Severe lies between our children and friends children HELP

[New15]

Long one so will try and compress down!

I have 14 (Boy) and 10 (Girl)
Lifelong friends have 2 kids 14 (girl) and 13 (boy)

these people we see every weekend, we holiday together have been through good and bad together and are so important to us.

Background being both my friends kids have been caught out lying about Drinking, Vaping, talking to adults in a sexual nature over the internet sending explicit pictures to other people in the last 6 months or so.
My kids are the model of good behaviour, neither have ever done anything wrong (I’m so lucky) my boy 14 is massively into sport so his health is priority. We have different parenting styles, I am more of a gentle parent with the others being the opposite.
Both my kids are always honest and upfront and have never done anything to not have my trust.

my Daughter 10 last week said she had something to tell me and got really upset.
2 weeks ago, whilst round their house. My daughter (10) went in their sons room (13) for a few minutes a which is totally normal and had said he was having sexual conversations with other friends over PS5.
he had turned and said sorry did you know about that stuff?, to which she responded “yes, I did sex education at school last week”
He then proceeded to show her on his phone what I believe to be porn. He also asked her if she knew what it was. At 10 years old she was trying to describe what she saw, but struggled as she didn’t understand it, however I knew what she was talking about straight away. She felt uncomfortable and pretended to need a drink to which he said, if she was to tell me, he would say it was her and she would get into trouble.

Now she does have Tourette’s and struggles with decisions and some emotions massively which is why I assume it’s taken her a week to pluck the courage up to say something.

I rang my friend and explained what I had been told and that I was so shocked by it. The friend apologised to which I said it’s not your fault but please speak with him and let me know.

we knew he would lie because he lies about everything until it’s black and white in his face to which he couldn’t lie.

my friend rang me back the next day and said her son (13) has swore down he absolutely did not show her anything. There was nothing on his phone. That he had said, she had overheard him laughing in about sexual stuff with his friends which he apologised for but that was it.
I explained, that what my daughter told me, she couldn’t have known, and the way she explained it proved she didn’t know what it was, only she knew it wasn’t right.
My friend then proceeded to tell me my daughter probably knows much more than she lets on, and I should baby proof her phone! (Her phone has always been for school walking only) and she doesn’t have access to the internet at all.
So basically my friend has took her sons word and now it is incredibly awkward.

what do I do?
this is someone who is considered as family. We love each others kids like our own, and despite her kids going off the rails a little and lying Iv always loved them like they are my own.

I don’t know how to approach it at all!

My daughter had asked what was going on and I had to tell her that they believe he is telling the truth. To which she broke down in tears, and said she wish she never said anything. Which makes it worse I want her as a young girl to be able to tell me things that make her feel uncomfortable and to be heard. - And this isn’t a little white lie or swearing ect. This is a teenager lying about showing my 10 year old something extremely sexual.

this whole experience as a parent has me overwhelmed.

Thoughts from an outside viewer are greatly appreciated!

This with bells on .

This friendship of yours needs to end .

My 11 year old nephew was shown porn and extremley violent (illegal) videos by my other nephew who was 15. We were absolutely sickened and even more so when he was sat down to dicuss this and he told us he'd already been shown this kind of content in school.

I have young daughters and this kind of thing fills me with fear.

I think this friendship can't be salvaged unless your friend apologises. She may have been embarrassed, I would in her shoes, but I would take the word of a 10 year old girl who has no reason to lie.

This is deeply concerning. Regarding the 13 yr old being not bothered he and his parents must understand that Police have sophisticated IT tracking systems that can clearly see what has been on any device. Every contact leaves a trace. Number of serious offences here.
If the mobile in question suddenly goes “missing” parents will have their answer.

Imagine the kid who showed your daughter this stuff is an adult man. Imagine the conversation with your friend from that perspective.Imagine what you'd do to protect your daughter in that case.

The boy's intent isn't the same, but the damage and confusion to your daughter is the same.

Take a big step back from this family OP.

To be honest OP, I think you need to step away from this family, in quite a significant way.
The way that the children of your friends are acting isn't normal. In fact, it's akin to how I acted as a teen. I went off the rails because my family life was shit, I wasn't loved and I was looking for affection anywhere that I could find it. I think that both of their children- both the daughter and son have shown over sexualised behaviour, and the exposure of pornography and talking about things of a sexual nature infront of DD 10, I would worry could be a precursor to DD being assaulted.

These children are not being protected, because they obviously atleast do not have parental controls on their devices, aren't being supervised on the Internet and it seems that the parents attitude to parenting is more along the lines of gotcha! Now you're in trouble! Than OK, these are the boundaries, the boundaries are there for this reason and that reason, its Important that you understand the importance of these boundaries, and discussion is always open and honest from both sides.

I honestly would be seeing red flags because these kids aren't being guided, and their parents are turning a blind eye to what they are up to until the evidence is right in their faces and they have no choice but to act and I would in no way want that to impact my children, and it already has OP, your daughter has spent the past week quietly upset by the fact that she was exposed to things that she didn't understand, and made her feel uncomfortable. Part of why she hasn't told you is that she was told that she would get in trouble by him. The feelings she is experiencing will be very similar to the feelings of actual sexual abuse, including guilt. I'm really trying not to villainise this boy because I think there are glaring red flags that make me think the children in this household have been abused to get like this, and I think blame sits quite firmly with the parents here (they have two similar, and are not acting on what you've told them)
But I would not be allowing those children around mine. As sad as I would be about the friendship being lost, and what must have happened to those children, I would not be exposing my kids to them.

I do say this as the mother of a teenager. No they aren't perfect- by a long stretch! In their teen years it's tricky but teenagers don't tend to act the way that both of your friends kids have. One going off the rails? Maybe! Both? No. I don't think so.

100% this.

@New15 I was kissed and worse by a 14 yr old son belonging to a friend of parents...I was just 9 yrs old. It scared me. I also didn't ''tell'' as I should have done.

Please, please protect your child.

Please wave this family goodbye. For your children's sake. I don't want to go into it but I was your daughter in this scenario at a similar age and she needs to be kept away from that boy, regardless of his age or seemingly how much you like him. This is a massive red flag. Your daughter isn't safe there, in my experinece. You're failing her if you expose her to that household any more.

This forum is not the right place for a balanced response. Just a huge load of confirmation bias which is possibly why you posted here!

I don’t need to educate myself, 15% is the minority. Yet here you are suggesting that rather than being a victim of a sex crime a 10 year old went into a room and suddenly developed a very specific type of tic that involved porn appearing on a mobile phone. Ridiculous.

Confirmation bias that showing a 10 year old porn is not acceptable? What’s the other side?

It was literally a sex crime. This is serious. Teaching a ten year old that’s ok sometimes is very harmful.

She doesn’t love your daughter as her own. In fact she won’t do anything about the situation except blame a 10 year old. Time to distance yourself from this friendship.

I did not.

Christ!

It was obvious that he would deny showing Op's daughter anything on his phone.

Why would anyone care what this kid or his arsehole parents say?

Op believes her daughter has been shown porn & seems to be wavering about staying friends with these people ffs!

This happened to us, friends of over 30 years! their son was only a school year above ours. It had started with small stuff that our son had not told us about and culminated in him showing our son porn and masturbating in front of him (this was less than a month into their son being in year 7). Their son was also permanently excluded that same month for taking a picture of his penis on a girl's phone. It also came out that he had been vaping and stealing.

The parents (our former friends) initially seemed to be saying all the right things to get help for their son but in reality they just wanted to get him into a new school and brush what happened to our son under the carpet.

I was sad for the loss of the friendship (as we were very close) but there is not a chance that I would let her child near mine again. I couldn't even bear to look at him. I also cannot see how our friendship will continue as I am so disappointed at how much they minimised what happened.

I do believe that something has happened to their son to make him do these things but they just brush it off as 'silly boys stuff'. It is completely unfathomable to me but they are not my problem any more.

Safeguard your daughter OP - keep her away and keep your distance now. She needs you so stand up for her.

THIS. OP needs to step up - her child is at risk here.

What does your dd actually get out of these meetups? The only child she has to socialise with is a teenage boy who sounds like a creep. At the very least he was taking enjoyment out of making a much younger girl feel uncomfortable and intimidated. That's really disturbing. At 13 he's more than old enough to do much worse than what he's done if unsupervised. The fact that his mum just won't accept that he has done wrong is really worrying too. Honestly please just protect your daughter and leave your 'friend' and her child to it. His behaviour has the potential to turn very sinister over the next few years. It's not worth the risk.

I just wanted to say you are doing the right thing, in what must be a very tricky situation for everyone not least your daughter. We have very close friends like this and know how upsetting it must be when the behaviour is being denied. Just wanted to say you sound lovely and not to listen to the BS Mumsnet spouts sometimes.

It was the friend's girl showing the op's daughter something, not the son. The op has explained that.

Your priorities are skewed. Your title suggests the lies are the main issue rather than a 13 year old showing your 10 year old explicit sexual images. And you seem to be congratulating yourself on your well-behaved children compared to your friends’, but not to be acknowledging that you put your own child in harm’s way by putting her regularly in the company of two older children with a history of sending explicit photos and sexual talk online and who are poorly parented. That’s on you. Your friendship with the parents clouded your judgement.

Speaking from similar experience, these things are rarely mended once the perpetrator is defended and supported. I’d prepare to move on. However “my children are the model of good behaviour, they’ve never done anything wrong” is silly. Of course they have, they’re human.

This - my kids get exposed to porn. It’s unavoidable, despite all the blocking software we and the school have on our broadband and devices. But this child seems to seek it out and then chose to show it to a 10yo to shock and distress her (there can be no other reason, can there?)

I’d consider contacting the safeguarding team at his school as there is a clear issue over parenting if they’ve not even put the minimal protections in place and if, rather than come done on him like a tonne of bricks (which I would do, and have done for inappropriate texts when he was in year 5 FFS), then they need parenting guidance that social services would implement. That your child was harmed (she was tearful and distressed, that’s abuse) means that it is a safeguarding issue for ANY children entering their home.

No 13yo should be able to access porn without consequences. No parent should be diffident about it.

A 14 year old boy has shown your 10 year old girl porn. That's disgusting. I would never have them together again, because you cannot trust that boys poor judgement. You can still continue the friendship alone, without the kids being involved with one another. But you cannot have the kids alone together ever again.

I agree with others, it sounds as though your families have outgrown each other, which is no bad thing. I wondered why if your friends children are so badly behaved, you would encourage their friendship with your own children. I would have kept my distance. I think you have allowed your friendship with this woman, to massively cloud your judgment. I'm also not sure that you can say that your 14 year old has never done anything wrong. Never? That seems unlikely. However, the one thing that your friend said which I would give some credence is to, is the bit about your daughter possibly knowing more than you think she does. Her phone may be baby proofed, but I would bet that some of her schoolfriends phones are not. Unfortunately children are accessing porn at a young age, its shocking and appalling but true. That doesn't mean that your daughter is lying, I believe that she's telling the truth, it's just that you seem to have a very polarised view of what your children do/see/know. You asked what you should do, but surely the obvious answer is to distance yourself and keep your children safe. You will make other friends.