To think I'm absolute shit at raising girls?

[Mastmw7g]

My oldest daughter was such a challenge. We have a good relationship now, but I still upset her easily if I'm not careful what I say. My youngest daughter is only 10 and regularly tells me she wants to move in with her nan, who she says is like a real mother unlike me. I protested that I wasn't even doing anything and she started listing off the things I was doing: sitting, breathing, existing, growing hair, making blood cells. She tried to call her nan after that and she didn't feel up to a call and my FIL said to call tomorrow. The door was open so I popped my head in and said I was sorry her call hadn't gone how she wanted. She replied "Why are you in my room without permission?" DH asked what I did to her. I don't know! I'm trying, but I must be doing it wrong. My boys are so easy.

Boys are much easier than girls. It's not you, it's them! They will get over it.

I dunno, my 9YO DS can be a stroppy git like this sometimes. He likes his dad better and my existence is an embarrassment to humanity it seems.

in my experience girls are awful from around 12-18 particularly to mothers. mine were horrible to me - i can (almost) smile about it now. they are now 26 and 28 and are wonderful. the eldest rings me every week and is on the phone for at least a hour and half. i think she said 2 sentences to me a week maximum during her teenage years. it’s not you it’s them. and they will come back to you - pretty much guarantee it. be strong!

Just ignore her. You obviously have rude DD. At 10, she’s old enough to know better. She needs her nan to sit her down and tell her to be pleasant. Good that she knows some biology though. Take that as a win. I would start by finding out what she really wants. She’s obviously starting puberty so you’ve got years of this. Do others like her? Or do others ignore her too? Draw up a contract. You do x and she agrees to y.

She replied "Why are you in my room without permission?"

"Because it's my house, I do not need your permission or anyone else's, and you will watch your tongue."

Realise this unlikely to help. But would be sorely tempting.

Saying that the call didn't go as planned - even if you meant well - sounds like you're being sarcastic.
Do you speak quite bluntly as a general rule? Maybe it's coming off as harsh to your more sensitive children.

There's a brilliant book called Untangled by Lisa Damour - you might like me read it having several "aha" moments

My DS became like this when he turned 12. He’s only 13 so no end in sight yet 😂. I hope he comes back to me when he’s older too!

Why are you pussyfooting around her? Why did you say “I’m not doing anything” in response to her saying you’re not like a real mum and her nan is? Why not ask her what she means by that? Same for her saying about her bedroom- tell her it’s your house and she can start treating you with respect. Communication needs two-way effort and respect and it sounds like yours is badly lacking. Be more assertive but also speak to her and find out what is important to her and what she wants.

Exactly, nip rudeness in the bud straight away. Hormones are not an excuse for being an arrogant, rude little madam. Yes, I had a daughter, too, now in her 30s.

My MIL would never hint she wasn't pleasant. DD tells her she wishes she lived with her and the answer is always that MIL would love that, too. DD has a the beginnings of a social life. I like her and can see the qualities that make her likable. I just keep saying the wrong thing.

Relax, stop trying to say the right thing, just be you, be the best parent you can be. Try to understand her, but don’t fall for her nonsense, you are her parent not her best friend.

Try not to rise to it, I'm off go nanas, oh ok then I'll miss you , (get nana on board to tell her to be polite to you and back you up) if she says you annoy her, just say well I think you are great. But do not tolerate rudeness, but stay calm and don't say anything hurtful to her. Obviously she's testing her boundaries and would only be able to do that in a safe space , so ride through it, keep offering for her to do things with you but if she refuses just say ok and walk away.

I just cannot get my head around why people allow children to speak to them like this.

Why are you in my room without my permission is breathtakingly rude. In this house it would have prompted a stern warning about watching your tone and an equally stern reminder that I will not be spoken to like that - and if an (unprompted) apology was not quickly forthcoming there'd have been a follow up punishment.

If you allow your dc to speak to you and treat you like shit from a young age, the behaviour is reinforced and normalised - the fallout of that's on you.

I wasn't sarcastic. My husband didn't think it sounded sarcastic, either. He thought I must have done something because of the response. I don't think I'm blunt, but I could be.

It sounds like your daughter lacks respect for you and is trying on pushing boundaries.
You and your husband need to firmly explain to her that it's not on, and she is not to be rude to you again.

DD tells her she wishes she lived with her and the answer is always that MIL would love that, too

You MIL is a big problem here.

The only appropriate response to this is 'Oh that's nice of you to say! You have a lovely home with mum and dad though, that's your family home where you belong' or similar.

If I found out my MIL had told any of my dc she'd love them to live with her I would step on that HARD and quickly and if there was any pushback from the relative then contact from that point would be reduced and always supervised. It's wholly inappropriate and damaging to a young child.

I just cannot get my head around why people allow children to speak to them like this.

I know. Why are some parents so….timid?

I have 4 dds and the eldest was difficult, and the youngest seems to be heading the same way. Yes hormones have a lot to answer for but I wouldn't tolerate rudeness like that op. Assuming you are a reasonable person that doesn't make unreasonable demands of your dc then you are entitled to a modicum of respect and you should insist on it. I would always knock as a courtesy before I went into their rooms but I also maintained that this was their space in my house. I found the only thing that worked with my dds was removal of their phones/the Internet if they were rude or wouldn't do their homework or whatever. Teenage years can be difficult for everyone, and dc need to learn their limits. You need to think about what behaviour is acceptable to you, what expectations you won't compromise on, and what stuff you can let go. She needs to know that you love her and you absolutely have her back, but you expect a certain amount of respect in return. Its not going to be easy, but believe in yourself, and that this too shall pass. Good luck.

I see this differently. I think its great of MIL to let her know she would be welcome there.
When I was early teens I moved out briefly after a huge row with my mum. Everything she did irritated me and we didnt get along at all. I packed my stuff and left. Luckily I went to my grandmas house and stayed with her about 10mins from home. I went back after a few weeks voluntarily and my mum or my grandma never made it an issue.
This short break from each other made a huge difference in our relationship. It was still difficult until i moved out later, but much better than before.
I dont know what would have happened if i didnt have my grandma to go to.

I have a wonderful relationship with my parents now. We live very close and see each other several times a week, holiday together etc. No issues at all. I cant believe teenage me was such a cow. But Im glad my mum left me too it and was patient and i had a safe place to go.

Your daughter is throwing her weight around and trying to provoke you to get a reaction. She's doing it because you're so afraid of upsetting her that you pussyfoot around her and don't establish firm boundaries.

I don't think your comment about the phone call sounds like it was sarcastic.
I suspect it was more placatory and submissive. She is pushing and trying to upset you in order to test where your limit is (even if she doesn't realise that's what she's doing), but she can't find it your limit, because it sounds like you just try and appease her whatever she does. Kids need boundaries to feel secure.

My MIL wouldn't ever correct her like that. But I don't think I should be depending on outside sources anyway.. I can walk away in response to rudeness, but I don't think I can correct her behavior if I'm also avoiding being hurtful. She was hurt last week because I said something about how she was treating one of her brothers. I was careful how I put my words together and she still became very upset and refused to talk to me afterwards.

Agreed. Timid is the last thing I am. I have no idea why some parents tolerate this rudeness from their DC. You don’t have to scream and shout at them - but you do need to speak firmly to them and insist on respect. No respect? No allowance, no treats, no lifts.

I think you need to stop agonising about how you’re speaking to her. Clearly, she’s going strop whatever you say. So if she needs a telling off, give her one. She’s walking all over you!

And it sounds like your DH needs to have a word with his mum.

This. You’re on the back foot all the time and she knows it. She’s testing you and you’re not pushing back. You need to parent her firmly. She needs to learn that she is not in charge. No child should be in charge of the house.