MIL thinks having c-section isn’t “giving birth”

[Newmum288]

Which offends me! I had a c-section. My daughter was born. She still has a birthday. If I didn’t birth her, how the heck is she here?!

YABU - a c-section isn’t “giving birth”
YANBU - a c-section is still “giving birth”

I suppose it depends if she’s being derogatory or not. I’ve had both and I don’t say I gave birth to my C-section DC because I do feel like that meaning sounds vaginally like coming out of the birthing canal. I’ll say ‘when DC was born’ or ‘when I had a c section’. It feels more like a surgery than the giving birth process. I wouldn’t take much notice unless she’s saying it’s less of a birth because it’s still not easy.

MIL is a moron.

Birth is such a tiny part of having your baby really, stupid to make out like the major surgery is a lesser way to have to go. I had 2 cs after 3 natural deliveries, women are expected to crack on either way so all hard.

Simple test. After the procedure will there be a new human being in the room?

If so, that's giving birth. It's the only way (so far) that this can happen.

Well you could always use this to your advantage rather than trying to get her to change her mind.

I always say to people yes I had an elective c section to avoid later life complications of vaginal delivery, ya know like bladder control etc

Then shut up and see what she says

Birth is defined as 'the emergence of a baby or other young from the body of its mother; the start of life as a physically separate being.'

I never get the hate some have for C-sections. I never had one, don't want one and was very glad I was lucky not to need one but its in no way an easier option.

Vaginal mothers know how hard having newborn is, imagine that after having major surgery aswell - It hardly going to be 'easier'.

I have had an appendectomy and a hernia, both far smaller than a c-section cut and both messed me up badly, I couldn't even sit up by myself.

C-sections literally save lives and are serious procedure, its not a lazy opt out option for women who just couldn't be arsed and the fact some think that show they lack basic critical thinking skills.

I was wondering when someone would make that link!

To be fair, you wouldn't have the twist without making the distinction between giving birth and being 'untimely ripp'd'.

This is how I see it.

Giving birth signals labour and contractions etc.

Don't mean I care, want to debate about the definition of 'giving birth', or am judging you.

I don't understand why anyone cares tbh, all these debates about infant feeding, sleep arrangements, SAHMs vs nursery, best age to procreate, who cares???!!?!

Giving birth is pushing a baby through the birth canal, a c-section is a delivery via c-section. Both result in a baby being born, however they are different. I would tell her that you may not have given birth naturally as they say but as a result of that your body went through more pain over a longer period of time and you have the scar to show for it.

All the CS mums saying you don’t feel like you “gave birth” - do you also don’t feel like “birth mothers” of your children? I’m genuinely asking, as I find this language topic quite fascinating, especially considering that the official definition clearly does include CS in “giving birth”.

Another cs mum here who would never say I gave birth.

she was delivered. I don’t have the experience of giving birth- her birth was something done to me, I did not give it, if that makes sense.

I agree.

Completely ignore her, she's one of those birth snobs. Also see women who say it was "easy" and people who look down on epidurals.

I've had one of each, both were hard. Childbirth takes a massive amount of strength and bravery, whichever way you do it.

She'd get on well with my first MIL, her sisters and the ex. Full on Sheila Kitzinger home birth, zero intervention, zero pain relief, it'll all happen like magic, fans. The ex (and it was the major factor in him becoming an ex within the first 6 months) deeply resented the fact that I'd deprived him of his birth experience - and when I told them what he'd said, both chimed in with 'Oh, but you didn't do anything, you just laid there'.

I was already shellshocked because the epidural hadn't taken properly so I'd felt the incision and freaked out with the pain (the anaesthetist promptly whacked in some extra drugs through my drip and the mask, so I was confused and dizzy rather than fully present) and then there was the fucked up incision site and all of the adhesions, so I still had pain twenty years later - so I spent years believing that I'd started from day one as an abject failure, compounded by DD having horrific colic despite EBF (which was also a nightmare due to my milk taking forever to come in, undiagnosed tongue tie meaning she felt like an angry parrot and because nobody realised that my reliance on dairy - ex was also a rabid vegetarian with a pathological hatred of all vegetables, beans and pulses, so it was the only protein I was able to have in the house - was causing her pain).

The ex's response to my crying about all this? 'It's hard knowing you're an incompetent mother, I suppose it's not your fault really, as the doctors scared you by saying she'd die if you went into labour, though'. My mother wasn't much better because she'd had five kids vaginally and always claimed that surgery never caused her any pain, but she at least recognised that there really wasn't any other choice.

When I eventually had my second child (with somebody else), I had a nice, easy 28 hour labour ending with a forceps delivery. Easy, you say? Yes, easy - because the bruising, episiotomy and ability to move without anything more than sitting down carefully for a couple of days was an absolute doddle compared to giving birth by section.

In short, they can all fuck off.

How to defeat anyone in an argument...
You agree with them...
Mil. You didn't give birth.
You . Yes I agree, I had a c section to save my child.

Mil. But you didn't give birth.

You. Yes I agree, I would rather have had a normal birth but thank God the doctors where skilled enough to do their job.
Mil. But it was not a normal birth.
You. I agree it was so stressful, but doesn't the safe delivery of that bundle of joy that is our baby mean so much more.
Mil. Hmm...
Repeat till you defeat her.

Maybe all those who 'haven't thought about' might read these posts and realise how much offence they are causing and think twice the next time they tell a woman she hasn't given birth.

I’m pretty sure my MIL has no idea which hole my DS exited from.

I’ve never given the difference a moments thought with mine or anyone else’s births for that matter.

Giving birth is pushing a baby through the birth canal, a c-section is a delivery via c-section. Both result in a baby being born, however they are different.

No, if a baby is born, it’s had a birth, someone must have given birth to it. It’s not the stork that delivered it! Or it’s not adopted. Method of delivery isn’t relevant.

MIL is being a moo.

If DP can't persuade her to shut up simply don't tell her when your precious bundle is born. After all, according to her you didn't give birth.

She's an idiot.

If you want to shut her up, say "I know it's not giving birth properly, but at least my vag is still nice and tight for your boy" and then wink.

Why would you be offended at someone having a different idea of the phrase 'giving birth'? Seriously?

Nobody had been unkind here. Nobody has said 'you're not a real mum, you didn't do it the real way' - or, 'you missed out on the most amazing thing'.

Obviously the woman has 'given birth' but it's not strictly what people think of when they hear that phrase. We're not all robots who adhere to the exact dictionary definitions.

I can understand where she's coming from. My first baby was by section. I had abdominal surgery. I was very sore for weeks after. I have a scar. But I didn't feel like I'd "given birth".

I had 3 vaginal deliveries afterwards and felt my recovery was much quicker.

It's a silly notion but I can see where the idea comes from. Even in obstetrics terms a section will be called a section. A vaginal delivery will be referenced as a "normal delivery".

Don't pay heed to your MIL. Through the course of your life and your baby's life you will hear a lot of other opinion and advice that will annoy you. Don't dwell on it. It's not important to your life.

Oh do fuck off.

@Maddie212

Why would you be offended at someone having a different idea of the phrase 'giving birth'? Seriously?

If you are still asking the question after reading all these explanations- then you aren't getting it.

And if you still don't get it then at least try to understand that you cause upset and offeence when you use a phrase that suggests a wonan has not given birth just because it's your 'different' idea.

It's polite to not cause offence.

Imagine telling someone to fuck for describing their own experience

I've had a few Csecs.
They cut your tummy open and ripped a baby from inside you op.
And lo your child was born.
Don't worry, you deffo gave birth!
Ignore your stupid MIL.