To be suprised at Butlins and their lack of neurodiverse awareness?

[GreenPhlem]

have just left Butlins. Will hopefully never go back.

We were visiting with our autistic 3 year old grandaughter.

Not one mention of “autism friendly” shows anywhere. Every thing we attempted was too loud and in your face, even with ear defenders on granddaughter was struggling. You would have thought a place like Butlins would put on at least one autism friendly show a day but nope … nothing.

We took her to the tots disco last night - was meant to start at 6pm so we got there for 6pm knowing DGD will struggle to wait for something to happen … 6:05pm and nothing is happening - DGD getting restless and wants to leave. 6:10 the redcoat comes on and says the kids disco will start in about 15 minutes. No chance we could keep DGD happy for another 15 minutes so we had to leave. As we were leaving he said something about another show that would be happening at 7:30 unless the PJ masks photo shoot goes on for too long then that activity will be cancelled!! God forbid they miss out on money making photographs

Swimming - you now have to book a time slot. We booked 11am. 11:05 were still in a queue outside in the rain. When we eventually get in the changing rooms are so packed out (as everyone is going in and leaving at the same time) that DGD gets overwhelmed and shuts down. Nowhere quiet to take her … no thought to neurodiversity

Took her to soft play. I booked her into the toddler area as she would struggle being around the big loud hyper kids. I was told she was too tall for the toddler area and have to go into the big kids area. A small, timid autistic girl going into the big kids area with 10/11 year old kids flying around screaming and shouting?? Was never going to work so we left (DGD was already starting to have a meltdown as soon as she saw the chaos of the big kids area).

Is it just me or what?? Surely a place like Butlins should factor in that some kids may require a bit of reasonable adjustment?

I really feel for you @GreenPhlem our family life has been restricted loads due to having to cater for our autistic son (we have 2 NT girls too). He was only diagnosed aged 8 but for years before that we knew that were certain things we couldn’t do because he just couldn’t cope with it.
I am surprised a big outfit like Butlins hasn’t got any provision for autistic kids, but I do feel lots of companies are now understanding more about how to make simple adaptations to be more inclusive. Doesn’t help you now but hopefully will in the future.

At soft play I’d be quite upset if a larger child was running around likely to hurt my child (as you were with the older kids area) we went to one recently where an obviously over 4 child was with their sibling and bombing into the ball pit. A small child would not be able to do this. I had to quietly as a manager to move the kid to the over 3s area or my barely-walking 1 year old would get hurt. They can make exceptions, yes, but how is it fair to all the small children? In this case it is about size/ age.

I do agree it would be a good idea for them to put on ‘quiet sessions’ or ‘bigger kids in the toddler area sessions’ but this would be an extra, and you should definitely research before going. Not everywhere is going to be accessible, but lots of places are! Do some research before travelling (as I would with my toddler… not everywhere is suitable for her even without ND)

As someone who has/is raising 2 autistic dc we avoid places like this like the plague 😬. They are not autism friendly, they are a major sensory overload full of noise, people, lights etc…

I don’t think you can really expect them to have autism friendly activities, although it would be lovely if they did. We tend to go to smaller holiday sights and avoid any kind of entertainment (except Bingo because dd loves bingo 🤣). We have been to some of the smaller park Dean and haven type places and asked for a quiet caravan away from entertainment but we never go in school holidays because it’s just too busy and noisy. We only really use these places as a base and find activities elsewhere that are more autism friendly, we stay away from entertainment and often swimming pools unless we get up early and go for a swim.

YABU for going to Butlins and expecting any sort of quiet.

The ableism on this thread is disgustingly.

what’s next? Let’s not bother with wheelchair ramps because those kids also should go somewhere else?

I agree OP - so many places offer SEN friendly adaptations now. It’s really not that difficult.

Hi OP,

I'm ND with ND child. It's a whole different ballgame from the 1970s upbringing.

For ND kids, a walk in a quiet place is as much excitement as they need. No holiday, no cottage. Just a walk and some peace.

It's different, but you will get used to it.

You can probably get away with a holiday cottage in a NT property just now but there may come a time when going a way is too much and she just wants to stay home, especially if she is in school. My DC is now home school and still doesn't want to go on holiday.

'What I expect them to do is to put on at least one show a day that is neurodiverse friendly … the cinemas manage it. Less flashing lights, volume turned down etc'

Entitled nonsense.

I think it’s more like no one has faith in Butlins to do anything autism friendly. Of course places should and a lot do but when I hear the word ‘Butlins’ I think noise and sensory overload 😬. I am ND myself and there’s just some places I avoid at all costs, Butlins being one of them as well as theme parks.

Most cinemas do this once a months, not daily? I wish they did. Our local cinema does it once a month and often in a weekday which is no good for school age children.

would never take my autistic child there - we love centre Parcs as can walk in woods - quieter indoor areas and staff have great awareness.

It isn't fair on everyone else though is it. Go somewhere quiet if you want a quiet holiday!

I agree with you about the shows. You are not asking for every show to be autism friendly, but one is no big deal.
The ball poop pit is harder. If they let your child stay, they would have every parent with a slightly taller child, demand their child is also allowed in. And it would have made it unsafe for babies. It is why they do it by height rather than age as so many parent lie.
The disco not starting on time is a harder one. Places like this run on only the staff they need, so timings are always approximate. Prices would have to go up if they got enough staff to always stick to times dead on.

Have to add as well that they have the sky park which is sensory and up to the age of 12, did you go to the silent cinema op?

My DC aren't even neutodiverse but would avoid a Butlins set up because they wouldn't cope with the noise and hanging about etc.
I wouldn't cope with the noise etc to be fair either!!

It sounds like you ignored your granddaughters needs entirely when you planned and booked the holiday. If you can’t even attempt to cater to her needs, it is very odd that you expect a cheap, bog standard, profit driven enterprise like Butlins to do so.

it also doesn’t sound as if you attempted to advocate for her while you were there. Did you, at any point actually ASK for reasonable adjustments to be made for your granddaughter e.g when you were queuing? Did you even make butlins aware of her needs?

I have one kid with sound sensitivities and one with coeliac disease and you can bet your arse before I book ANYTHING I ask investigate what sort of environment I am taking them into, whether they will cope and whether there are any changes we can ask for that will help. I wouldn’t take my coeliac daughter for instance, to an all you can eat bakery and then moan that the staff hadn’t tried to cater to her needs 🫤. I wouldn’t take my sound sensitive daughter to Disneyland or a loud disco because that would be making a rod for my own back.

I think you expect too much, they are catering for the masses . You need to look for specific holidays for special needs .

You are being unreasonable to take someone autisic to Bustins. Everyone knows Butlins is super loud, flashy and chaotic. You should look into quieter holidays. Avoid shows and discos.

Sometimes it’s hard just to get the other members of your family to accommodate one person constantly, not to mind 1000s of people. I know it’s hard.

YABU. There are SO many places you could have gone that would have been suitable for her. Not all places can cater for everyone, it's up to YOU to make sure there's something she can do, not everyone else.

It butlins and it’s half term
what did you expect

Yabu to have thought that they would ever consider doing anything other than getting bums on seats/cash in wallets.

We went to butlins with older two dc when they were tiny with extended family but when we had asd dc we realised that it wasn’t suitable thank fuck. Sadly neither was flying abroad as they couldn’t be trapped with others on a plane, see also trains and buses.

You tried, it was shit. Move on. Butlins is shit anyway

I wouldn’t expect Butlins at half term to be ND friendly. If I wanted to go to Butlins then I’d pick a quiet time of year and term time in the hope that it would be very empty or just preschoolers who would hopefully go to bed earlier than my ND grand daughter.

I wouldn’t personally pick Butlins as a holiday but I think it’s good for kids who’d be bored in a quiet AirB&B, liked the noise and were hoping to play with some random kids.

My DS is NT but gets overwhelmed easily in busy, noisy environments. I think a lot of NT as well as ND kids are the same. I would not have taken him to Butlins for this reason.

I associate Butlins with extraversion in my head. simple cheap pleasures for people who like in you face brash stuff.
Even if they had a policy of making adjustments for neurodiverse customers, the overall vibe would be wrong for someone who needs calm predictability.
In your situation, I wouldn’t go there again.

I think bank holiday weekend/ half term week/ week before half term week (some schools had half term week last week and this week or have had a couple of inset days last week) is a very tricky time to visit somewhere like butlins at the best of times. It's going to be rammed, it's going to be very noisy. Just one look on the website shows this. They really are not quiet about the level of entertainment, activities and things they put on, it's one of their key selling points. Butlins is a huge holiday complex so it's easy to tell it will be busy. Perhaps middle of term time would have been better? Certainly things would have been a bit calmer as it would be similar age and younger kids than your GD and some of those would still be napping so things would be quieter and less busy. There would be a bit more staff flexibility with the soft play as well, it's likely that size is enforced when it is busy as it is a safety issue and if your GD is allowed, you know someone else will also want their DC allowed and then it becomes a free for all. If your GD is the only one in the soft play then it's different and staff would just say to move her if another child comes. As they are less busy they tend to tone down the music a bit as well as they don't need the volume vs when there are 100odd kids around. Centre parks or a smaller haven in term time may suit your GD better.