Is it really like this having a child?

[Handsomesquidward]

A friend of mine has a toddler now and since he's been born, she won't even leave the local village without months of planning in advance because the entire day revolves around his nap at the exact time.
Zero spontaneity anymore, they have decided not to go abroad for the next few years either.
Everything planned very meticulously, they will only have a night out once every 5 months or something as they will only trust their parents to babysit.

I don't have children and this method obviously works for her, it just feels so restrictive. I cannot imagine living life that way, surely this isn't how it has to be?

Exactly. Just go with the flow. No nap? Late nights? Who cares...

No. My kids both happily napped in a pushchair. I didn't want to be stuck at home. We still had a time routine for when they'd nap but didn't need to be at home for it.

But all these people saying that's how it works are just prime examples of how everyone is different.

They do what works for them. We do what works for us. Why is it not right that "going with the flow" doesn't work for us in a holiday scenario, because we end up with a miserable, exhausted child (and parents)? Why are we being told it's wrong that we've therefore decided to go for days out instead of going away?

Holidays work for you, great. They don't for us so we've adapted. Let us.

I never understood the rigid approach (although would never have commented on it). We just went with the flow and was very happy that we could still be spontaneous and have a social life and travel without any restrictions relating to nap times.

I don’t understand how you could make this rigid approach when you have more children as surely nursery times and other activities will coincide with the baby’s nap times.

Well yes - and illustrates that it’s not what having children is like for everyone. I get out and about with my kids, mostly on my own. We have days out and holidays and I love having them with me.

Young kids can be a nightmare if you break their routines so completely understandable behaviour. Get's better as they get older so their parent planning style will relax a bit.

By saying that it sounds like you think those of us that don't have holidays don't love having them with us.

We do. Days out are amazing and we have loads of them. Sleeping away from home doesn't work so we don't do it right now. We love having our kids with us, so we do what works for all of us to have wonderful times.

Also, she's 2. All she will remember is that she was happy with mummy and daddy doing fun stuff. Not where we went. So we'd rather, if we're gonna do 4 hours driving in a day, go for a day out then come home and let her get proper sleep where we know she'll sleep. She still has happy memories with us, and us with her. More so because no one is miserable from lack of sleep.

When I say “I love having them with me” I mean “I love going about life with children in tow and not feeling overly restricted by them”

The OP speaks about someone who sounds like she struggles to leave the house and I’m just here to say that is not my experience.

I have a 2 and a 5 year old.

You do you. I’ll do me.

I wasn’t a slave to nap time at home -they’d sleep in the car on a journey and we’d carry them in asleep or similar. Esp when you have more than one you need the younger child to be flexible.
I’d usually let them have morning nap at home then we’d be out and about later. But it did vary a bit.
Only parents or good friends babysat until youngest was 4 I think - after that we used neighbourhood teens that we knew and trusted. That worked well.

Small children can't go through the whole day without sleeping like older children and adults can. I wasn't so particular about exact timings with either of mine and would sometimes stretch them out if needed, but you do have to allow for a nap when they are tired.

If you don't let them sleep it's quite unpleasant for them, they might get weepy, bad tempered, destructive, hyper active or very very upset. Some kids will nap in the car or in the pram, which is sometimes an option, but you do need to give them some proper rest in their own bed more often than not.

As for travel, well you can go abroad with small children but it might seem a lot less hassle to just enjoy UK holidays where you can pack all the baby stuff, toys, books, potties, bedding, plates and cutlery into the car.

Re holidays - we did v child friendly ones when they were young & self catering.

Not the way I live, but if they're happy then what's the problem?

Although I do think it's quite normal to not get many date nights. I can only think of one of my mum friends who has date nights that don't involve making do with a candlelit dinner at home - and even hers aren't much more than once every 5 months!

You do you, I'll do me is literally my point.

But so many people on here are saying how easy it is to do things when you have children. Without taking into account that the only person with their experience of having children, is them. Everyone's is different.

OPs friend might not have difficulty leaving the house and doing things. She may have chosen to prioritise things that are important to her and her family. Which to OP looks like she never does anything. Whereas, she's just doing the things that are worth the effort she has to put in, to make life good for her family.

We barely had date nights that weren't dinner at home before kids, because that's what we enjoyed. To now go off having date nights would be weird, because it's not what we enjoy doing.

People should do what makes them happy, and their friends should be happy for them.

@IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos see that's my one thing I really miss about my pre-children life. I'd love to go out in the evenings - but I don't love it enough to find a way to make it work with our current lives/schedules 🤣 And that's ok. Candlelit dinners with my husband's cooking it is. It's only a few years!

Obviously people can prioritise dc above friends., but not seeing friends at all is counter productive for everyone. You find a way and most dc are flexible regarding where they sleep. I had a lovely comfy pushchair!

Also, all these poor dc not going on holiday! My DD as toddlers loved water and sand. We saw it as play and by 5 we took them to cities. As toddlers we loaded up the car or did a short flight. They don’t remember the holidays but they love looking at the photos. Nothing wrong with building sandcastles and I don’t remember holiday angst at all. Northern France served us well with our one car. Plus going out of high season was great. We even used baby sitters on French camp sites! (Shock horror!!)

Another one suggesting it's awful parenting to not take DC away for a week.

We're a small island. We can go to the beach without staying away. We can go to the zoo, the park, the hills, the cities, museums, valleys, art galleries, everything without having to suffer through sleepless nights.

Your DC slept anywhere? Brilliant. Not all of them do. Try and imagine that. Not everyone's life is an exact mirror of yours.

I don’t find it easy but it is worthwhile and it definitely gets easier with practice. My own observation is that people who avoid outings etc altogether struggle the most. My DH has always worked a lot so I’ve not had the luxury of waiting to have both parents available to get out and about.

I also think people forget few things are instantly good or bad, but require a bit of work to master. My eldest was a real handful and outings were challenging when my second came along but I cracked on establishing boundaries and think I’m reaping the rewards now.

@IpsyUpsyDaisyDoos If you don’t try, you don’t know. The OPs friend doesn’t try. We have had a couple of friends who didn’t try so they aren’t friends now. Making an effort is a two way thing in a friendship. No, I cannot imagine dc who are so difficult their parents never see friends. It’s a case of working at it @CalmDownWithChocolate says.

Also I’m not suggesting and nor have I seen anyone else suggest that not taking small children on holiday is bad parenting. Obviously do what suits you as a family. All I’ve said is that I enjoy taking my kids away, and have since they were babies (Covid permitting for holidays abroad!).

My 5 year old still remembers the holiday from when he was 2.5 (he has a brilliant and quite scary memory), so I disagree they don’t remember but it’s not a hardship
if there’s other things you do as a family. Our holiday this year was £4K and we spent £2k on a UK holiday earlier this year, aside from the effort and reward it’s bloody expensive and it’s not fair to say that it’s an essential component of family life.

My kids napped on the go and I loved being out and about with them. Parks, cafes, local walks, trios on the train yo central London. Going out us tricky as babysitters are so expensive so I relate to that part. I have friends who are out still though so it is what you make if if.

How do we know the OPs friend hasn't tried or doesn't try?

My DD is 2. I've taken her away 6 or 7 times in her short life (family live a distance away as well as holidays). She consistently doesn't nap if she's not at her house or in the car and she consistently doesn't sleep well if she's not in her own home.

This year we've decided not to do holidays, so that the focus can be on getting her to sleep well outside of her home at family homes. We are lucky enough that we live in a place where we can easily visit lots of things and make it like a holiday without actually going on holiday.

But to people who don't know what we've tried previously, it just sounds like we don't "do holidays" with our toddler.

Everyone here saying it's bad not to do holidays with toddlers or small children, or that parents just need to "try" are being incredibly judgemental without having lived the experience of those other parents.

Maybe OPs friend has tried. She has a toddler after all so she's not only a couple of months in. Maybe their life is simply nicer how they live it than having a battle to sit down with a friend (who complains about their life choices online) for a meal that they might not be able to eat. Maybe we should just let them live how they want instead of judging based on our own lives?

@CalmDownWithChocolate

Well I didn't use holiday clubs from age 4.

If you didn't have your children around you 24:7 that may be why you found them so easy.

@Handsomesquidward

Are you early - mid 20s?

I know your friend’s life seems unimaginable but having a baby is a massive change, a tonne of work and huge financial outlay.

The only way life can go on resembling, at least in part, what it was before is by either earning enough money to have a nanny (full or part time), or by having a family with at least two sacrificial grandparents who will do anything for the baby and preferably a legion of willing siblings/other relatives too. And avoid breast feeding.

Most will want to breastfeed for the health of their child, majority have busy family and not enough money for a nanny, so they deal with the drudgery. You also have a better bond with the child so there is a pay off.

You’re extrapolating - nobody is criticising you. We have different experience and views.