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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

It's a Plane Etiquette one!! Was I AIBU?

354 replies

Belladonna90 · 29/04/2024 19:19

Night flight back from the US.
Cabin crew do meal service at around 4am (UK time) around 11pm (US). I'm hoping not to go to bed when I land (so can beat the jet lag and not stay in US time!). In economy class and have the blanket over my head so I can sleep (need the 'room' to be as dark as possible'). I had my seat reclined in the belief that chicken or beef would not be served at this time. How wrong I was! Cabin Crew passes me with meal trolley (happily doesn't disturb me to ask whether I want a meal...at that time absolutely not!). However, when she is asking the passenger behind me she reclines my seat back up which startled the life out of me as I was jostled back up!! I was so annoyed as I was fast asleep. I can understand for a safety related issue if she needed to do that for example for landing but for a service related issue it seemed completely rude of her. Was I wrong to challenge her and ask why she did that?? She told me for service all seats must be in the upright position....

OP posts:
Amx · 30/04/2024 07:37

Yabu. The ... you're constantly using are very annoying.

TinkerTiger · 30/04/2024 07:38

HAS to be a reverse

Alwayswonderedwhy · 30/04/2024 07:39

I'm all for reclining seat in long haul but not when food is getting served. Uk time is irrelevant at this point.

hopscotcher · 30/04/2024 07:40

Obvs your seat can't be reclined if the person behind you is eating. However, I think it's a bit odd that they were serving food at that time of night (US or UK time!) and that she put your seat up rather than asking you to do it.

Behindthescenesnow · 30/04/2024 07:41

Kalettesarethebest · 30/04/2024 03:44

Yes, she does

Did you mean

Yes, she does.

WaltzingWaters · 30/04/2024 07:45

Yes you were. I don’t buy into the whole “never recline your seat” debate- but they should be up for meal times so the person behind can eat.

VisitationRights · 30/04/2024 07:45

The only unreasonable thing done to you was your seat being returned to the upright position without waking you to do it yourself. Otherwise you are unreasonable to expect for there not to be a meal or for the person behind you not to take it.

Lifestooshort71 · 30/04/2024 07:46

My last long haul out was a daytime London - LV, Virgin Economy (cos we couldn't justify the upgrade). The people in front reclined as soon as seat belt sign went off and stayed that way until we landed. We had TV screens imprinted on our foreheads and food trays under our chins and struggled to get out to moce about. Yes, we could also have reclined but the people behind didn't deserve that. Coming home (night flight) we upgraded at huge expense because of our trip out and nobody reclined until after the main meal. It's selfish and yes, OP, YWBVU.

Mumtobabyhavoc · 30/04/2024 07:49

hopscotcher · 30/04/2024 07:40

Obvs your seat can't be reclined if the person behind you is eating. However, I think it's a bit odd that they were serving food at that time of night (US or UK time!) and that she put your seat up rather than asking you to do it.

You must've missed the part where OP said she had a blanket over her head. 😂

Devonbabs · 30/04/2024 07:52

i would say BA crew are some of the best in the world. Given a choice I would always fly BA.

I thought it was an unwritten rule that you generally waited until after the first meal service to recline to your seat.

Were you flying back from the East Coast. Generally there’s not that much opportunity to get a good nights sleep. You might need to upgrade to Business Class in future.

Mumtobabyhavoc · 30/04/2024 07:53

How can no one else be in hysterics laughing that OP HAD A BLANKET OVER HER HEAD?
It's like a Monty Python skit.
Picture the flight attendant and OP conversing through the blanket.

notimagain · 30/04/2024 07:55

hopscotcher · 30/04/2024 07:40

Obvs your seat can't be reclined if the person behind you is eating. However, I think it's a bit odd that they were serving food at that time of night (US or UK time!) and that she put your seat up rather than asking you to do it.

BA have a few late evening departures out of the east coast US ( arrive UK mid/late AM UK time)…objectively most people don’t want a very early wake up for a full meal before arrival so the meal service ends up almost inevitably performed very late evening US time.

There used to be an option, may still be, for some premium passengers to eat in the lounge pre-boarding so they could settle down PDQ.

Devonbabs · 30/04/2024 07:55

Mumtobabyhavoc · 30/04/2024 07:53

How can no one else be in hysterics laughing that OP HAD A BLANKET OVER HER HEAD?
It's like a Monty Python skit.
Picture the flight attendant and OP conversing through the blanket.

I did wonder whether the flight attendant thought it was a dead body😀

Mumtobabyhavoc · 30/04/2024 07:59

Devonbabs · 30/04/2024 07:55

I did wonder whether the flight attendant thought it was a dead body😀

Yes! I asked this in my initial post a few hours ago. Clearly I am far too invested in the thread. 🫣

SilkFloss · 30/04/2024 08:04

Belladonna90 · 29/04/2024 22:04

Just a few things to clarify!!
We departed at 2000 (local time) and food was served three hours later. Unlike many whom have assumed I have not travelled much...the usual standard service on flights that depart at this time is a light bite like a hand held pizza and a drink from the bar and then a hot breakfast is served about 1.5hr before landing. Hence why I reclined my seat as I was not expecting a meal so late after take off in particular a hot dinner at that time.
If this was a day flight I of course would not of dreamed of reclining my seat. However, for a night flight I think it is entirely reasonable to expect that people will want to sleep. Be it US or UK time zone I think it is unusual for anyone to have beef and mashed potatoes at 11pm/4am and the natural thing to do is to sleep and not eat. Be it a Boeing or Airbus aircraft, engineers design the seats with it in mind that tray tables can still be used even if seats are reclined otherwise . Also for those who have said Emirates, Singapore have the same policy....
In both these airlines for night flights you get the option to put a 'DND' or 'wake me for food sticker'. Perhaps you have only travelled with these airlines on day flights.

I e flown Emirates back from KL overnight and the passenger in front of me had a DND sign showing and had reclined his seat to the maximum. I literally could not unfold my tray for the meal. It got stuck on my chest at an angle.
The stewardess very politely woke the guy to ask him to move his seat back up. He was furious but she persisted (politely).
So, your Emirates story makes no sense to me.

Littlebelina · 30/04/2024 08:06

I've been on a transatlantic flight where the passenger next to me (on the aisle) had her blanket over her head for most of the flight. She did at least remove it for meal services so I could ask to get out for the loo at that point.

Last transatlantic flight I was on was an 8.30 take off with meal (full, hot) about 2 hours after take off which I thought was fairly usual. However I'm one of the ghastly people who makes sure she gets her meals and drinks service to get her moneys worth (and given the cost of my last economy ticket I barely scratched the surface). Love a slightly crappy airline meal 🍛🍸✈

Misthios · 30/04/2024 08:13

I flew back from the east coast US to London with BA about a month ago. We departed about 7.30pm, a full meal was served about 60 minutes into the flight and after that the lights dimmed which is pretty much accepted as the universal symbol that it's now appropriate to recline your seat. Then 60-90 minutes before landing the lights come back up and they serve breakfast.

3 hours into the flight to serve a meal does seem late (the actual time on the clock is totally irrelevant) but reclining before that point is unreasonable too.

SwordBilledHummingbird · 30/04/2024 08:14

Seats need to be upright during meal times but the flight attendant should have asked you to put your seat up not forced it. And to the person questioning whether that happened, it happened to me once. I was just waking up when it was time for the second meal and was very groggy when the trolley got to me. Instead of asking me to put my seat up the attendant forced it and caused me a lot of pain. It was really unnecessary when she could have just asked.

Remaker · 30/04/2024 08:15

You’re in cattle class with hundreds of other people. You don’t get to inflict your preferences onto the people around you, or the flight attendants.

If you were genuinely a seasoned traveller you would know to listen to the announcements or read the menu in the seat pocket which tells you what meals will be served on the flight.

Misthios · 30/04/2024 08:15

Also on that sort of New York - London flight if you get a couple of hours sleep you're doing really well. The flight is only 6.5 or 7 hours at the most.

backinthebox · 30/04/2024 08:16

The single biggest reason ime for passengers kicking off on a flight is the reclining (or not) of a seat. I had one just the other day - passenger in front bloody-mindedly wanted to recline their seat through the meal service, passenger behind threatened to punch them in the head if they did. Both passengers unreasonable, disruptive passenger warning letter prepared (but ultimately not given out, because they grew up) for both of them.

However, it is normal plane etiquette to wait until the meal service is over before reclining.

@Belladonna90 if you are wanting plane etiquette tips here, here’s another one - fasten up your seatbelt over the outside of your blanket and the cabin crew will not disturb you if you are resting. You don’t need a little sticker. Blanket over head = just weird, or Michael Jackson’s kid. You can get some great eyeshades these days which you’ll get your money’s worth from if you are as frequent a traveller as you think you are, even better, you can also get very supportive inflatable sleep cushions that have a built in blackout hood. Use one of these, and you’ll be able to fasten your seatbelt over your blanket, block out the light, AND keep your head in a comfy position whilst sleeping in an upright position. Triple bonus!

Regarding the meal service timings. Firstly, there are always 2 meals on a long haul service. It doesn’t matter what the local time at departure or local time at arrival are - you’ll be served something about an hour after take off and again an hour before landing. On an overnight flight this will be a full dinner to begin with, and then a breakfast just before we land. These meals are served because many passengers do not have the opportunity to eat before the flight, and because there can be a lot of connecting passengers. JFK is a massive transfer hub, passengers could be connecting in from all over the place on some very long earlier flights indeed. Eg A passenger transferring from a West Coast flight might not have anything to eat since breakfast time on their body clock.

Regarding the timings, I’m a little surprised the meal was served 3 hours into the flight. A JFK overnight flight is usually about 6hrs 40mins from take off to landing. Cabin crew generally get a break mid flight after the first meal service is collected in but before the second meal service. They are reluctant to reduce their rest times by delaying meal services. The first meals are often loaded into the ovens on the ground, and the ovens switched on during pushback, in order that the first meals are ready about 45 mins after take off. A meal cannot be served to a passenger after it has been more than 4 hrs since it was put in the oven. This is an absolute no-no, and I’ve seen entire aircraft full of passengers go without meals after an engineering fault caused a return to stand. So I would imagine giving out meals 3 hours after take off would be a bit close to the limit, and not done.

And about buying a Club ticket at short notice - it is always possible to buy a Club seat at short notice, the question is not so much ‘have you ever tried to buy one,’ more a question of ‘can you afford it?’ BA have 8 flights a day from JFK to Heathrow, 1 a day to Gatwick, 2 more to Heathrow from Newark, and code share with at least 4 American Airlines JFK-LHR. There are club seats available on all 15 of these services today. British Airways operations between New York and London is the world’s first ‘billion dollar route.’ There is always capacity to book a Club seat at short notice - BA passengers rely on this.

Finally @londonmummy1966 - are you my disruptive passenger from a few months back who behaved appallingly from check in till the minute she was told she would be unlikely to be permitted to travel with the airline again? The one who justified all her poor behaviour with ‘all of my mummy friends do this……’ In my very considerable experience in aviation, including the airline you are uncomplimentary about, the only misogyny I have seen has been by passengers towards staff. Any crew member caught treating ANY passenger disrespectfully would be pulled up on it immediately with dire consequences for the crew member. So many passengers think it is acceptable to film crew members on their phones (include the ‘mummy friends’ one mentioned above) and post it online that it is quite literally more than their job is worth for any crew member to be disrespectful, let alone prejudiced against an entire subsection of their passengers. I would politely suggest that this has not happened.

NashvilleQueen · 30/04/2024 08:18

Loads of people find it hard to sleep on flights (even in a reclined position and overnight) and so are eating and drinking and watching films etc. It is odd that you think everyone immediately closes their eyes for 5 hours and doesn't move just because you do.

GhoulWithADragonTattoo · 30/04/2024 08:19

You are being so unreasonable and selfish.

HoppingPavlova · 30/04/2024 08:24

@KTSl1964 how where you asleep when you answered her!!!!

Yep. Add in the blanket over the head to this. As well as being asleep and responding, it was all done with a blanket over the head seemingly. I’m guessing that’s why the person just put her seat up (if that happened), because once they saw the blanket over the head they probably realised any normal interaction was not really going to be possible.

The upshot is, if not willing to work in synch with meals and so forth, then fly business where your lack of social awareness won’t bother both staff and others. It’s preferable obviously, but when I fly on my own dime (not funded by work) I always go economy as I prefer to save the difference in cost for other things in my life, and accordingly I don’t act like an entitled fuckwit.

nineseasaway · 30/04/2024 08:25

Excellent post @backinthebox, thank you!