for his own child 10h cor fi e days a week, there would be no nursery fees then.

My ex has fiddled it so he shows up as self-employed and therefore pays the minimum. £30.

How is his contribution huge when it's nowhere near what she'll have to pay?

Bizarre.

I don't think the op should get uc. I think the kids dad should pay his fair share. Even that £730, I bet he won't pay it and will suffer absolutely no consequences for not paying it.
If the op was on benefits, the state would be picking up the tab for this so men can walk away consequence free and keep all their money.
I'd love to see the law get tough on this, it won't though because, even on mn the prevailing view is women should just suck it up.

Wow!! The replies on here are INSANE! So sorry OP about the absolute nonsense being thrown back at you. Someone questioning your completely normal nursery costs, your 'massive wage' (really? I live in a deprived area of the country £46k is not even massive for here) and making out that a dad can't be expected to pay half of childcare costs just because you want to work, without thinking for a second about his choice to work? what the hell is going on on Mumsnet today?!

Sorry OP. I had this situation. My child is now in school but it took me a few years to pay back the borrowing I had to take out to meet nursery costs. I couldn't work part time and keep us afloat. My ex is a very high earner and has an exceptionally high QOL (in material terms). I don't have an answer for you but to say you are not alone in this and men who behave like this are the worst kind of selfish coward.

Politicians just don’t give a fuck.

It used to be that RPs on benefits only got to keep £20 a week of maintenance. The rest was owed to the Sec of state to go toward the welfare bill. The debt owed by non payers got so high it was deemed that something must be done…

So they said RPs on benefits could just keep all the maintenance and they wouldn’t count it since the knew it wasn’t being paid in so many cases as income

It says it all about all of the parties that this has never changed.

Everyone saying it’s a lot, is because it is in the eyes of cms. But not a lot in terms of raising a child. My ex is self employed and fiddles with his tax returns - as a result child maintenance calculated one year to pay £15 a week, another year £18 a week and now the calculation is that he don’t have to pay, despite working a full time job. He came to a private ‘agreement’ and only pays me £40 a week/ £160 a month. He refuses to have our child any more time other than every other weekend and won’t even pick up from school on that weekend because ‘he has to work’. He also refuses to pay any childcare either. And then he brags that he pays me a ‘lot’ of maintenance.. as if £160 covers ANYTHING

I don't understand this take at all

Not having anything to do with your child, shirking your parental responsibilities, causing emotional harm and expecting the other parent to do everything whilst also expecting her to pay the vast majority of costs is the very definition of a deadbeat.

Raise your bar.

If care was 50:50 lets do week on week off, dad would pay 850 pcm, assuming same childcare half the rest of the costs and the hassle of half the care. Mum would be £100 better off, plus only half the costs, plus half the time better off. So yes, the cms calculation is a joke.

That is a large amount of CMS.. but I completely agree with you OP. Its a ridiculous system and goodness knows who came up with the calculations

I also think those that don't pay, even the measly amounts, should be criminally prosecuted for child neglect. You soon would be if you stopped feeding/clothing your child, why shouldn't the father if he does the same?

This thread is shocking.

Childcare is OP's responsibility because she chooses to work. WTF
Her ex gets to father a child, walk away and his career is not affected. Meanwhile OP is left to foot the lions share of the costs to raise their child.

He's walked out on OP, not his child? He's walked out on both of them because he doesn't see his child. Again WTF.

Based on OP's figures it means that she has roughly 2k to cover all living expenses when CMS and childcare have been taken into consideration. Her ex will have about 4k after he has paid CMS.

I agree with a previous poster that you have to just accept it for now knowing that as childcare costs reduce his pay and CMS will increase and things will get easier.

Turkeys voting for Christmas springs to mind on this thread.

CMS deducts 11% of a non resident parents income. It's meant to cover half of a child's essential costs; food, child's portion of shelter, essential clothes etc. There's an expectation from CMS that parents will liaise and the costs that are deemed as non essential, are worked out between parents. Which obviously works on the assumption that all parents have contact with the non resident parent.

You will only face deductions to CMS if the NRP has your child 52+ nights a year. Which is based on the assumption that they will be paying for LO for those nights.

There is plenty of help out there, and while I recognise the situation is unfair. It's cutting off your nose to spite your face if you don't access what is available to make a point.

Before you have a go at me, as you have the other posters. I've had less than 20 payments of £29.91 over the last 11 years. I was also a full time carer to a very sick child, which meant I couldn't work whilst also incurring a significant amount of extra costs. I know how awful the system is. I've spoken about it a lot with gingerbread because it was something they were pushing to improve.

In all honesty while I absolutely abhor the system as it is, I doubt it will change, so I would advise you to take what you can, while you can from your child's "father". I say this because you don't know if, or when he will find a way to get around the system and reduce his CMS.

It's awful OP.

With both of you working FT, then obviously the cost of childcare should be 50/50 and THEN CMS should be on top of that for what it costs you to raise your child with no help from the father.

I can't believe how many people think it's fine for a man to walk away from his child and contribute the minimum amount allowed by law to their upbringing, and think that cost for nursery etc should come from the government, I.e. our taxes, not the absent parent.

I swear if they got all the absent parents in the UK to pay what it actually cost to raise their own kids it would be way more than the tax they think they're going to get from VAT on private education.

I don't understand why more isn't done about this.

If you, OP, handed him your child and walked away and just paid him the CMS amount and left him to pay £1700 for nursery plus all other costs, he'd be fuming.

CMS deducts 11% of a non resident parents income. It's meant to cover half of a child's essential costs

It’s not meant to cover half of the costs. Thats part of the issue, people think it’s meant to cover half and it’s not (and therefore end up disappointment or surprised when it doesn’t). There is zero correlation between costs and the calculation.

It is simply a contribution toward the essential expenses based on a percentage of the NRPs income. Sometimes it’ll cover half, sometimes it will cover more and most often it will cover much less than half.