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To nominate the principle authors of the CASS review for this..

407 replies

NameChangeCass · 14/04/2024 09:47

“Advocates of evidence based medicine have criticised the adoption of interventions evaluated by using only observational data. We think that everyone might benefit if the most radical protagonists of evidence based medicine organised and participated in a double blind, randomised, placebo controlled, crossover trial of the parachute.”

https://www.bmj.com/content/327/7429/1459.short?fbclid=IwAR0hTt57o-yFS61aJE-IGCpKSPaDs--rdrPlbiby_wBCF1czpAWDaCcAEcM_aem_ATiWMtvZxiSzw8pj9CX271gyDByuMHTOKwQskBcCXx9aZOj1IPusHJ_z79olcRiFlhE

Parachute use to prevent death and major trauma related to gravitational challenge: systematic review of randomised controlled trials

Objectives To determine whether parachutes are effective in preventing major trauma related to gravitational challenge. Design Systematic review of randomised controlled trials. Data sources: Medline, Web of Science, Embase, and the Cochrane Library...

https://www.bmj.com/content/327/7429/1459.short?fbclid=IwAR0hTt57o-yFS61aJE-IGCpKSPaDs--rdrPlbiby_wBCF1czpAWDaCcAEcM_aem_ATiWMtvZxiSzw8pj9CX271gyDByuMHTOKwQskBcCXx9aZOj1IPusHJ_z79olcRiFlhE

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/04/2024 21:08

Sorry meant to quote the OP.

TheKeatingFive · 21/04/2024 21:17

OP, you're just grasping at straws now.

Look, I get that you desperately don't want the Cass report to be valid, but this is about more than your job or your own investment in this issue. These kids deserve properly evidenced medical care. And they have not been getting that.

TheClogLady · 21/04/2024 22:43

NameChangeCass · 21/04/2024 19:21

this isn’t about the identity of the person who wrote the thread , it’s just accurate information. You can verify it yourself if you aren’t convinced and care to inform yourself.

Why are you so keen to justify the chemical castration of gay and autistic minors, OP?

We’ve read the Cass Report, all 388 pages, this Random Thread from a Random Man isn’t the rebuttal you are imagining it to be.

Andr0meda · 22/04/2024 00:49

NameChangeCass · 14/04/2024 14:36

Honestly? Because we know that withholding vital health services from an extremely vulnerable group of children is only going to cause them immeasurable suffering.
Because we know that PBs are a safe and effective medicine that can help until children are ready for HRT. Because we know that the assault on transgender medicine is based on erroneous and flawed politically driven beliefs that being trans is not a real and legitimate thing and this is so so wrong.

This convinced me you are a male.

NameChangeCass · 22/04/2024 02:33

Theeyeballsinthesky · 21/04/2024 19:35

here is an article dealing with the misinformation being spread by TRA about Cass by a health & science journalist

https://www.realityslaststand.com/p/fact-checking-critics-of-the-cass

(as opposed to an Internet random)

Yet None of the factual claims by this “health and science” journalist contradict any of the information provided in this thread.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1781730844798820808.html?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0BMQABHSjl17Xf24zaf8VJ6VAgrc33C5jxfbj2iiDb7elAxhpeZYiWizi5Z2kgVw_aem_Aaquu8DB2gpIAONhQvZJ67O5S1JCTQAXHaJ96pgniuXS_1-q5ywVPKUKOukDoqrBXO4

Thread by @Simon_Whitten on Thread Reader App

@Simon_Whitten: Did the Cass Review disregard the evidence of all but 2 of 103 studies on puberty blockers & hormones to reach it’s conclusions? Yes and no. I’d like to offer a brief breakdown of what...…

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1781730844798820808.html?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0BMQABHSjl17Xf24zaf8VJ6VAgrc33C5jxfbj2iiDb7elAxhpeZYiWizi5Z2kgVw_aem_Aaquu8DB2gpIAONhQvZJ67O5S1JCTQAXHaJ96pgniuXS_1-q5ywVPKUKOukDoqrBXO4

OP posts:
NameChangeCass · 22/04/2024 03:05

People like your “health and science journalist” can continue to insist that some studies, deemed “moderate quality”, were discussed in the York systematic reviews and Cass’s final report. They were, but when it came to drawing inferences from the evidence their results were dismissed as “insufficient”. It was declared that, due to a “lack of high quality research…no conclusions can be drawn”. (Eg page 184 Cass).

This is the bottom line.

OP posts:
MeDaughterMerope · 22/04/2024 03:17

People like you have championed the sterilisation of vulnerable children and the gig is soon to be up.
That's the bottom line.

BiologicalKitty · 22/04/2024 07:16

Imagine thinking that grooming children into vivisection puts you on the right side of history.

TheKeatingFive · 22/04/2024 07:39

BiologicalKitty · 22/04/2024 07:16

Imagine thinking that grooming children into vivisection puts you on the right side of history.

Absolutely mental, isn't it?

I wonder what happened to people's brains and consciences?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 08:11

Yet None of the factual claims by this “health and science” journalist contradict any of the information provided in this thread.

As I said, the "missing" information the man in your random Twitter thread is banging on about is provided in the report itself. You can access the bit about cross sex hormones from the link in Colin Wright's piece.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 08:12

They were, but when it came to drawing inferences from the evidence their results were dismissed as “insufficient”. It was declared that, due to a “lack of high quality research…no conclusions can be drawn”. (Eg page 184 Cass).

Yes, the follow up period was considered too short in most cases or there were other pertinent issues.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 08:14

Again, link to a specific study you feel should have been included and explain why in your own words, please.

Naunet · 22/04/2024 08:24

NameChangeCass · 14/04/2024 10:45

Oh don’t get me wrong I’m am all for collecting more and better evidence on trans medicine. And I think it’s an absolute disgrace that the Tavi completely failed to collect proper evidence on the children they were treating for so long. They could and should have done this- it was a terrible neglect. However, I do not support the manipulation of evidence to promote the current political agenda to place further restrictions on a group of very vulnerable children’s access to vitally needed health services .
Also it would not be ethical, nor practically possible, to conduct a double blinded randomised control trial on the use of PBs for this purpose. We already know they are effective in preventing puberty so at the very least it would be perfectly obvious who was receiving the placebo and who was not!

Manipulation of evidence?! Take the tin foil hat off OP, and grow up.

TheKeatingFive · 22/04/2024 08:28

However, I do not support the manipulation of evidence to promote the current political agenda to place further restrictions on a group of very vulnerable children’s access to vitally needed health services

And why would you think Dr Cass is doing this? What would motivate a highly respected, highly experienced paediatrician - with no previous skin in the game - to do so?

The conclusion of the review is that there isn't sufficient evidence, so let's correct that and proceed with evidenced based approaches.

Why would anyone who genuinely cared about the children involved have a problem with that?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 08:47

Basically, these people think their lame gotchas should mean that the review is discarded and puberty blockers and cross sex hormones should continue to be freely provided to children (most of these people are in the US where even surgery is possible for some under 16s).

NameChangeCass · 22/04/2024 08:49

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 08:11

Yet None of the factual claims by this “health and science” journalist contradict any of the information provided in this thread.

As I said, the "missing" information the man in your random Twitter thread is banging on about is provided in the report itself. You can access the bit about cross sex hormones from the link in Colin Wright's piece.

what “missing information”.

OP posts:
NameChangeCass · 22/04/2024 08:58

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 08:12

They were, but when it came to drawing inferences from the evidence their results were dismissed as “insufficient”. It was declared that, due to a “lack of high quality research…no conclusions can be drawn”. (Eg page 184 Cass).

Yes, the follow up period was considered too short in most cases or there were other pertinent issues.

If it were just that the “follow up period was too short” , the tone of the conclusions should have been very different. For example, they could have written - the available evidence shows that access to cross sex hormones improve psychological wellbeing for children .
However, it is unknown how long these results are sustained as there are no studies that measure long term effects
(Btw VERY normal in this type of medical / health research).
Then they could have recommended that therefore cross sex hormones continue to be available to under 18s based on individual assessment of need , but some new longitudinal research. is funded.

other “ pertinent issues” you refer to relate to the methodology - eg - lack of a control group and high attrition.

OP posts:
NameChangeCass · 22/04/2024 09:15

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 08:47

Basically, these people think their lame gotchas should mean that the review is discarded and puberty blockers and cross sex hormones should continue to be freely provided to children (most of these people are in the US where even surgery is possible for some under 16s).

No one thinks they should be “freely provided to children”. They should be made available to a small minority of children, based on careful assessment of individual need, clinical judgement and the best available evidence, as is the standard in all other areas of pediatric care.

Presumably puberty blockers will still be available to children undergoing precocious puberty on these grounds- despite no data on long term psychological wellbeing effects measured against a control group.

OP posts:
SinnerBoy · 22/04/2024 09:17

Here's a letter to the Observer, by 16 psychologists:

https://www.theguardian.com/theobserver/commentisfree/2024/apr/21/we-are-ashamed-of-role-psychology-played-gender-care-observer-letters

We are ashamed of the role psychology played in gender care

We write as clinical psychologists with longstanding concerns about the scandal unfolding at Gender Identity Development Service clinics. Some of us are former Gids clinicians. While welcoming your editorial stance, we would like to point out that it is not just the medical profession that has “much to reflect on”

These were psychology-led services. Whether intentionally or not, and many were doing their best in an impossible situation, it was clinical psychologists who promoted an ideology that was almost impossible to challenge; who, as the Cass report found, largely failed to carry out proper assessments of troubled young people, and thus put many on an “irreversible medical pathway” that in most cases was inappropriate; and who failed in their most basic duty to keep proper records.

It is also our professional body, the British Psychological Society, that has failed (despite years of pressure) to produce guidelines for clinicians working with young people in this complex area; and that, forced into making an official response for the first time, now minimises its own role in events and calls for “more psychology” as the answer. We are ashamed of the role psychology has played.

What happened at Gids was a multi-factorial systemic failure, but when the Observer rightly calls for “accountability for the managers and clinicians who pursued such unethical practice and caused avoidable harm to young people”, we believe the role of our own profession should be fully examined.

NameChangeCass · 22/04/2024 09:28

TheKeatingFive · 22/04/2024 08:28

However, I do not support the manipulation of evidence to promote the current political agenda to place further restrictions on a group of very vulnerable children’s access to vitally needed health services

And why would you think Dr Cass is doing this? What would motivate a highly respected, highly experienced paediatrician - with no previous skin in the game - to do so?

The conclusion of the review is that there isn't sufficient evidence, so let's correct that and proceed with evidenced based approaches.

Why would anyone who genuinely cared about the children involved have a problem with that?

What would motivate a highly respected, highly experienced paediatrician - with no previous skin in the game - to do so
What is motivating it/ Cass?
Gender-critical ideologies and transphobic agendas.
I also imagine Cass may be scared of personal impacts and to some extent ignorant of the harm her report is likely to cause (although there’s not much excuse for the later).

OP posts:
TheKeatingFive · 22/04/2024 09:31

NameChangeCass · 22/04/2024 09:28

What would motivate a highly respected, highly experienced paediatrician - with no previous skin in the game - to do so
What is motivating it/ Cass?
Gender-critical ideologies and transphobic agendas.
I also imagine Cass may be scared of personal impacts and to some extent ignorant of the harm her report is likely to cause (although there’s not much excuse for the later).

Edited

What evidence do you have that Cass has a 'transphobic agenda'?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 09:32

I also imagine Cass may be scared of personal impacts and to some extent ignorant of the harm her report is likely to cause (although there’s not much excuse for the later).

Why would she be scared of "personal impacts"?

StormyAprilSkies · 22/04/2024 09:33

BiologicalKitty · 22/04/2024 07:16

Imagine thinking that grooming children into vivisection puts you on the right side of history.

This.

It is. Wait until these young people realise the damage done by adults around them.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2024 09:35

No one thinks they should be “freely provided to children”. They should be made available to a small minority of children, based on careful assessment of individual need, clinical judgement and the best available evidence, as is the standard in all other areas of pediatric care.

Have you met the "trans rights" movement?

https://www.tumblr.com/edinburghath/163521055802/trans-health-manifesto

We demand hormones & blockers are made available over-the-counter and by free prescription upon request.** We need free, universal access to safe hormones & blockers at any age, the opportunity to decide our own doses, and universally accessible information on the safety & efficacy of different regimens. We are already taking hormones in this way, so this demand is simply that the danger of doing so is effectively mitigated.

Underthinker · 22/04/2024 09:35

@NameChangeCass
I also imagine Cass may be scared of personal impacts

Cass is probably scared of personal impacts now. But not from the side of this debate you mean. It's only your lot that bully and assault women for speaking the truth.