To think pronatalists are on to something?

[Carebearsonmybed]

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/article/2024/may/25/american-pronatalists-malcolm-and-simone-collins?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

I don't agree with everything this couple say or do but I do think we are approaching a demographic timebomb when the global human population starts to drop in 50 years time.

Most women probably expect to have more DCs at 20 than they end up having by 45. What can we do to get the UK birth rate to replacement rate of c 2.5 so we don't have a crisis of elderly people without enough workers to pay for or provide care and subsidence?

Honestly I thought this couple were weirder than the Quiverfull lot.

Did you actually read the article in full, OP?

We could...have a common travel area to allow neighbouring country populations to come and work...oh wait, we had that...

There's 8 billion people in the world so really we don't have a population shortage problem, we have a "everyone's too bloody worried about letting outsiders in" problem.

Up to them. But I don't want to have tons of kids, thanks.

Isn't the solution to have a sensible immigration policy?
Lots of countries have a growing population, a much younger population and plenty of people who want to work and pay taxes in the UK.

Surely over population is a significant problem? Resources being stretched and millions on the move?
I don't think a drop in the human population would be a bad thing. I don't think it's going to happen any time soon, though.

Humanity dying out would be the best thing for the planet.

Agree

Spot on.

Good god, no it wouldn’t. You’d rather just another desolate planet like all the others in the solar system?

There's 8 billion people in the world so really we don't have a population shortage problem, we have a "everyone's too bloody worried about letting outsiders in" problem

Changing the demographics of your country will change its character. Just ask the Gazans about it.

1. There's too many people on the planet as it is, we need to downsize

1. Replacement rate is 2.1

1. Elderly should have thought about that when they chucked kids out at 16/18, though cruises were more important than grandkids and chose to inflate house prices with second home ownership and landlordship to plump up the nest egg. Now use the money you accumulated to pay for care. You know, cutting the cloth accordingly and you made your bed tropes that were trotted out when grandkids were concerned.

NB: not in the slightest in favour of parenting on expense of anyone else, nursery has been lined up and no financial help expected from either grandparents here. But too often you read on here about grandparents too lazy to mind a grandchild while daughter is in labour with the next one, but expecting 24/7 care in last few years to avoid paying for carers.

Nice ageist rant, well done. Slow 👏🏻

This. Especially point number 3.

Due to house prices and crap work prospects in some areas of the UK many people of childbearing age now live a long way from their families. There are very few people with a "village" to help them. Child care is extortionate and some areas as child care deserts.

Were they interviewed direct from Gilead?

Immigration isn’t the answer, because time and again studies show that immigrants quickly match the native birth rate. Ie immigrants from cohntries like Nigeria to the uk quickly start to have 1 or 2 children. Then, you end up rapidly with the need to bring in even MORE people, who then have fewer children, and bring in even MORE. What then? If we are currently running at 700k immigrants a year, what would we end up with? 2 million a year? Not remotely feasible

I came to this thread after reading the one where the poster wanted schools to offer full time hours to help working parents. She got shot down because schools are stretched as it is.
People aren’t having kids because they can’t afford to, women don’t want to or can’t take time out of their careers, and the services just aren’t there to help. Full time Nursery costs Over £10k per year and there’s still the problem of what to do with kids after school if both parents are working.

Western society can’t expect women to have children and work, without putting the systems in place in help them. Most women will chose what works for them/their relationship.

Were they interviewed direct from Gilead?

They are atheist. Kind of a different breed of pronatalist

Yes, of course. It's quite a long read. Some of it I was 😲at and some I outright disagree with but I think it's worthwhile of discussion.

We will in 50 years. Once this current 8 billion die there won't be 8 billion to replace them (us). We are on a curve to peak population within the next few decades then a terminal decline towards extinction.

Well, the current elderly can't have their cake and eat it and no amount off shouting ageism and throwing your toys out of the pram can fix that.

Pyramid schemes don't work.

The population should be declining. It's a sign of rising living standards AS WELL AS increasing cost of living. There is simply no reason for human society to exist if we're just going to mindlessly procreate and work til death like animals.

Immigration is just kicking the can down the road.

That said, I read a think-tank piece saying that increased pay and cheaper childcare wasn't increasing childbirth rates. But they missed out the biggy IMO. More TIME.

If there were a standard 25-30h working week for EVERYONE, then working age people would be able to keep themselves healthier (exercise and better food), care for their families better (old and young).

It's absolutely ridiculous that we are working the hours we do and expected to outsource everything that just a few decades ago was done by 50% of the population.

Cut working hours. It's that simple.

The global birth rate has already dropped below replacement rate.

All professional demographers agree that the global population is on course to peak then decline.

Don't confuse that with the reality that the effects are already being felt in places like South Korea, Japan, Germany & Italy.

Dear me!