To not see how the gov will make any money from taxing private schools?

[AngryHedgehog]

All the other threads seem to have descended into bunfighting over the ethics of the policy, yet I'm not really understanding how this stands to benefit the government as surely they'll be footing the bill for all the kids that move to state schools?

As a disclaimer, I don't have kids and wouldn't be able to afford to privately educate them even if I did, despite earning a half decent salary.

I'm reading that it costs around £7k per pupil per term, so it would take the VAT from around four families to fund each additional child moving to state education.

Given that this may be 4/10 kids in private education moving to state schooling, I don't see how this doesn't create a net loss as there will only be 50% more kids left in private education and there needs to be multiple times that for the VAT increase to foot the bill.

Surely I'm missing something here?

Okaaaay and?

And Labour refuses to come to the table to talk to SEN parents to give us assurances.

The whole policy is ridiculous.

Leave things as they are and actually uplift state education! I would have done better in a better state school but postcode lottery and all that

It really isn’t. The policy is long overdue.

EHCPs are protected and not included in this.

Then Starmer needs to talk to SNJ and SEN parents.

Until then, SEN parents aren't going to trust Labour who have very little to say on SEN reform, apparently.

What’s so great about it if enough move to mean no extra funding?

It’s not all about the money, it’s ideological. A fairer society.

He was in sixth form so they were waived for two years max, bit disingenuous to say “many”. I also very much doubt he personally had anything to do with his school becoming private other than being a pupil so it’s a complete non story and not sure why it’s used as stick to beat him with.
I went to private school, and support VAT on fees, as do most of my peers so not sure why he can’t propose it just because he ended up at one.
At the end of the day, the tories have squandered billions of pounds in the last 14 years (£37bn on test and trace anyone?), and our public services (education included) are crumbling, so they need to increase their income. Given the cost of living affecting so many people and normal working class people are completely squeezed, income and NI rises are a non starter, this generates funds in a way that only affect those who choose it to, in that ultimately private school is optional for most people, and as others have said if you can pay £15k you can probably pay £18k (not that the full 20% will be passed on anyway with decent budgeting). What we really need is a wealth tax but that’s for a different thread.

You’ve got to wonder what a state this country is in to tax education.

Meanwhile a gang living in Bulgaria swindle £54 million out of our benefit system to live a life of luxury back home.

You couldn’t make it up. We’ll be the only country in the world to tax education of parents trying to improve their DC’s lives, meanwhile our fucking incompetent civil servants piss our tax money up the wall.

My DC are in their last year at private school, after this I might just piss off back overseas where education is valued and I only paid 15% flat rate tax.

Errr how about you ask the Tories to the table, might have been good if you’d done it the last 14 years. I am the mother of SEN children with EHCPs and frankly I’d trust anyone in th Labour Party a gazillion times more than anybody in the Tory party.

So you agree there’ll be no extra funding?

Do you mean no to the 6500 extra teachers?

At this rate there may not be anything to worry about. Starmer and Rayner are already in disagreement. What we are seeing already is Starmer trying to pull the wool over our eyes about how far left his party is.

By the time the election comes round they may be so at odds with each other, and made so many fuck ups, that they might not get in!

You seem to be very entrenched in an absolutely inaccurate understanding- private schools are NOT exempt from VAT and they cannot claim it back. State schools can claim it back. Academies do so directly, not via the LA, and they make up over 80% of state schools now.
No, I do not believe any form of fees, including at university, should be taxed because I fundamentally disagree with taxing education. I have no doubt that it is on the way though, because I think once the principle of taxing education has been established then there will be a trickle down effect as governments won’t be able to resist the lure.
I do completely agree that state schools are horribly underfunded (and have lots of other issues besides) which I have plenty of first hand experience of but I believe a policy which will actually raise money is required ( increasing income tax, for example). The country also needs to make a solemn promise to itself to never ever let the likes of Gove get anywhere near the curriculum ever again too! Unfortunately, I think many of the problems are actually a result of academy status and the adoption of Wilshaw’s approach to education but I can’t see that being rowed back now.

Only a very small proportion of children are in the private sector so I think it is probably political rather than financial. Hopefully there will be a small increase in revenues from the tax. I assume SEN places will not be charged at 20% VAT? Schools in the state sector have falling rolls and so I imagine the policy is also aiming to increase state enrolments...

Sorry but are parents of kids at state school not trying to improve their kids lives?

Private schools offer advantages beyond what most state school pupils can dream of, in theory this should go some way to levelling the playing field and giving them some much needed funding. Is there any reason why you think state school pupils shouldn’t be afforded broadly similar life chances based on the luck of their birth?

They’re not taxing education, education is free but should you choose to pay for private education. then why shouldn’t they pay VAT on that. I genuinely don’t understand why that is so controversial.

And as for pissing tax money up the wall, what about all the dubious contracts handed out by this government to their friends? I’m far more concerned by the blatant corruption to the tune of billions of those in government to make personal profits. I’ve never understood why people move to the UK then complain about it 🤷🏼‍♀️

Edited because my awful grammar was a good argument to abolish private schools!

meanwhile our fucking incompetent civil servants piss our tax money up the wall.

Bit of a blanket statement?

I'd like the Labour Party to be a lot clearer on how the ehcp exemption will work. It isn't clear at the moment and it is incredibly stressful as a parent wondering if it means that, yet again, your child will have no school place at all.

My sons school is an non maintained special school which isn't section 41. Everyone there has an ehcp. I feel fairly confident it will be exempt but not 100%.

The other group I feel for are those with ehcps at independent schools which aren't special as if those schools close because enough fee paying pupils leave due to costs, there's no school and its already been proven they couldnt have thier needs met in the state sector as the state agreed to pay for private. It's about 7000 people in this situation.

It’s a completely different thing - it’s specialist provision.
My son is bespoke for like skills - it’s not the same as private school.

They don’t. They’ve dropped that plan. Half of schools aren’t charities anyway. They’re changing the VAT position. The charitable status is entirely separate.

Its still a private school and those who have shown favour for the VAT rise, imo, don't care if the child is SEN or not.

You’re not making sense. EHCPs won’t be included. Kids in special schools will have EHCPs.

Tories aren't the ones threatening my child's education, thats why. Obviously.

And 14 years ago, I was 17. Unable to vote.

How about Labour actually EXPLAIN their nonsense policy? It ain't gonna happen.

I don’t understand why the VAT rise is an issue if the place is state funded?

😂😂😂The Tories have run Sen provision into the ground. They’ve ruined the education of every kid with SEN in the country .

And labour isn’t threatening the education of your child as EHCPs are protected

Because A) Labour are not being clear as to how the EHCPs are exempt. They won't talk to SEN parents.

And B. They could always decide its not fair and come for our kids.