It's a private school one.....

[Noangelbuthavingfun]

Many threads on MN ... I want to know this: why haven't Labour given any info on their modelling of what will likely happen and the different scenarios that could play out when they impose VAT? It matters - because if they get thus wrong ... and a shed load of kids leave private because their families have scrimped to send them there ... the state sector in some councils will quickly be overwhelmed with kids needing state places that does not exist....which could be a lose lose for everyone! You don't build a new school and resource it in a month.... these things take years . I feel for all kids as they will all lose out if this happens and labour having got contingency in place.
How would you feel if your child is in a good state school , perhaps they get some SEND support...and suddenly there is an influx of private kids as they need the spaces. Class sizes go up to 40, all SEND provision gets cut as not enough funds, extra curricular gets cut and teachers are even more stressed, so the vicious circle if teacher shortages now intensifies....the spiral continues for years to come. Who has won?? No one ....
What are your thoughts on this ?
I don't disagree with the principle that private is a luxury and probably should pay VAT... what I disagree with is the notion you can just implement something that will fundamentally shift things on a seismic way in one big bang. No thought whatsoever. Tell me if you agree or have a different view and why ?

Useless eaters, eh? Just as well you're here...

would you mind sharing in what way you are committed? in material terms?

Another person who can’t explain who pays for the social state if people like me don’t…

Claimants who can work but choose not to. Let’s start with them.

Middle class earners continue to be hit in the shins at every opportunity - how dare they try to climb the ladder?!

luvvie socialists actually propagate inequality. The ultra wealthy avoid taxes through havens and crafty accounting. The people in between end up funding the majority, all the while being unable to gain any traction to better themselves. Why stay in a country that doesn’t appreciate that mentality and ability?

It's overdramatic stuff like this that doesn't help tbh. Some people can't afford private. Some people are against it on principle. It's not 'hate'. It's disagreement. There have been plenty of very defensive private school parents on here too. And one or two being pretty rude about state schools. But no need to fuel the fire.

Why do you think you're the only one who pays tax? Does your tax bill get up and go to work every day? Is it a nurse? Is it a bin man? Is it a carer? A teacher? Dear lord.

You have a point, but the 'people like you' comment was quite rude, to be fair. Just because some people are being nasty about private school parents, doesn't mean you have to be nasty too. And you don't know how much tax the pp pays.

Claimants who can work but choose not to. Let’s start with them.

I don’t think there are that many of them tbh.

Middle class earners continue to be hit in the shins at every opportunity - how dare they try to climb the ladder?!

What is a middle class earner? 60k? 100k?

The ultra wealthy avoid taxes through havens and crafty accounting. The people in between end up funding the majority, all the while being unable to gain any traction to better themselves.

People in between do fund a lot I agree, that’s true for most countries though. I don’t think tax planning is just for the ultra wealthy though.

That's the point of the policy, isn't it? To divide people. Bit like the Rwanda bill.

Who are people like you exactly? Will you be so smug if you get sick and can't fund the entire nation any longer? Fuist.

Have people entirely forgotten the concept of the welfare state? That allowed people to get an education, this work etc. To eat when they had nothing? Or is it just turning into America.

@whovotestory

"@1dayatatime yes, to answer your hypothetical question, I would still support it."

Let me get this right- you would still support a tax policy that actually either costs you more money in higher taxes (if the cost of the policy was more than the tax it raised) or have less money for existing public services such as state education (as an alternative to raising taxes) so long as someone else cannot get something "better" than you are able to.

It's a bit like saying I would sacrifice my holiday to Spain this year so long as my neighbour can't go to the Caribbean out of principle because that's not fair.

This doesn't make any sense at all.

Surely the whole point of any tax is that it raises more than it costs to implement?

Lastly I'm equally sure that you are lovely as well but you're probably right that I can't see us agreeing on this one 😀

www.moore.co.uk/msuk/moore-south/news/april-2016/the-tax-system-explained-using-a-beer-analogy

Not really surprising people are less than supportive given your children will not be in a worse position than anyone else's child if they go to state schools. Most people probably wouldn't have given it much thought though if it wasn't for the copious threads on here filled with obnoxious comments from some private school parents. Cush21 s a typical example.

I called our local council and was told that all primary schools in our area have (mostly long) waiting lists, they couldn’t tell me how many children had been admitted from each list per month or year. Private schools require a term of notice, so this leaves parents with little option but to (pay the VAT) whilst they sit on very long lists, awaiting a space. Once they are offered a space they are expected to take it up immediately, thus leaving them with a term of fees (minimum) to pay, when their child would not be there, plus the VAT obviously. My question is, why, if I have given you notice of our request for a state school place, would we not receive the state equivalent in funding, whilst they arrange our place? Seems fair to me? You want my child in state education, cool, please may I have the 5k or whatever it is to offset the costs until you are in a position to offer me a place? Labour has not provided any modelling because that would show this concept up as the absolute hogwash it is. The more practical side to this is there isn’t good evidence that shows blending all these kids will have the desired outcome. What previous instances of these types of academic socioeconomic blending do demonstrate is that this is likely the beginning of talented and gifted programmes being rolled out across UK state schools, this (research has shown) is likely to detract from the poorest and the most average students, whilst teachers spend a majority of their time serving the most and least academic pupils.

I don't think that Labour have said they want all children to go to state schools. There will be places in primary state schools further afield. If you don't want to pay for a private school place, your child can either go there permanently or move there temporarily until there is a place at a primary school you want them to go to.

Why would you expect your choice to keep your child at private schol to be subsidised? You could home school or pay for a nanny while you wait if you prefer. You were intended to pay for the whole year, why would a single term suddenly be an issue, even with VAT?

It the £4k or whatever it is in VAT is that critical to you why not use some of the £20k you'll save to organize some transport for your child. The VAT is such a small tax break to be removed from the rich. Will you also object to the VAT on whatever else you choose to spend the £20k on?

Firstly, no one "wants" your child in a state school. Where you educate your child is a parental decision. If you can't afford private school, then a state place will be offered. It just might not be where you'd like it to be and may be out-of-area.

If you choose to hang on for your desired choice, thereby incurring additional private school fees, that would be your choice and not something the state needs to fund.

(Edited for typo!/spelling)

If you choose to hang on for your desired choice, thereby incurring additional private school fees, that would be your choice and not something the state needs to fund.

Absolutely, and exactly what any state school pupil moving into your area mid-year would be expected to do.

Do you have any idea how hard it is to get an ECHP, or to ‘persuade’ a council to provide funding?

I know exactly what it takes to get an EHCP, thanks. It's not easy, but plenty of people manage it. Once it is in place the council has no choice but to secure the provision required.

Exactly. So if some of the many children living there who currently go to private schools had to leave, there would be no problem accommodating them in a good state school - which is an example of why all the scaremongering on here is unjustified.

Backdating to July 5th wouldn’t be hard. How many parents have the cash in their back pocket?

You have no basis for this assertion. Holiday clubs are very different to education. And individuals proving tutoring, language and music lessons would need to reach the VAT threshold to charge VAT.