Postponing school start date for child who isn’t school ready

[rockstarjuice]

(Not summer born) AIBU to do this and how do I go about it? Really not ready for school at all: have been trying to convince myself they are but they really aren’t.

Surely as a teacher you wouldn't be judging a parent that is doing their best?
But also if there is some undiagnosed SEN wouldnt it be better that he is in school so these can be assessed and referrals ,made if need be?

You know leaving a child wet and soiled whilst waiting for a parent to come into change then is tantamount to neglect ?

OP I totally get where you coming from. DD was late to potty train, when she started reception she was still doing poos in a nappy (but she was able to control this so she never did a poo at school). We also wanted to defer her start or for the school to consider part-time. And you know what we were totally judged. We kept being told it was our anxiety & that she’d be totally fine. Anyway in reception we got an autism diagnosis privately. School were hopeless at supporting her & to cut a long story short she’s now home schooled.

I hate that Oh Crap book by the way, I hate the style & actually the author is super judgmental of parents that potty train late. Also we tried it & it didn’t work!
Similarly with the health visiting team I never found them remotely helpful, their advice was just very general. I remember talking to them about weaning DD off breast milk as she was obsessed & their advice was to give her a sip of water?! Just not going to work.

My son toilet trained at 5 in Reception. No judgement from me. Don't hold him back educationally because he isn't toiled trained. When it eventually happens and you try to settle in him school it will be so hard. Our school changes the nappies. They accepted we were trying. Pull ups on and teacher goes to the loo with him. Teach him to be able to change his pull ups.

And speak to ERIC about constipation. My son was pooing three times a day but it was still counted as constipation. Because his bowel was always full, it pressed on the nerve that gave sensation and he simply had no idea he needed to go. Imodium and another med, cleared his system out and controlled his poo. He toilet trained in weeks.

Is he in nursery? Is it one that feeds to school? Talk to them about pulling him out and take their support.

Sounds really stressful. Sorry you are going through this. Might have missed this but is he in any form of childcare/nursery?

I would speak with the school and get their thoughts on the matter. It sounds really stressful though. I understand why you're upset.

@Summerrabbit I am really grateful for your response. I do know that people DO judge - someone not saying so to your face doesn’t mean they don’t - and teachers are quite bad for this and in a very insular community that could be unpleasant for DS and his siblings.

The HV team were actually very nice but I go thinks it’s one of those things that DS just won’t do until he decides to.

I also hate Oh Crap. The tone to it is awful.

I wouldn't base your decision about going to school on toilet training. There are lots of benefits to starting alongside the rest of your peers. I'd speak to the school about how to support if he isn't toilet trained.

OP, this might not be your DC.

But my DC was the same, would wet themselves multiple times a day and demand " Dry clothes please!" (I would carry multiple changes with us everywhere!).

I packed them off to school with multiple changes, told them where they were in their bag.

Started school, miraculously no more wetting themselves...🤔🤣

Nightimes...that took a while too ...another couple of years. ----

What have nursery/preschool said about it?

I can totally understand why you feel this way, as a teacher you know that other teachers/TAs would gossip about your child and probably you. As a nursery nurse I know this happens all the time, as much as parents would like to think it doesn't.

My dc were later to train as started getting it around 3.5yo.

And yes dc1 is referred for asd and adhd assessment. And dc2 has sensory issues.

Certainly despite issues at nursery with dc1 they never mentioned sen at all. It was all naughty behaviour. So dont rely on nursery identifying anything.
In fact we got to y5 until everything imploded after an external club complained. Even though we had issues during every year group especially yr r and 1.

Is there any stimming or lack of playing together with other kids??

Even when the health vosotong team came onto school and i raised adhd they were useless despite dc1 incredobly odd behaviour when being weighed and measured. (Hid under the table in the room after a yr at school).
Basically with dc1 people knew she was different but they thought she was just difficult. They never once did any ABC to find out the cause.
So anyway you may find yourself judged even if dc os potty trained if they behave on unexpected ways.
In some ways a picture can say a lot of words. The sen dc often show in school photos, either sat with the teacher of TA or off to the side or looking away etc.

I do Find your attitude a bit weird for a teacher tbh

What advise would you give a parent who came to you saying the same what you have said here ?

‘Weird’ is a really, really juvenile response.

Given I teach 14-19 year olds, it would be a bit odd if any of them had issues with continence for one thing. And what teachers will say with their professional hat on and what they’ll say in the staff room are two very different things.

Sorry to hear it has been so tough @rockstarjuice

I would like to add that my DS was only trained recently, he was 4 and a month. I didn’t think it would take this long and actually started training him before he was 3 but he just didn’t get it. I stopped and started several times because it seemed to me that he just couldn’t tell about the sensation of needing to wee. He could hold it for a long time, I think his body might have gotten used to holding it in then not realising the need to wee.
Anyway, I’m not saying my way was best but when we did start training the last time he got it almost instantly, he could actually feel the need to go and we had hardly any accidents.

Also, is there anything about his behaviour that suggests SEN. I mean, if it is only this then it could only be a medical issue? Hope that doesn’t come across rude.

Can you elaborate on what the potty training journey has been like so far, OP? How did it begin? What methods, specifically, have you tried? How long did you try them for? What's actually been happening for the past year?

It’s not rude at all. Really polite and supportive and thank you

I honestly don’t know. I think it’s possible poo is medical. Wee - I do think that’s chosen but he never ever ever says ‘I need a wee’ or instigates a toilet visit so it left to his own devices inevitably wets himself.

There aren’t other signs of SEN - I don’t think - so I’m at a bit of a loss. And I am worried about him joining a tiny village school and constantly soiling his pants.

Saying “you don’t know” what you’ll do if it takes longer - I get this is hard, I get you are worried, but by not letting him start school when no one knows when this might be solved isn’t going to do him any favours. If there are any extra needs all it may do is just set him back even further.

You don’t want to be judged as a parent. But what about what your DS wants and needs?

Well, I doubt he particularly wants to be judged and scorned, does he?

You need to speak to the sendco about your concerns. They cannot exclude him if the situation does not change by September. If there is a developmental or medical issue this may be same come January. Have you tried speaking to gp/hv?

I know that. This is parental choice not schools.

If in pull ups then no need for endless changes

I'm losing patience with this thread. OP is clearly struggling and under pressure, but hasn't spoken to an HV since January and hasn't answered various posters asking if he's at nursery, nor what the staff there have said. Who has him whilst you work?

So it's reasonable to assume everything tried is what the OP herself is trying, whilst under pressure.

At the same time she's willing to compromise his start to formal education (because it would be, even if well intentioned) rather than speak to the school because she's worried about being judged.

If you’ve lost patience, feel free to leave it. No ones forcing you to post

It is true I last spoke to a HV in January: in the absence of magic wands, spells and witchcraft there’s nothing else they can do.

People endlessly bleating ‘is he at nursery? What have they said?’ What do you want me to say? It was actually them who begged me to put him back in pull ups 😂 they haven’t said anything other than that. I’m not sure if they are ‘supposed’ to.

What can the school do? They can’t do what I, HV and so on can’t. I know what they’ll say - to send him and they will deal with it. What they’ll say behind our backs and what will undoubtedly seep out into the classroom is different.

The fact is he is not ready. He will be in school, to be crude, regularly shitting himself (3 times today) and he will smell of shit and he will be in a class with much older children because it’s such a small school. Do you think they will be kind? Do you think their parents will be? Do you think that might impact on friendships, acceptance?

So ‘lose patience’ all you like. No one’s forcing you here so if you are ‘losing patience’ it’s your own choice.