To feel like my child free friends want me to dislike having a child?

[doggydoggle]

Growing up, I observed that amongst my parents generation, there was a lot of jokes about husbands and wives disliking each other. This is often referred to as "boomer humour".

"The old ball and chain."

Jokes about his bald head and her fat bum.

It was all over birthday cards. It was all over tv and was generally part of every day conversation. Not to say that everyone actually felt that way but it felt like it was expected that they'd talk about each other that way.

I feel like my generation's (I'm in my 30s) equivalent to that is people joking about not liking their children. Parents often "jokingly" warn you "don't have kids". They do a sort of (either faux or real) jealousy when they hear about child free people going out to drinks as they have to be at home with a child. They constantly talk about needing wine to cope.

People without children often refer to children as smelly or gross or openly talk about how they could never cope with not having freedom.

I was child free for many years and I think it's great for people to be able to choose not to have children. I definitely don't think everyone should and it's obviously not the right thing for everyone. I believe people can be perfectly happy without children.

However I feel like a lot of people now seem to pity me for having a child and not being able to stay out late or make impromptu plans or "do whatever I want". Generally they talk about parenthood as being completely negative.

I confess that I felt this way before I had children. I definitely felt sorry for parents - thought they always looked stressed. Their lives didn't sound as fun. I thought mine seemed more fun - getting up when I want, not having responsibilities, being able to just think of myself.

The difference is that I didn't actually say this out loud to people with children!! As I knew it would be offensive to speak about their actual child who they loved as this horrible negative thing.

I've completely changed since having a child. I know that a lot of people will think it's for the worst but to me it feels like life is so much better now. Having a child is obviously hard sometimes but I love having him and I feel this complete and utter contentment and inner peace that I've craved my whole life. I have never been so at peace and happy ever before. I absolutely love being a mum and if I could go back in time I'd do it sooner and start sorting my life and finances out sooner so I could have had more.

I don't expect people to love or care about my child but I feel increasingly like having a child has almost become "uncool" amongst my (mostly childfree) peers. I'm constantly inundated with picture of peoples dogs. Everyone wants to meet these new dogs or see pictures or talk about and fuss over them. Sometimes they insist they love them as much as a parent loves their child (not in a joking 'fur baby' way either)

Any even mention of my child is at best smiled politely at before immediately changing the subject or worst I am told how they don't like children and sometimes they're called things like "crotch goblins". This is not in a loving jokey way.

Again I know nobody else owes me anything and has no reason to be interested in my child. I just feel it's weird that I'm expected to constantly talk about and look at pictures of dogs but if when giving an update about what's been happening with me I mention that my child learned to walk or talk or cartwheel, its boring and not an acceptable conversation.

When people find out I have a child they seem to feel sorry for me and want to brag about how they don't have one and their life is so easy.

I've tried making friends with mums at groups but I don't seem to have a lot in common with ones I've met and now I am back to working full time it is harder. A lot of people I meet through work, my interests etc tend to be childfree for whatever reason.

My plan is to kill myself before things get unmanageable. I wouldn't want to be reliant on someone else.

People have on here (Mumsnet generally) and other anonymous fora. There is a Facebook support group for people who regret having their children. And for parents of toxic adult children and adult disrespectful ungrateful children.

@Needanewname42 have you not read Regretful Parents on Reddit. That sub tells the same story for a lot of women and you g women who have been “sold a lie”.
i feel for some of them sometime it must be hard.
In this day and age it’s very common to not have children and good for them.

Maybe not in person, but there are plenty of forums online where people openly admit that they wish they'd never had children.

There are even threads on here from people who say they wouldn't have had children if they could have their time again.

I know, I work in the health tech industry. Lots of good jobs in this industry, we are struggling to recruit!

They’ll be miserable. It really is exhausting. Sorry.

Yeah, the problem is that your friends are arseholes, not that they’re childfree.

I had the reverse throughout my 30s with parent friends - expected to listen to endless complaining but also reminded that I’d never know true love or selflessness if I didn’t join them (some knew I was infertile and kept forgetting). I attended countless baby showers, shelled out so much money on babies and kids’ birthdays, let them dictate and dominate every single social event with endless baby and child talk. And they never remembered my birthday but if I didn’t sent a birthday present to one of theirs, bloody hell I heard about it.

I felt invisible after almost a decade of this. I now don’t hang out with them anymore and just sent happy birthday texts etc. Because they were arseholes who didn’t care about me. Your friends are too, I think. MN does like to indulge the myth that childless/free people are all child-hating monsters but we’re not. Your friends might be.

That said, you need mum friends in the way I needed childless/free friends.

Your friends sound awful OP, I've never come across that gloaty attitude myself thankfully but I'm older.

For analogy, i was SAHM for years and never expected talk about work to be excluded for conversation with friends. I always asked and listened, and I admit often felt they went on about it a lot. I didn't feign horror at normal things 'you have a deadline, poor you!' Nor did I smugly say 'work sounds so hard. This is why I don't do it'. Likewise I would expect my friends to listen to me about my life which was at the time centred around my kids. Not the minutiae of my routine, no one cares about that, but the general stuff.

Suggesting that childfree people are evil enough to ignore child abuse, whilst ignoring the fact that the person most likely to be abusing the child is their parent, is a truly bonkers new take.

My mum did - to me.

There are also thousands of TikToks collated under the hashtag regretful parents, as well as the other social media sites and forums mentioned.

I know what you mean. I had my first very young and I wouldn’t tell people until later. I feel like I received more respect from people when they knew I wasn’t a mum - vs those that know me as mum first than me second. Because I’m able to have other interests I find myself not talking about children unless it’s appropriate or it’s with another parent.

You said it yourself, when you were childfree you carried a certain belief/attitude - I think it normal. But find it sad that overall people are more negative about parenthood. I personally enjoy it and my friends, even my childfree friends treat my children as people ( some people test kids like they are alien or something).

In the West, I feel like we have lost our collective interest in children. Other cultures see children as a blessing, a chance to build a family unit; an investment. I do notice more love for pets than human children through society which I find … interesting.

@fitzwilliamdarcy they do sound like insensitive assholes and you are well rid.

I absolutely love being a mum to three older children / teens. I look back with massive nostalgia as well to when they were babies and preschoolers. They were so amazing.

The only bits I remember not liking were worrying when they were ill, worrying they might drown on beach holidays and having to spend too many hours at my busy job in finance services which left me very tired and took me away from them for longer than I wanted.

But now I'm a school teacher and really enjoying that too. So maybe I just like odd things!

Of course not every person under 18 cries and hits people, any more than everyone over 65 is incontinent, smells and has dementia, or all dogs are slavering man-eating killers.

You are making yourself look like an absolute loon here. It’s clear you’ve never spoken to or interacted with a child or teenager, yet you are convinced you know what all of them are like and hate them all.

I know loads of children. I really feel a bit sad at how much less satisfying my adult relationships are after the relevant adults have had kids. I would not ever mention this, though. It's a bit like if a friend moves away for an amazing job. I'm sad because I've lost them in my life but I do recognise their choices will make them happy.

I think most parents recognise that children are objectively annoying while also being subjectively beloved, though...

A Buddhist friend tells me her family believe children are a trial sent to work off bad karma so I'm not sure it's as simple as east Vs west

No, I don't think that's just what we do (or should do). It's rude to bang on about military history when you know nobody else is interested. Sure, if he's discovered something particularly interesting about military history then tell me and I'll make some polite comments (like the OP's friends do about her kids) but keep going on and on and I will change the subject.

I don't go on about subjects I know my friends aren't interested in. It's common manners.

Suggesting that childfree people are evil enough to ignore child abuse, whilst ignoring the fact that the person most likely to be abusing the child is their parent, is a truly bonkers new take.

So if someone laughs or condones a tragic event it's fine because the perpetrator
is worse? I don't think so.

All the childfree and childless people I know IRL are lovely and normal. But there are crazy people around. Look at r/childfree on Reddit. Unhinged is the only word.

People will say stupid shit like 'is it just me, it is SA on adults worse than children' and general hate for children, parents esp. low income, young or single parents.

Abusing a child is messed up. Anyone suggesting it's a big deal is messed up. There are people who hate children.

I don't think not liking children is the same as being anti-children.

Say that about any other demographic (age, sex, ethnicity, religion...). How does it make you feel?

Not wanting children is perfectly fine.

Not appreciating children as human beings deserving of respect, dignity and reasonable accommodation in our society is an entirely different matter. Which is something OP´s friends and many other people seem to be doing, unfortunately.

And no, I am not a parent.

You’ve missed my point. Nobody is laughing at or condoning child abuse (at least not here - I don’t hang out on reddit, and I’m not sure why you do either, it sounds dreadful). I’m a victim of it, it’s the last thing I’d do.

What I’m saying is that it was suggested that due to their lack of having had children, childfree people might be evil enough to ignore child abuse - ignoring the fact that a parent is likely to be the one carrying out the abuse.

It’s an absolutely bananas way to try to make the point that parents are virtuous and childfree people are evil.

right but you don’t outwardly roll your eyes and say “oh I’m just not remotely interested in [insert topic] and my life is so much easier for it” do you? Because that would be rude 🤷🏼‍♀️ and that’s what this thread originally started about - out and out rude shitty comments towards people with children

I suppose where disagreement kicks in is around what "reasonable accommodation" entails.

@fitzwilliamdarcy I don't 'hang out' on a childfree Reddit forum, anymore than you 'hang out' on Tik Toks for regretful parents (I have children myself).

But clearly those types of crazy people do exist. Possibly due to lacking empathy, immaturity, maybe anger at parents questioning their choices, or infertility struggles.

And to a greater extent, there are those people who make not having children a large part of their personality, which usually includes regular jabs about how annoying children are. Insufferable.

I'm not sure where this is going, but basically there are annoying and insensitive people. They're not representative of everyone, but they exist.

And to a greater extent, there are those people who make not having children a large part of their personality, which usually includes regular jabs about how annoying children are. Insufferable.

There are also those that make being a mother/parent a large part of their personality to the exclusion of any other interest, and comment about how anyone who has chosen not to have children must be inwardly miserable and regretful……

Well, exactly.

There was a poster (whose comments have now been deleted) who was being incredibly unpleasant about anyone who chose to be child-free. Telling them they were really miserable (but lying about it) and that they'd definitely regret it when they got older.