No phone for secondary school

[StillCreatingAName]

AIBU? I feel like I might be missing something obvious on this one, but honestly why do children need to take a smartphone to school? It’s baffling me as to why there appears to be parents on auto pilot buying their children smartphones (£££) now in year 6, ready for year 7 as though it’s part of a uniform policy (and then sharing their purchase on the class WhatsApp, give me strength).

Is this all just a fallout from lockdown times, people were sort of forced into screen life, so now there’s more children at secondary school with them, who may not have ordinarily had a phone until older?
I’m expecting dc to walk home with friends talking and socialising without the inclusion of a screen or mindlessly scrolling social media instead of listening to friends. I can see where a basic phone might be needed to contact home, but that doesn’t mean the phone should be out of school bag anytime during school hours should it, but maybe I’m just being naive, time will tell 🤷‍♀️?

AIBU to say children don’t need to get a £££ phone for starting secondary school? (It goes without saying they don’t need it at all for primary school, IMHO)?

If the school mentioned is doing that then they’re breaching DofE guidance on mobile phone use. Kids absolutely do not need a phone to access school.

They need a device and yes, schools do provide this free of charge if children are from low income households. They can also access data at school to download homework and access google classroom or equivalent.

Mobile phones are a big social thing. That’s where they will possibly (likely) miss out. Trips out etc are planned on mobile devices so they won’t hear about those. And may find themselves out of the loop a lot. That’s phone use out of school though and really the ideal is a monitored phone at home. It’s not needed in school.

My child needs a weekly bus ticket which is purchased on the bus app. The driver refuses to take cash as he doesn’t have the right change to give. It’s also handy for the children to track the bus on its GPS to tell if the bus is coming as often it’s a no show and they need to catch a different one.

I agree it’s a good idea to keep the children off social media though. My child is y9 and she’s not interested in all that. It’s not universal. I think it depends on the child if they’re interested in all that. She finds TikTok really stupid / inane…a bit like what I think of Love Island.

One of the best things for equipping children for success at school and in many jobs is a good attention span. I think that the single most disruptive thing to that developing attention span for most children that age is a smartphone. Then there are all the adverse effects of social media too.

It's so unfortunate that so much is made less convenient for children who don't have a smartphone (train tickets, homework apps, etc.), because it makes it a difficult choice not to give them to children.

I would actually support smartphones being banned for under 16s similarly to alcohol and tobacco. I realise this wouldn't prevent some children still getting them, but it would shift the general mindset so they could be seen as something addictive and potentially harmful to the developing brain.

In my school, phones are not permitted at all. We have calculators in classrooms so they are not needed for that. Phones are handed in a secure bag in morning registration, kept locked in the admin office for the day and collected at home time.

They were permitted in my last school and the drama they caused was unbelievable, from children recording each other in classrooms, recording the teachers, cheating in lessons, making TikToks in lessons/bathrooms. They were so distracting to pupils and staff and I would never work in another school where students can have them in class.

Filming the teachers? 😟 it’s good to hear from a teachers pov @TitaniasAss wonder how many would rather not have them in classrooms at all, but school management push the use of tech?

My eldest was in year 7 for the first lockdown, and we ended up giving him an old smartphone as he needed to photograph all his homework for his teachers, and it was getting really inconvenient us having to do it whilst we were meant to be working. Until then he had a Nokia brick, as I worked in a school and all the problems we had with the Year 6s involved smartphones and WhatsApp messages. His school has a Bring Your Own Device policy and they are expected to have homework apps, quiz apps, and language apps to work from or share with a classmate who has a smartphone.

Why any teacher or school would allow them is insane. All schools should be like your current school, the teachers surely have enough to deal with without the hassle of smart phones which are clearly a huge distraction for all.

This is a relief to hear. I've been following this debate and the evidence for some time now and we're hoping to hold off having an experience blocker (sorry, 'smart phone') for as long as possible.

I presumed having a family home computer in a communal area would be sufficient for all school homework, planning, and internet use. If school suggest differently (stating that 'smart phones' are necessary) I plan to push back strongly on this and will be armed with plenty of evidence of the harms to be able to do so. I hope it'll work!

YABU They make life easier which is why we all use them. They can listen to music on their way to school, check bus timetables or other routes home, keep up to date with their friends, contact you in an emergency etc. I got a phone a year before secondary school which was over 20 years ago now so definitely not a lockdown thing or a new thing at all.

Times are a bit different now to when my kids were at school but mine only got a phone when they were on public transport on their own and needed to be able to contact me. If I had young kids now, i'd say 10 at the very youngest for a phone and then it would be my cast off!! My 20 year old is still using my last cast off as he's too tight to buy his own 😂

As a long term year 6 teacher, it’s actually getting worse and worse. Problems with WhatsApp groups, filming Tik Toks at the gate before they come in, even cases of online grooming.

The problem isn’t schools; it’s parenting. If you let your underage child have social media accounts, don’t check what they are sharing online, set limits, allow children to scroll for hours you’re essentially neglecting them.

The current Y6 cohort i teach are probably one of the worst, most difficult classes to teach because they don’t understand what is appropriate for a classroom environment, have no attention span, constant use of bad language and the WhatsApp group frequently has messages in the early hours of the morning.

But we have to deal with it all in school because it’s a safeguarding issue. It takes up a ridiculous amount of time.

I’m all for tech - timetables and homework are age appropriate for school - but social media/late night groups - it’s killing the teachers.

‘Teachers’ have little or no influence on school policy on many issues, unfortunately. Don’t blame the teachers.

The only other phones I know of are the old Nokia type where you had to keep pressing the same button to get to the letters you wanted. I’d be very happy to have a non-smart phone but has a proper keyboard, what brands do this as I’ll happily get one (I didn’t know they existed tbh).

Its not just about school, but the transition to secondary school, and Y6 for many kids comes hand in hand with more freedom, walking to and from school, hanging out with friends aftershock with no set plans.
A phone of some kind is really useful in that respect. The world has moved on and just because we managed without, no everyone has one it's silly not to let pre-teens have some sort of mobile communication device.

I also advise getting a smart phone in Y6 rather than Y7 or later.
You know their school friends and their friends parents and they can learn how to use it sensibly in a lower risk social circle. They are more likely accept parental controls and regular checks on what they are sending....and other parents are checking too.

By the time they get to Y7 its difficult to control.
Unfortunately not being on snapchat does significantly limit social interactions and friendship groups once they get to high school.
While I have concerns about social media etc, I don't think my child being an outsider due to lack of a phone is a helpful or proportionate response to that.

@TickyTacky you say your son is only 11. So do you think that status quo will remain? That he'll still only be playing Angry Birds when he's 12/13/14, and not looking at Pornhub for example?

@StillCreatingAName OP are you a member of Smartphone Free Childhood? There are communities in every county. If you join your local one you'll find likeminded parents galvanising and sharing resources which might help you.

smartphonefreechildhood.co.uk/get-involved

I agree with you to a certain extent op. My DS currently uses my old phone and I bought him a new SIM card to put in it. I have refused to buy him a brand new phone for Xmas or his birthday because I know they can easily get lost or stolen or even dropped. However, I feel that now he is at secondary school and has more responsibility ie. Walking himself to and from school, I feel some comfort knowing that he has a phone with him should anything happen to him. I know that during my school days mobile phones weren’t around but I feel in this day and age, and with all the peado’s and weirdos hanging around, plus bullies now seem to be more aggressive than ever, I do feel that he should have a phone with him for this reason. Otherwise I’d make him wait until he was older to have a phone.

I completely agree with this

Yeah this @MoroccoMole Some secondary teachers would say 'get your phones out & take a photo of this too'. All homework is on phone apps plus laptops too. We buy reconditioned/secondhand phones from Music Magpie or CEX too so don't spend a fortune or buy the latest models. I honestly feel sorry for kids whose parents say no mobile til the kid is much older as they are definitely the odd one out & can't join in on group WhatsApp chats etc. I guarantee those strict (controlling/helicopter) parents have lovely smartphones which they use all the time!

Work in a school. No one wants them there. Including management.

this is where they are at. They want them prohibited.

https://educationhub.blog.gov.uk/2024/02/19/mobile-phones-in-schools-are-they-being-banned/

@StillCreatingAName I wrote a very long post , which I now lost so I'll try to summarise .

1. Smartphones aren't necessarily the issue. Usage is the issue. If it can be done on a phone, it can probably be done on a tablet or laptop . If your kids has a device with internet, it can happen.

1. I honestly believe you can strike a balance. Yes she had a phone in y6. The condition was that I get to check it, whenever ,wherever. I said no to tiktok and snapchat and explained why. She had no interest in other SM bar whatsapp. The phone has strict settings on internet usage. She doesn't have the password to her apple ID , so she needs permission and me actively putting it in if she wants an app. She always asks anyway. She asks permission to go on call and stays within hearing range.Phone goes away to charge at night and it also has usage limits. If I say the phone goes, it goes, no arguments. I might be completely deluded of course, but there have been a lot of advantages in her having it compared to none/very little issues. These rules are still in place now she's at secondary and she's still largely unbothered by them. Hopefully, by the time (if) she starts to rebel she'll have good/safe phone usage habits instilled in her.

The main advantage was the vast increase in her independence,freedom and confidence. From knowing she has me as backup in her pocket, to starting to problem solve herself (checking in with me if needed) , to having new experiences going out with her friends , to being home alone by herself (the kid would follow me to take the bins out!) and so on. I could tell you all the instances when having a phone was useful and even necessary, and it made HER life easier(it's not about me) but I'll end up writing an essay again.

Not saying your kids have it, but I'm early 20s and I remember a stage where me and all of my friends in secondary school 'werent allowed social media'
Can't think of anyone not having it though. The kids who had phones had social media and hid it from their parents .
I think most parents are very naive when it comes to what their kids are doing on their phones

Lol, the stuff my friends and I got up to on desktops and laptops was pretty awful - porn, rotten.com, adult chat rooms, distance "relationships" with god knows who on MSN messenger... Our parents didn't even know how to check the browser history and relied on us to tell them how the computer worked and what emails were blatant scams.

Millennial parents have no excuse not to put safeguards on their kid's phones and check them, as we've been there and done that!

Schools shouldnt be asking children to use smart phones in class.

Dumb phones are fine for the purpose needed of being able to contact them.

Just because it's normal doesn't mean its right.

Parents need to take control of their childrens access to smartphones and stop trying to justify them as necessary. We create societal norms. Parenting is the greatest force for social change.

I get that parenting in a world that doesn't value the role of parenting is hard but outsourcing socialising our young to algorithms that don't have ethics or a soul is a recipe for disaster.

So no YANBU.

But they won't be leaving out friends on purpose, will they? They simply won't be able to tell the friend what's going on if that friend isn't part of the WhatsApp group. Its not rocket science. Oh & youre in for a shock if you don't think brands of trainers are a big deal to some teenagers (mainly boys) either 🤣 Don't you use your smartphone all the time to organise your entire life? Teenagers are no different. Put as many parental cobtrols/rules/restrictions in place as you need but just bear in mind once your DC are 18 & off to college/Uni there's nothing you can do about how addicted to tech they may or may not be. Best to introduce it early and gradually relinquish control to the point where they automatically put it on silent overnight etc & don't spend all day on it. My DS (16) has a friend whose Mum still treats him like a baby despite him being a really hard-working kid who is no trouble. No ps4, barely any phone data, no sleepovers during Easter (he wanted to go to one sleepover) as exams are a month away etc etc. I honestly feel sorry for him. I see a future where this kid moves out of home as soon as he can as his parents are just too controlling.