To be upset by suggestion I am neurodiverse?

[RaggyDollsFan]

I went to see a psychologist privately (proper BACP-registered one before anyone asks) about birth trauma.

About 10 mins into the appointment she suddenly asked, ‘Are you neurodiverse? Has anyone ever asked you that before?’

They have not. I know she meant to be helpful as I gather there are lots of women out there for whom a late discovery of neurodiversity has been extremely positive. Suddenly their whole lives have started to make sense to them and they’ve been able to ‘connect to their tribe.’

The question came up because she’d asked whether I had a good support network and I’d said no, not really. Although I have some good friends I’ve collected over the years, they’re now very geographically scattered and at different life stages. Through having a baby I’d hoped to create a new social network locally but I’ve found this a lot harder than I expected. I’ve been disappointed with baby groups and have struggled to find others I really connect with.

Since the neurodiversity suggestion, I’ve become a bit paranoid, wondering whether it’s obvious to everyone that I’m somehow strange and different. I’m much less likely to take social risks now than I was before and overall it’s just made me more unhappy. I’m not sure where to go with this now and am genuinely confused as to whether I am ND or not. My OH asks, ‘Does it matter? Regardless, you are you and have come this far.’ Yet having a professional raise this has brought up a lot of self-doubt and upset.

The question came up because she’d asked whether I had a good support network and I’d said no, not really.

Seems a leap -as they can be other reasons for this like lots of moves - some people do seem to like to pigeon hole others though.

I actually did well at toddler groups (I'm ND) - after a couple of false starts - found a few people got on with saw them frequently became friends - so developed a support network - then DH work meant we had to move and new area I really struggled and assumed it was me. It wasn't which when I did make friends with newcomers and people who backers - turns out whole area was know to be a 'local place for local people'.

whether it’s obvious to everyone that I’m somehow strange and different

Well when I was diagnosed ND I thought it was great explained why I struggled so much why some people hated seem to hate me. Now I think some people are just rude arseholes and being so worried socially meant I tolerated more than I should have with them.

No-one surprised when they find out - but I'm not a social pariah I'm not avoided or pointed at in everyday life.

I do wonder if it's upset you as it you do have some concerns or if it's annoyed you because it's so left field and you are giving weight as she an "expert" and feel undermines your world view and life experiences because it's a poor fit.

You can try some on-line questionaries see if that helps you decide - but I'd ask why you feel like this and what a diagnosis would do for you.

Presumably it was about you though? So then she would want to look at you as a whole person wouldn't she? You can't really separate eg anxiety or depression from the rest of your life and personality.

@EsmeSusanOgg @CpOb

I am an ADHDer/PDAer and am fairly extroverted/sociable and am also very emotionally led (Myers Briggs ENFP), so don’t fit that criteria at all, even without masking! I don’t like maths/logic/numbers at all 😂.

I just want to throw this out there... Traumatic births, as well as feeling socially isolated can be very common amongst those who are in abusive relationships. And it's ridiculously common for people in abusive situations being unable to see it. You haven't said much, other than your OH response was a bit underwhelming perhaps? You suggest that you didn't have problems making friends in the past? Do you feel the professional is on the way to helping you with what you went to her for?

Your outlook is jumbled up.

Perhaps, the reason you previously felt lots of social anxiety is because you may be neurodivergent.

It’s not another layer to your social anxiety, rather it could be the explanation behind your social anxiety. And now that you know, you can potentially explore what works better for you.

But a psychiatrists' job is to treat the person in front of them - if you are neurodivergent (and I'm not saying you are) then she can't just ignore that while dealing with whatever issue you set up the appointment for.

@couldhaver Re: NHS waiting times. Are these not several years in some areas? Plus some places will not diagnose adults unless their lives are seriously impacted in some way (which I can’t claim mine is)?

I don't know if this will help OP, but I have found the worry about how people will perceive me has reduced over time. I am what I am, and hopefully my general positive demeanour will win them over in due course.

Also, I tend to be perceived (I think!) by NTs as either 'weird but nice' or 'nice but weird'. I prefer the first one, as the final word in the phrase is, to me, the prevailing sentiment. So it's possible that people can find you a bit weird but like you anyway (my friends assure me this is so)!

You should direct these questions to your GP.

I think it depends on the rest of the conversation, my initial thought was she was just gathering background information and trying to get a fuller picture of who you are and asking if you have a diagnosis, so she can adapt her practice, or possibly redirect you to someone that can support you fully. Not necessarily offering you a diagnosis, that she won’t be qualified to do anyway.

OP all those things sound exactly like my birth and post-natal experience. I didn’t know anyone and it was all so bloody hard. Looking back I think I probably had post-natal depression exacerbated by a difficult time feeding, some not very nice midwives at the hospital, and being incredibly lonely and isolated. I felt a bit weird and different and became insular. Once I’d found some proper friends I started to gain my confidence again and now I’m out and about all the time. I do think keep going out even if it is hard, you’ll eventually click with some people.

I find it quite strange that you were interrupted to be asked if you were neurodiverse. Of course it is not an insult but it seems a strange approach for a professional to ask of a fairly normal sort of experience (for a new mum living somewhere without an established support network). Also, you have not said what happened at the birth but birth trauma can be a thing for any woman.

My DD is seeing CAMHS right now. They want her to be tested as they suspect AuADHD.

The person speaking to my DD (I was there the whole time) said I am probably autistic too. She is the third person to tell me this.

The first being a friend who is a specialist in the area.

I've done that test linked above and scored 28 out of 50.

You know what? I don't give a shiny shit. I am who I am and I like me.

I've a good job, I've a wonderful family and exceptional DH. I have good friends who know my foibles and tolerate them. (I'm obsessed with Star Trek, feminism and the environment - my special interests 😆) I volunteer lots and I push myself out of my comfort zone all the time.

Don't let it matter to you. Just keep being you. If there are things that get in the way - find coping strategies. I've spent my whole life doing that (before I knew it was likely I am ND).

Every friend I've told "I'm probably autistic" has said "well, we suspected, so what and we love you as you are"

I don't buy into all this super power nonsense. It probably is for some people. For me it's a set of quirks I adapt to and around.

Honestly. Keep being you and try not to worry or be paranoid.

I was meant to be seeing her about birth trauma which is quite specific.

What diagnosis are you thinking of pursuing? "Neurodivergent" isn't a condition; it covers loads of people with varying symptoms and levels of divergence from the norm. I don't think it's a very helpful or well-defined term at all, as proven by this thread!

It's tricky because - as someone late diagnosed, I have massive feelings of "Why did nobody pick up on this when I was younger??" so for me, I suppose, it's been such a giant relief to be diagnosed and understand I'm not actually broken, I've just been trying to fit into a mould that is the wrong shape/size, I had been metaphorically shouting into the void for years "What is wrong with me??" so it was quite nice to actually get a useful answer to that.

I don't know what exactly your psychologist was picking up on (you could always ask her, if you want to) but for example, not managing to wash my hair and generally looking a mess was definitely something I struggled with (with unmanaged ADHD) and I perceive (perhaps wrongly) that non-ADHD people don't have that problem, perhaps unless they are depressed or have some kind of chronic illness affecting mobility/energy/pain levels. As in, the idea of not managing to wash your hair is a completely alien idea to most people, because they find hair washing to be a very easy thing to do. (This is not a criticism of you, it's just an observation I've made).

Being on the outside of groups - I've always had this too - but I am totally oblivious honestly to whether this is an ND thing or whethet this is just a normal thing when you're entering into a totally new social circle. I know that so many new mothers feel alone and isolated, so you're certainly not alone or unusual to feel that way, and feeling that way does not necessarily mean that you're coming across as "weird" - it's just a very strange and isolating time of life, most people you come into contact with are sleep deprived, hormonal and adjusting to a new life so typically aren't at their best either and you sort of need some kind of external structure to push you all past the social barriers of "Oh yes fine thanks you?" into opening up and really trusting each other. It's weird because normally, to develop the kind of intimacy where you share more personal/honest responses, you need time, but when you have a new baby you have so much you need to process and discuss right now, and you have only known this person a few weeks, so that intimacy hasn't had time to develop.

You can't say this and not come back and elaborate! Please do! :) Or link the thread?

IMO it's the fact she asked you outright.
I've had lots of algorithms suggest ADHD and autism to myself so a gradual penny dropping of u like.
I thought my anxiety was just that and thinking outside the box was good.
I never realised I could be nerodivergent.
Makes sense if I am.

God, lucky you if it's just a set of quirks! I find it more of a full body and brain feeling of "I'm not right for this world and i can't stand it" along with a lot of pain and suffering.

I guess it was a "super power" at school when I was doing faultless maths and spelling tests, but in adult life it's pretty miserable and limiting.

Honestly this is becoming a common experience. In my family/extended family we've had recent diagnoses of ASD in our kids. And it's become obvious that there are quite a few undiagnosed adults (their parents) as well. Some are seeking diagnoses because it's helping them understand and address their mental health better (chronic anxiety not responding to typical treatments) and others are comfortable enough as they are like @TheDefiant above. I guess it depends how challenging life is and how comfortable it feels.

OP you were traumatised (hence the appointment) and probably experiencing anxiety and depression - I'm sure after a 10 minute chat how you displayed to her could be interpreted as any of those things, including neurodiversity! I don't think she was right to make that comment, and after such a short time with you. Different if you'd asked her about it.

I suppose I had a lot of social anxiety already. I’d come to really hate going to baby groups but have been pushing myself to keep going anyway as I know it’s not good to be isolated at home. I so often feel like I don’t fit in that well, that there are cliques I am not a part of and fear the others judging me - for my baby being unsettled, for the disaster that was her birth, for not having managed to wash my hair as often as I’d like and generally looking a mess, etc.

It may well be ND driving the social anxiety - or it may not.

With pfb first 4 groups were awful unfriendly and made me feel a lot worse- HV group and anti natal DH came along to and said I wasn't imagining it. . Then was given leaflet with number for local groups - way out of date and people weren't nice. Did find one only went back as leader spoke to me - only person who did - but few week later some other mothers with older babies joined and that was it.

When we moved - I had similar disheartening experiences till a random walk we found a new children center and again slowly met few other mothers and then went to other groups.

I actually think they can be some of the hardest environment to walk into - many posters on here gave up entirely on them.

This has just made it so much worse by adding the worry of, ‘Oh heavens, do I also just come across as weird? Am I missing social cues in the way that autistic people do? Are they all thinking I’m massively lacking in social skills and pitying and/or laughing at me behind my back?! I just want to go home.’
If you met 2 of my 3 Autistic kids you wouldn't have a clue they were Autistic. The 3rd might miss cues and not be great with social skills but everyone loves him and he has a lot of friends. None of them come across as weird. You've probably met a lot more Autistic people than you realise because these BS stereotypes are just that. A psychologist isnt thinking this when she asks if you might be ND and if you are Autistic naming that doesn't make any difference to who you are or mean you fit these stereotypes.

eta: its not unusual for Autistic women in particular who mask well to end up with diagnosises like GAD, social anxiety, OCD, BPD when they're actually ND.

Yes it is. But how you respond to situations and what aspects of it caused the trauma would be very specific to you. No two people would respond in the same way. It may be that there were elements of the traumatic experience that you would look for in an ND person that you wouldn't in an NT person, like maybe the communication aspects would be especially difficult and something to focus on if you're doing EMDR or whatever. I'm not an expert on this stuff at all but a trauma response is going to involve the whole person. It doesn't mean actually this isn't trauma it's a neurodiversity.

To those who have asked about the AQ test…

My score is right on the cusp. However I find a lot of it contextual. Particularly the statements like, ‘I enjoy social occasions,’ ‘I am good at social chitchat,’ etc. A couple of years ago I would have answered yes to these questions without much thought. Most of my social contact then was through work and with colleagues or clients. I was pretty confident at what I did which gave me confidence generally I suppose. Plus I work in a field which tends to attract people with a similar outlook so we often had a fair bit in common. The best friends I’ve ever had (the ones who are now geographically scattered and at different life stages) are those I trained with plus a few I’ve met at conferences.

Now, as a new mother, my answer would be a clear no. I dread small talk. So many parenting topics feel like such an emotional hotbed I’d rather avoid. ‘How is she sleeping?’ ‘Are you planning to sleep train?’ ‘Are you still breastfeeding?’ ‘How was the birth?’ I think I was naive and overestimated how much I’d have in common with the other mothers I met just because our babies were born at the same time.

So I’m not sure how indicative my answers actually are of neurodivergence.