to ask your thoughts on this? Fatal shooting during burglary

[itsjustataste]

Happened near me very recently and our community seems very torn with lots of people slinging insults at both sides. Lots of people shouting about playing stupid games, win stupid prizes etc... whilst others calling the shooter a murderer.

I find it very sad that someone so young has ultimately lost their life and has got mixed up in this sort of thing.

BUT that being said, I don't have any ill feeling toward the farmer either and cannot say that I wouldn't do the same if faced with 3 people breaking into my home, especially if I had my children in the house.

The other 2 suspects arrested for aggravated burglary meaning a weapon was involved and there had been a break in at the same home the night previously too.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-68942085.amp

You’ll have to have a word with the Duke of Devonshire then, he seems to think his house is in the Peak District

I hope for his sake that he didn't have the gun out waiting for them to come back, because it will be harder to prove he didn't just act impulsively in self-defence. It's the whole point of gun control laws in this country - you have to abide with the rules about keeping them locked up.

But yes, let's agree to disagree. I have sympathy for the farmer but you can't just gun people down and expect no consequences, regardless of the circumstances.

I’m with the farmer. Violating a person’s home (multiple times) is horrific and terrifying. We have normalised burglary in this country to a frightening degree. Sorry a boy died, and for his family, but if you attack someone’s sacrosant safety, expect them to retaliate.

Likewise, if you take someone's life, expect consequences.

Unless it was self defence

He wasn’t a boy he was an adult

Your friend's penchant for domestic violence seems somewhat irrelevant to this topic.

I don't suppose the farmer intended to kill. It's difficult to shoot precisely with a shotgun.
A burglary victim, in a state of fear and alarm,perhaps with a family to protect, cannot be responsible for the actions he takes.
Are the burglars armed and intent on harm, are they intent on rape,or willing to be violent to get to what they came for? That farmer cannot know what the burglars intend. He can find out after he has brought them down.

But even with self-defence you have to go to court to prove that's what it was – going on trial is therefore the consequence. The reactions on this thread are basically that the farmer should be given a medal and it's wrong to even arrest and question him. I think that's wrong. He took a life, the police have to investigate.

The only sympathy i have lies with the farmer. The three lads made choices, they were wrong un's. You don't enter someone's house in the middle of the night by mistake, they went to rob and possibly harm. I hope the two that are still alive are jailed for a long time, as for the one that is dead, that is his own fault.

I think it's sickening that people aren't allowed to protect themselves (and yes, their hard-earned property) without fear of having their lives ruined as a consequence. Yes, we should investigate afterwards to be certain it is what it looks like, but if someone breaks into your home you have every reason to be fearful and shouldn't be punished for defending yourself.

Maybe the burglar isn't intending violence, but the innocent person being burgled has no way of knowing that and shouldn't be expected to risk their safety to ascertain the burglar's plans. These decisions are made in a split second, in moments of chaos, and as the burglar is the cause of the situation, I won't shed a tear if they pay the price for their stupidity. It's wrong that the true victim (the person forced to decide whether/how to defend themselves) may be victimised again by the law.

I’m with the farmer.

What about armed burglars

Would you deem them a threat

Arresting the farmer for murder seems wrong.
Manslaughter seems more appropriate.
Ultimately the farmer will have to prove it was self defence.

If someone breaks into your property, armed, we have to be able to defend ourselves and if in so doing someone comes to harm then it’s self defence.
It could just as easily be the farmer or his family that are injured or killed.

The farmer was outnumbered by people in his property with weapons. He should not be found guilty of anything assuming ( as a PP noted ) he didn’t shoot them in the back running away.

My support is with the farmer, like it was with Tony Martin.

What’s really strange is if that armed burglar hadn’t ended up dead, the police wouldn’t be doing anything, save handing out a crime number to the farmer

The thieves could walk off with anything they wanted knowing the police arent going to do anything
The farmer and his family will have had their peace of mind wrecked and paying higher insurance premiums for years to come and the thief would carry on as usual.

Agree
But it’s not strange, it’s a disgrace.
Burglaries should be investigated and burglars should be jailed.

But even with self-defence you have to go to court to prove that's what it was – going on trial is therefore the consequence

Not necessarily. The CPS may look at the evidence and decide not to prosecute.

With the farmer.

Has that been confirmed, that he definitely tried to burgle the farm the night before?

A burglary was reported the afternoon before, not sure if that is when it was discovered or when it happened ?
Do we know for certain that the man who shot the burglar lived at the farm or if he lived elsewhere ?

I don’t think Richard Osborne Brooks ever went to court for killing violent burglar, Henry Vincent, did he?

I’m with the farmer also.

These scum bags don’t have an ounce of sympathy for the lives they ruin with their crimes. So I don’t have an ounce of sympathy for a scum bag dying on the job.

I'd be surprised if that happens - regardless of the circumstances, a life has been taken. It'll come down to whether they think the farmer used reasonable or excessive force for the situation he thought he was in.

Team Farmer all the way.

People willing to break in ( ARMED!) in a gang of three deserve all they get.

In USA he’d be classed as a hero.