Not coping with adult child being back home

[movienights]

Ds has moved back home after 3 years living with his ex.
He's 25 and he does absolutely nothing around the house or garden, if he's asked to do something he'll do such a poor job that it will need doing again, he can't wash up properly and leaves frying pans and pots grease stained and dirty so dh or I have now said leave the washing up so we can do it properly, the washing up he accumulates is only his packed lunch he cooks salmon or chops to take and rice or potatoes late at night so we have to wake up and clean up.
I cook his main meal with the family which I'm happy to do as I would anyway and one more portion is nothing.
He has all his washing done for him because he's so heavy handed with the buttons and broke the last machine, he peels his clothes off and puts them in the laundry basket inside out, even socks, he treads down so hard on the pedal bin we're on about our 3rd this year, he's broken the front and back door and his bedroom door just by being heavy handed yanking the handle, he leaves the bathroom soaked through every day and his towel on the floor because no amount of asking him to open window sinks in, he leaves black marks all over the house from his dirty hands, (he works in a filthy factory) it cleans off but is extra work, he makes so much mess and work for me and does nothing, or puts such little effort into reluctantly doing what's asked that I have to do it again anyway.
He has no life outside of work, no friends and no hobbies never leaves the house which he seems happy with, he works the same hours as us so is in his room all night every night a thin wall away so our sex life has nose dived.

He's now informed us he's going to go back to college and then do an apprenticeship after, which I admire anyone who wants to better themselves but this just screams I'm not going anywhere anytime soon.
He lies to us constantly, he's also very unsociable and keeps his life very private so even having a conversation or exchanging pleasantries is awkward because he doesn't like questions so even how was your day is a one word answer so not to give anything away.
I make allowances for him because he is possibly autistic or has ADHD but refuses to get assessed as he feels he's just the way he is and doesn't want a diagnosis or medication.

I am I constantly arguing with dh about something else he's done because dh moans to me as ds won't be spoken to about anything, it's like living with a teenager who just storms off at the first sign of criticism or he'll shout and argue back and then nothing changes except the atmosphere.

I feel completely snowed under with the situation, our marriage is at breaking point and there's nothing I can do about it because he's likely going to be here for the foreseeable future if not forever.

You need to take back control OP and insist on considerate cohabiting behaviour. I'm assuming his GF didn't tolerate this for three full years? So presumably he has lowered his game for you, and needs to up it again.
He does the washing up badly, get him to do it again. He refuses? Clean stuff for you and DH and let him use the products of his own incompetence. He breaks something, you get him to pay for it to be replaced. He leaves dirty marks, you tell him to clean up.
I'm sure he will be sullen and hostile, but unless you're actually frightened of him (which is a different thread) then you need to stand your ground. There's two of you, it's your house, take back control.
If all else fails you can ask him to leave. But personally I'd do that as a last resort. It's not easy breaking up with a partner, especially when you have no friends or social life, and it can be easy to spiral into a dangerous depression. So in your shoes I'd prefer to have him close while he got going in his new career and got his life on track. But only with improved behaviour.

he has two parents and yes agree should be BOTH parents should show him but we dont know what parenting was done - all we can go by is what the OP is saying and as it is only her point of view coming across with no mention on what father says or if he has tried to do anything or if its another story where OP is a martyr and does everything
Either way what every Parenting was done - the son is useless lazy fucker

And what about the father?

The father does have concerns but apparently only about his lack of privacy and sex life.

He needs to leave.

And I expect that's what his ex-girlfriend told him too.

Seriously - you need to have the shape-up-or-ship-out conversation with him. And mean it. Although, since he "won't be spoken to about anything, it's like living with a teenager who just storms off at the first sign of criticism or he'll shout and argue back and then nothing changes except the atmosphere" it'spropably pointless and best to just skip straight to 'you need to move out, you have one month to find somewhere else and there will be no extension to this deadline' conversation.

Yes he needs to leave, he's an adult and can't act like a child and expect to be treated like one.

He rents his own house and if he wants to go back to education or an apprenticeship he funds it himself whilst renting a room somewhere

Or you put your foot down, he pays for a cleaner for the house, if he breaks something, bin, washing machine he pays for a replacement. He washers chores, does his own washing and gives you space on your own home

You have choices here.

• 3 months with you with a list of conditions - pays rent, washes dishes nightly, mows the lawn, takes the bins out, does his own laundry one day a week.
• Next - flat share/bed sit whatever.

Time for him to grow up!

You need to be really clear with him about what is annoying you. Have you told him he is leaving black marks everywhere and needs to wipe them? That he needs to wash up at night? Etc I know it’s sounds obvious but my DH is a bit like this, he’s heavy handed and leaves marks everywhere as he’s a gardener with strong hands, I tell him gently each time he does something wrong and he apologises and says he’ll fix it/clean it/buys me a knew one and be more careful. The important distinction is I don’t nag him or approach the subject aggressively.

Your son may be depressed after his breakup and moving back home as an adult with no friends outside of work. The last thing he’ll want is his parents attacking him too but he does need guidance.

I lived back with my parents briefly in my early 20s and my mum did all the cooking as she always had and all the washing and cleaning and never expected me to do anything.
She was my mum and she treated me like a guest and was pleased to have me back for a while.
I never ended up lazy and unable to take care of myself for it.

Possibly not! Apologies.

@movienights do you have other children?

I’m not one for kicking adult kids out if they need you but I would not be putting up with this shit. He’s an adult. If the dishes aren’t washed properly he does them again. If he doesn’t pick his towel up call him back to do it every time, or better, leave it on his bed. If he breaks something he pays to replace it. He hasn’t just developed these habits surely? Start holding him accountable.

Tell him it is not working out as things are, his behaviour and attitude need to change or alternative arrangements will need to be made.

How is he going to fund his apprenticeship and college etc? is he giving up work?

If he is not willing to open bathroom windows, keep his dirt to himself, which is general respect - then he can't be shown the respect back and live in the house

I know this is harsh and not what you need right now - but you were the one who raised him.

Have you always done his washing? Cooking? Always picked up after him?

This is what my DP was like when we first met and I nearly left him. His mother openly (and proudly) admits that growing up he never lifted a finger.

I'd refuse to do his washing and leave it to pile up (in his room)
He'll soon do it when he runs out of underwear.
I'd ban him from using anything that he leaves broken/dirty.
If he's not prepared to clean it he doesn't use it including the toilet, the shower and the kitchen.
If he can't master the washing machine, direct him to a launderette.
If he still can't master washing up he can buy food in packets for lunch like sausage rolls and pasty's.
He may eventually find it's easier to move out.

Tell him he needs to find a room elsewhere; give him an end date.

It's pretty clear why his relationship broke up, frankly. No one is that 'hopeless' / 'destructive' / 'forgetful' etc accidentally all the time. He just doesn't give a shit and doesn't want to be asked to do anything.

This is my brother - he’s 28. He is frankly, an entitled piece of shit with no sense of accountability. He was also babied beyond belief up until very recently and truly felt he could behave with a ‘fuck you’ attitude and still have everything done for him. Because that was what happened. He had his meals cooked, washing done, shirts ironed, bathroom cleaned etc whilst he treated his room like a personal dumping ground, smoked weed in the house and grunted whenever anyone tried to engage with him. It escalated to the point where he didn’t see why he should spend his money on things he needed, and acted entitled to my parent’s money for that too. My parents are retired and he works full-time (from home) on a £40k plus salary whilst paying no rent and not contributing to any food.

My mum has accepted that he is a failed adult, no woman will ever have him and she regrets not being harder on him.

He was always someone who was going to take the piss but had it been pushed back on consistently, and had he faced actual consequences and a dose of real life I don’t feel it would have reached the stage it has.

You are doing your DS no favours by accommodating his pathetic attitude. My brother is a hermit, no social skills, very few friends, very few prospects for any future relationship happiness. Do something about this before it’s too late.

Tell him (not ask) him to go and find lodgings or a flat a.s.a.p.

Kill two birds with one stone…..start having regular very loud sex…..and you may find he moves out quite quickly!!

I don't know if I missed this, is dh the father of the Op's son ?

Haven’t you posted about this before and the responses you got were very much along the lines of you really not seeming to like him?!

It’s very sad for the young man that he has little idea how to look after himself at age 25 and continues to wreck the house because of his heavy handedness.
It’s now become an even more difficult problem for you to have to help him with.

I really think it would be a good idea to take on one challenge at a time and break the tasks down into small steps. Start at the bottom of the step ladder, with the easiest bit, demonstrating how you want it done and only move up a step once he consistently gets it right.

It’s possible that you thought that him moving out the first time would teach him all he needs to know to live well, - by some kind of automatic, magic process of metamorphosis into a life skilled, competent man. Or that his gf or flat mate would shame him into competency. But that doesn’t work with some SEN people and I think as his parents, you might want to give him a last chance …and start again with helping him learn life skills properly.

If you ask him to leave he simply won’t as he doesn’t know how to.
If you organise his leaving for him, he will still fail at practical life anyway and be back.
So really, what choice do you have if you care about him, but to persist in an orderly way that allows you to see the extent of his problem and get outside help or allows you to see progress towards independent living.

If he refuses to engage or to attempt to help himself, or becomes aggressive, then at least you will have given it your best shot before showing him the door. He will then have to learn to live with his own filthy, unhygienic habits.
You sound as of you could be ready to skip to that stage already?

So, if you can face it, make a list of problems he causes you in every day life.
Then break the problems down into smaller tasks that he can be taught to overcome. Start with hand washing … and the rule that he washes his hands as soon as he enters the house.

But before you start on the actual tasks, prepare him first for what’s about to happen. Tell him what he will be learning in order to live decently.
Spell it out to him, in writing that this is his last chance to engage with you in helping himself gain practical life skills and he must engage with you both. Also spell out to him in writing the consequences of never learning how to look after himself properly. And that he must pay for his door to be mended, pay for the broken bin etc and pay rent and bills. (By the way, don’t keep buying the same flimsy pedal bin …make him buy one that is more sturdy that can’t be broken and make him use that one rather than the pedal bin which he repeatedly breaks)

Life admin is also a task he needs to learn which you could help with.
Once you’ve got him sorted, maybe you will all be happier.
Only you know if it’s worth the effort of really trying to help him, or not.

As for sex, either do it quietly, or get creative or play loud music or plan together to grab an hour or two during the day when he’s at work. I’m a bit astonished that you have to ask.

When he messes something up, make him go back and do it again. If he won't, and it is moveable, put it on his bed. If he breaks something, get it replaced or repaired and then charge him for it.
He is doing these things because there is no consequences for his actions. He will either move out or wise up.
Of course, he will try and argue with you or intimidate you and that is when you stand your ground and your partner better back you up.

Your son bullies you. He has a job so give him 30 days to move out and mean it. You may help him look for the right fit so he doesn’t end up back there with you but move him out!

You do realise that you raised him to be like this right?

Throw some ear defenders at him and say “Just because you’re single, doesn’t mean we are. Tonight is date night, I suggest you wear these!” It might solve a problem or 2. He either goes out or moves out.