Israel and Eurovision

[Carly944]

I've seen all the protests that Israel shouldn't have been allowed to enter the Eurovision. I don't think politics should be part of eurovision

Has everyone forgotten that a lot of countries at this stage have invaded each other, and that a lot of countries have a bloody and violent past.

The United Kingdom invaded many countries and massacred and killed many many people in the past.

Germany have obviously started two world wars.

Spain have invaded countries and done a lot of brutality to people in the past.

Should none of these countries be allowed to enter eurovision then. If we are going to put politics into it, nearly every European country would be banned from eurovision.

Israel is far from the only country in the world that have invaded and massacred people. Its awful, but it has also been awful when other countries did it. And many of them have. So I'm not sure why there was just the call for Israel to be banned

Absolutely madness that the pro Palestinian mob are still placing the blame at the door of Israel when they should be turning on Hamas, who have caused the killings of so many people. Israel have stated they will be open to negotiate a ceasefire when the terrorists have released the hostages. But of course we know that’s not going to happen, because they’ve murdered them, so there are no hostages to release. Hamas need to own up, give themselves up and be put on trial. Hamas started this war and they have the power to end it, but choose to sacrifice the people they claim to represent on the alter of self preservation.

Oh! but you're forgetting, apparently Israel deserved it. 🤦🏻‍♀️

1: Regarding post 9/11. If we'd had the amount of social media and the ease of getting live events on it as we have now I bet there would have been a shit ton more stink about the actions of the USA and Britain's involvement.
2: If Eden Golan really believed about the message of Eurovision, peace and unity, then she would become a conscientious objector and refuse to do her military service. If not, she's just another part of the propaganda machine.

The English used that excuse when invaded Australia. Terra Nullius. Land belonging to no one.
it’s just a patch of land, it doesn’t belong to anyone. Just because the people actually living there are not living like we do means that they don’t actually own or have any rights to live there. Even if they have been living on that land for 100s of years.
You have a very rose tinted view of the world.

Israel was attacked by Hamas not by Palestine. Having a sound bite knowledge of current affairs (and history) is not quite enough to make your argument on this matter reasonable.

🤷‍♀️

What I most objected to was that Israel's song was blatantly about the conflict, while noone else was allowed to mention it. If they had been made to make their song truly non-political, maybe I'd have been able to bear it.
Lyrics changed or not, it wasn't difficult to figure out.

I'm delighted that some artists did manage to get messages of peace in the final, in the end.

Israel's song was blatantly about the conflict

Don't you think it would have been a bit of an elephant in the room if it wasn't?

A song about daisies and first love and, oh I don't know, fucking guys on Grindr, or whatever floats the boat of Eurovision nowadays, might have seemed a little bit shallow in the context of rapes, tortures, mutilations, kidnappings, etc.

I loved the sentiment behind the song.

If it reminds some people of 7 October then that surely can't be a bad thing

We could also say why is Germany forgiven and allowed to enter when they caused such horrendous atrocities across Europe, hat still affect families to this day. My family ended up where they live now in europe because they had to flee nazi brutality..

How would you feel about a Eurovision that included 1937 Germany @Carly944? Would you boo them? Would you say they shouldn't be in this contest? Would you protest?

Or would you be grand with it?

Eurovisions original ( and existing apparently ) set up was to support peace and unity amongst its member countries and started in 1956

To move on from hate.

Meanwhile Eden Golan is joining the IDF!

Not such a peaceful loving person with no interest in the war after all then!

But the extraordinary thing about 7 October is that Hamas seriously fucked up. As well as terrorizing Israel, they shocked the world. Peacerful, loving people found it within themselves to consider war a necessary evil in the face of this horrror. Like this guy. I'm sure you won't bother watching it, so just to recap: he describes what it was like to be trapped in a "shelter" (ha!!!!) with Hamas continously spraying them with machine gun fire, chucking in hand grenades, etc. Seeing his friend's girlfriend shot at point blank range, seeing another girl reduced to a mess of entrails crawling across the ground to kiss her boyfriend goodbye.

Meanwhile Eden Golan is joining the IDF!
Not such a peaceful loving person with no interest in the war after all then!

Or - she’s a person who like many Israelis recognises that for her country to continue to exist it unfortunately needs to have a stronger military than most countries in the world. Due to it, y’know, being surrounded by various countries and terrorist groups that openly call for its destruction.

It’s very easy from our position in a country that doesn’t face an existential threat to handwring about the big bad IDF. But the IDF exists because of the threats that Israel faces. Could anyone on this thread honestly say they wouldn’t want the UK to have a strong military if we were in the same position as Israel?

Oh and @Carly944 just to add to that. If no one actually really owns land you should be ok with me popping over and setting up camp out the front of your place. Since it’s not really yours or your landlord or the council etc I could go on.

Yeah come on over!

Do you actually think that you're telling us something that we don't know?

Everyone and their dog knows that Hamas atracked Israel.

However it is still accurate to write "Palestine attacked israel".

For example it is written in history books like this:

"Germany invaded Poland in 1939".

People reading that are intelligent enough to know that that doesn't mean that every person in Germany invaded Poland at that time.

The same as when I write "Palestine attacked israel" , it doesn't mean that every single person in Palestine attacked israel.

None of that is acceptable.! Ever!
All murder and torture is deplorable…whoever does it!
I assume you

have followed all that’s been going in Gaza over the past months at the hands of the IDF and under the direction of Netanyahu as well. To get a balanced view.
Everything is To achieve his ultimate goal which he presented at the UN general council in September 2023! Of replacing Gaza with Israel

How about leaving babies to rot to death in incubators
Driving over and killing children hiding in cars
Bombing entire housing blocks
Refusing aid entry
Bombing and dismantling all infrastructure to sustain life
Multiple violations being investigated and confirmed as genocide.

let’s not forget the date of that UN meeting shall we.

There is an agreed ceasefire. Agreed by Hamas last week and Israel in April.

It’s time to stop the murder and destruction.

Many people on these threads however do take offence if others say
Israel bombed this…..
Posters call them anti-Semitic
So it’s acceptable only to say the Israeli Government or Netanyahu. Not Israel..

So I think therefore it’s fare to use the same consideration and say Hamas, not Palestine.

I think an aspect a lot of people don't consider is that the children of today are the fighters of tomorrow. So whilst it's entirely despicable to kill children I can see why sworn enemies attempt this ethnic cleansing to wipe out all future opposition.

That’s exactly how Netanyahu, his administrative supporters and the IDF view Palestinian children.
As future Hamas!

I didn’t realise it had been dubbed - how scary that it’s been manipulated like that.

Still doesn’t explain the seemingly high public votes though, or was that rigged too?

A strong military and intelligence system to prevent attacks, yes. I would want that if the UK faced similar threats to the ones facing Israel.

I would not want that strong military to have carte blanche to kill women, children and innocent male civilians, to bomb hospitals and kill aid workers, to starve a population and to disregard international law and to commit war crimes. Would you?

It's what Netanyahu wants.

Many of Those against Israel’s presence at the Eurovision were boycotting it.
So didn’t vote
That will affect the vote.

Some countries with a 40% vote for Israel, which is unprecedented even for Ukraine after it was invaded, is in itself proof many weren’t voting at all.

I agree OP, I also don’t understand why people think someone who is Israeli automatically agrees with everything their government is doing. When our county invaded Iraq, many of us disagreed, many Russians don’t agree with Putins war. Eurovision isn’t government ministers singing, it’s just a young girl. I find it so simplistic and divisive and frankly pointless to boo an Israeli singer

And you have to be a member of the EBU which is not restricted geographically to Europe.