I really don’t think I ABU but everyone thinks otherwise - AIBU?

[Treaclescourer]

I am quite used to always being seen as ‘at fault’ in my family but I am genuinely starting to think maybe I am being unreasonable here so wanted to get external opinions. It’s long so I apologize but I’d really appreciate any input.

backstory -
my brother has ASD (an Asperger’s diagnosis when that was still a thing) and although is very ‘high functioning’ is prone to being selfish, devoid of any empathy and at times violent.

My entire childhood revolved around him, and making sure he wasn’t overwhelmed due to the violent outbursts that would occur.

As he has gotten older the violence has started to become less frequent, but since being with my DH (11 years) he has witnessed 2-3 violent incidents from my brother towards me which has made DH not like my brother at all. He has ASD himself and because he isn’t violent doesn’t think my brother’s diagnosis is an excuse for that behavior. So I try to keep them separate, DH is polite and civil when around my brother but doesn’t enjoy spending time with him (although he does a very good job of masking it, as my brother is under the impression that he and DH are cool)

My brother lives 3 hours drive away from me.

(this is relevant) - additionally 8 years ago my father moved abroad for work and comes back to the UK every 2 years.

Now onto the issue at hand.

In November last year I was told my father was going to come back to the UK to visit for 3 weeks. This would be the first trip back since I had my DS. So it would be his first chance to meet his grandson. He was due to spend 2 weeks with my brother and one week with me.

DHs birthday is also in November and we had planned a city break for a long weekend. The city was about 40 mins away from where my brother lives. So I spoke to DH and said since we had limited time with my father I was thinking about making a detour to have maybe a nice lunch with my brother and dad on the way to the city break. To maximize the time as a family. He said of course as he also misses my dad (they have a great relationship) and wanted DS to get as much time with him as possible. I also hadn’t seen my brother for a few months at this point (as he won’t get a bus or coach to come and see us due to anxiety, and I had a newborn so wasn’t in the mood for 6 hour round trips)

Spoke to my brother, he was excited to see us all, great.

Unfortunately dad had to pull out of the trip due to medical issues a month before coming back. As that would just then leave the afternoon as just me, my brother, DH and DS I cancelled the detour to see my brother on the way to DHs birthday trip. As the only reason we were doing it was to maximize time with my father and tbh I felt bad expecting DH to spend a day around a man he dislikes on his birthday trip.

I understand why my brother is upset with this, but now I am public enemy number 1 in my family for being ‘so cruel’ to him and ‘making him feel like an afterthought’ - quite honestly he was an afterthought, he hasn’t bothered to come and visit us, he has never made the effort to come to me, and is now getting annoyed I wouldn’t do a 40 min detour to see him, I’m apparently a narcissist and almost as awful as Hitler (his words)

I’m not sure if since having DS a lot of trauma from my childhood and having to bend to my brothers will so much is coming up and making me a bit of an asshole, but honestly speaking - in this situation was I being unreasonable? Should I apologize?

But how far does that go?

I made it pretty clear I was going to visit my dad, if he doesn’t understand that concept because he is so self centered it would never cross his mind that he wasn’t the main attraction what else would I need to have done to make that clear?

Asperger's my foot - he's a full on toxic narc.

Take this opportunity to go full NC. No way would I be around him or have him near my family.

I have been clearer to family but they are all still so set on defending him, my father actively told me to never say that my brother wasn’t the priority again. And especially to never say it to him, when it was the facts of that particular situation.

...
It’s just hard knowing these things but not really knowing how to proceed. Especially when I am pretty concerned regarding my brothers mental health, I honestly couldn’t bear the idea of me being the one to push him to ending his life, and sometimes it feels like I have to decide whether putting up with bad behavior is worse than being responsible for my brother ending his life. As although yes it would be his choice, I know for a fact if I had been more actively involved with him he wouldn’t have done it.

I think you may need some counseling because you seem to be entire families whipping boy - I think your boundaries are screwed because of that.

You can't be responsible for your brother mental health - in fact only time I've heard similar that a woman feels they have to put up with abusive behaviour to avoid man killing themselves it's been women who ended up fleeing abusive partners after years of head fucking behavior.

No idea why you are now accusing me of emotional blackmail.

And yes the two lines of argument are logically separate from one another.
one is - should she see him if he’s violent.
the other is - should he have realised he was just “tagging along”.

Anyways, I’ve shared my perspective , it’s up to OP whether she agrees or disagrees with any elements of any aspects of the points.

All the best to everyone ✌🏻

Even my parents recognised the price my sister and I paid for growing up with my volatile brother, my Mum still feels guilty to this day. Your parents on the other hand are in total denial, OP.

my father actively told me to never say that my brother wasn’t the priority again. And especially to never say it to him, when it was the facts of that particular situation.
you should actively say to your father I know I was never the priority to you, but my baby is my priority now and I’ll shout it from the rooftops if I want to.

There’s a long way in the middle between “main attraction “ and “no attraction at all”. Most people would assume they were somewhere in the middle. If they thought the latter , most people wouldn’t bother to attend, I imagine.

He is very motivated by free food so I think it’s safe to say he would be attending regardless

OP, this is not on you shoulders. You cannot remove all boundaries to (maybe) prevent someone killing themselves. Is your dad generally this dominating, telling you what you must or mustn't do/say or is he just really worried for your brother? In any case, it's not acceptable for your dad to demand things from you but I would probably be much nicer in my replies if I thought they came from a place of worry rather than entitlement.
You have boundaries in place to prevent harm to you and your family not just physical but mental harm too. I would just counter back to your dad that you are happy to engage with your brother but will not accept any abusive behaviour. He decided to take grave offence at you cancelling lunch. It may have been nice to see your brother or it may not have been. You weren't willing to find out and I wouldn't discuss this any longer. You were your brother's mental crutch. Maybe having the relief of no contact will allow you to eventually find a the right level on involvement with both, your brother and the rest of the family.

They are definitely in denial. I think my mum is aware of how much of an impact it made on me but is still lacking the awareness of her contribution to that situation.

Dad is clueless on both parts (willingly clueless)

I was never the priority growing up and having to bend all the time has really impacted me, and I realise it more and more as I get older.

I did try to use examples with my dad but he just can’t accept fault. Biggest one was when I asked him to tell my brother to turn his TV down the night before my Maths GCSE exams, it was 1 am and I was tired. Dad asked him to turn it down, brother flipped out and got violent, punched a massive hole in the wall, and hit my dad, that was of course my fault though because if I hadn’t asked my dad to tell him to turn it down and just had got on with it, he’d never have flipped out

I think for dad it boils down to really worrying about my brother, deep down knowing him buggering off has led to his decline in mental health and instead of dealing with those feelings is passing the blame and responsibility onto me as I was the last line of defense.

For me it’s showing the value placed on my brother is higher than the value placed on me, and I think part of that is because his needs are ‘higher’ but it still feels a bit crap.

I hope he stays NC permanently, OP. And please, please don’t ever let yourself get wheedled or guilt-tripped or stealthed into becoming his carer.

OP you can't help your brother. It sounds like he needs help from professionals if his mental health going to improve . You need to detach yourself and accept what can't be changed.

I’m an ASD mum with ASD sons. Neither are violent but one can be very hostile when stressed. He can be lovely and he’s bright and entertaining and it’s so difficult to see people’s reaction toward him but I know I can’t expect others to be so see him like this. I have told him so many times how his behaviour affects others (and ultimately himself) but he just doesn’t get it. Whether there’s some narcissism there I’m not sure.

Other DS is the most gentle man you could wish to meet. His relationship with his brother is his business….he certainly doesn’t make any effort with him and it’s not up to me to put pressure on him to do so.

As you say, the plan was never to visit your brother, just an outcome of you seeing your dad. It's understandable your brother is hurt, realising you are not as bothered about spending time with him, but you are not wrong for feeling that way.

Could just say to them all "This is DH birthday trip so honestly we wouldn't be doing the detour except to see dad however happy to arrange something separately with DB at a mutually convenient time and place" ie perhaps he can make some effyoy
too to meet half way and sorry I haven't RTFT but will later.

This is the same with my brother, no matter what people say he just cannot comprehend that his actions have consequences.

He cannot comprehend that by only wanting to go to KFC and talk about his new obsession is going to make people less likely to want to go out with him. He would never go to soft play for example to spend time with my and DS, we’d have to do what he wanted, but then gets upset about people not spending time with him.

If I had a magic lamp my first wish would be for him to get a tiny amount of self reflection

Call this out, OP, this is ridiculous. I’d point that out to anyone who has a go at you. He’s perfectly capable of organising something that he wants to do, but expects others to run around after him like he’s a baby if he does t want to do it himself. Not a chance I’d bow to that.

It's not your DH's autism that means he doesn’t like the fact you were pushed down the stairs by your brother in front of your DH. Totally neurotypical people would be horrified. I can't imagine why you'd want contact with him or why you'd expose your child to this behaviour. What if he throws the baby down the stairs?

Well said @Naunet! The violence apologists while blaming op for cancelling a LUNCH both baffle and frighten me!
Biggest concern is they are playing similar out at home, and telling one child how awful they are not to happily accept abuse and violence from a sibling.

^This.

All the "won't someone consider the poor violent bastard's feelings?" stuff is baffling to me too.

You certainly are hell bent on defending a violent man who made the op's childhood a nightmare.

If anyone had been violent towards me 3 times I would never see them again, couldn’t give a shiny shit who they were - blood gives them no free pass. Who next, your child? Fuck your brother and go overseas to see your dad.

If you had invited just your dad would he has insisted that your brother be invited as well?

He's not coming out of this well.

Hard to understand why you were desperate for another day with him tbh.

You know what, I was very close to a cousin - would have called him essentially a little brother - who has ASD and ADHD. He lived with me and my parents for a while and could be very violent - not actually hitting people but breaking things, screaming, throwing, swearing. It was really horrible. I went low contact as soon as I moved out and I'm really not sorry. I do love him, I'll always be concerned about him but being in contact with him regularly just took more than I could give. Work out your own boundary here and hold it.

This is the same with my brother, no matter what people say he just cannot comprehend that his actions have consequences.

But he can comprehend it because he wouldn't try to throw a big bloke down the stairs.

He might not be able to see when he's boring someone in a conversation but he can see if he's frightening you.