I've caused WW3 at work - vegetarian

[Lazykitten]

I'm veggie. Nearly vegan but once in a blue moon eat cheese so don't refer to myself as that.

We have a team meal booked. In theory it's for us plebs as a thank you for hitting targets. In reality it's to network with the big bosses who comes up to celebrate with us.

Meal is booked in Manchester in the evening at a restaurant renowned for its meat. You don't order a meal, they just come round with sides of beef,lamb, pork etc every 5 minutes and carve at the table. I'm not going to eat this. Nor do I want to sit there surrounded by meat, its been so long since I've ate it the smell turns my stomach a little. Plus it's Manchester not exactly a small town so there was opportunity to book plenty of other nice restaurants. So I've said thank you but no thank you as I wouldn't enjoy it.

Team manager says I'm being ridiculous. That there's a salad bar. And if I don't come I'll need to book the day off as leave.

We've locked horns before as in the summer we had an event at a famous race course - one where there are often fatalities. I said I didn't want to go as I disagree with horse racing, he pushed me into it, so I went and felt awful. I'm not going this year so I'm going to have that battle coming up too.

I'm not a confrontational person so this is really upsetting me. I just wanted to quietly decline but now it's blown up and everyone seems to have an opinion.

Do you think I need to suck it up and go?

I'm half Mi'kmaq. It's part of the culture as with many indigenous. It's how a lot of humans have survived and continue to survive. Some people who choose not to eat meat act like it's repulsive for others to eat meat or seafood and I think that's repulsive.

And to be clear. If I invite friends over who are vegan or vegetarian - we eat vegan or vegetarian. I've bought cookbooks to help me make. more interesting things. I have two vegan friends who look after my child when I travel - they have no problem cooking and serving him meat or fish. NONE. If we go to their house for food, they'll often purchase and cook meat for him because that's what he eats. There's a mutual respect. It is important for some people culturally, religiously and it annoys me how disrespectful people can be toward others. OP stated "Nor do I want to sit there surrounded by meat, its been so long since I've ate it the smell turns my stomach a little."

Don’t go ? Our team mean was sushi that I don’t like but I wouldn’t spoil it for everyone else . I think choosing to be offended is silly in there’s situations . If most are happy with the place then it’s fair . Rodízios as those restaurantes are called are always expensive so if the office is paying I bet most of the others are super happy .

I'm a carnivore but not a big meat eater. Half a steak is my limit. No way would I go horse racing I hate the cruelty.

If @Lazykitten was objecting on religious grounds this wouldn't be happening.

Go to HR .

our company organised climbing days, chocolate making, I refused both for health reasons. No-one bullied me

You did. Apologies for not including the complete quote.

I thought you might understand that I was paraphrasing.

Inclusive relates to protected characteristics. Moral beliefs regarding horse racing aren’t covered.

She isn’t objecting for religious reasons though.

You are absolutely not being unreasonable OP. I’m a vegetarian too and though I’d tolerate being at the meat place, I’d not love it, but if I had some good work friends I’d be ok I think, but you’re within your rights to say no. Regarding the horse racing, I would absolutely not ever go, no way. It completely goes against my morals so tell your boss no way!

I think you misunderstood. I don't care what OP eats. I respect everyone for what they eat and do not. She's implied she would be disgusted sitting at this meal while people are eating meat. My point is that she's acting like eating meat is wrong and offensive. And there are many cultures that celebrate eating meat, some like mine, hunting and eating meat. - I'm half Mi'kmaq and it's very much a part of my culture to meat. My ex-husband was Muslim and it was important for him to eat Lamb or Mutton at times. We can go on and on... To me, this "Nor do I want to sit there surrounded by meat, its been so long since I've ate it the smell turns my stomach a little," along with her statements about horse racing being offensive - makes me think she's quite judgemental about traditions and cultures of others. I'm sure most of my friends are fairly moderate in their views - my vegan friends would not act disgusted by others eating meat. My ex-husband asked me not to eat pork when we were trying to have a baby because it just felt better to him. If people were barbecuing sausage he never ever commented on the smell or anything - he close to live in a country where pork is the norm. I work in IT and back in 2010-2013 I was running events for developers and there were a lot of Indian guys - I always made sure there was food for them. NEVER did I experience anyone expecting that meat would not be consumed because they did not. So me this rise of people that seem to want others to eat someone where meat is not served or who want to not attend events where meat is consumed - is being culturally insensitive to others.

Out of interest - would it not be a protected belief if you were of the Jain religion?

She's implied she would be disgusted sitting at this meal while people are eating meat

She hasn't though.

She said that the smell plus seeing the meat being carved would make her feel nauseous, but that's not the same thing.

She also said that she would be happy to go to a restaurant serves near but doesn't carve at the table.

She's not saying that though, she said she'd be fine with them eating meat as their dinner in a normal restaurant, just not one where every five minutes someone's waving dangling meat on a stick around and making a big deal of it.

I eat meat and I see her issue with it.

She doesn’t want to go somewhere meat isn’t served, but the type of restaurant she has been told they’re going to is an over the top constant stream of meat, big lumps coming constantly on skewers, carved at the table and endless unless you turn over the coaster which says ‘no more’. For a vegetarian, it is offensive (as one of many years) so I don’t think it’s inclusive or fair. The UK has a good number of vegetarian eaters, but this restaurant is over the top (there’s one near me)

As for racing, I’m a horse person, probably overly soppy about mine. I find racing cruel and disgraceful, backing 2 year olds, no matter how lightweight the jockey, is very poor practice, imo. The deaths of multiple horses at big races is impossible to justify.

I'm a lover of meats buy no way in the world would I pick this kind of restaurant for a work function knowing somebody is vegetarian. I don't care if it's 300 carnivores to 1 vegetarian. We have one of these in my city a Brazilian steakhouse you can smell it from the car park.

Sorry posted too fast. Go to HR at once there is no legal reason you need to take leave for the day. This sounds like a pissed off manager trying to force you into attending.

@cremebrulait , the OP hasn't stated that eating meat is wrong, though to many of us it is, as our core values differ from yours. We are all entitled to our values and opinions, whether rooted in religion and culture or otherwise. In any case we can't really control what makes us feel sick or disgusts us. The OP saying on a public forum that being in that particular setting would disgust her is not disrespecting your culture, it's free speech. But of course you are free to feel offended.

Not RTFT but seriously - why do managers think they can dictate to their colleagues like this?

It's not hard to find a restaurant that suits vegans, vegetarians and meat-eaters. People don't generally mind someone eating meat next to them, but in the scenario you describe I'd find it horrible too (I don't eat red meat but will eat chicken).

Also if it's in the evening, why do you need to take leave if you don't attend?

Manager needs to grow up, and fast.

As for the racecourse thing, also ridiculous.

If you meet your targets and do your job well, that is all that matters. There is no need to socialise with work colleagues out of hours.

A team lunch would be much more appropriate in any event.

I agree with you. I’d hate that too. I’ve also refused to go to the races with work for the same reasons as you. My Dad was a vet so I know too well how those beautiful horses suffer while everyone focuses on wearing pretty hats & quaffing down fizz. Stick to your guns!

Your manager is trying to project big swinging dick energy with his choice of venues and events to the teams from down south. It all sounds like the 80s/90s City culture. I should imagine that HR might need to have a word to explain that things are more toned down and less overtly sexist than they once were. As the only woman do you feel out on a limb in other areas? How far do you want to fight this and what back-up do you think you’ll have from HR and those above both you and him?
I’d go for the drinks, starters, do the networking part and then leave them to it. They’ll all feel lethargic/bloated/hungover the next day. Take control of the situation and exit in style. Then ahead of the next event make some suggestions yourself of more inclusive places

But what was your point? What doesn’t make sense about ‘a vegetarian who also sometimes eats cheese’?

I'm somewhat on the fence on this.

In defence of Fazenda I actually think their salad bar is amazing but then many of the things I love - smoked salmon, prawns etc - wouldn't be of use to a vegetarian.

I also sometimes choose their vegetarian/vegan meal in preference- I find it a bit anxiety making waiting to see what meat comes round and not being able to relax at your dinner - and their selection is better than that at many normal restaurants.

It's also a fixed price - albeit expensive- which is a good idea with a works night out as can control the budget.

But I can't see the issue with you just going for drinks and excusing yourself from the meal.

Exactly this, @Lazykitten .
I’d also not want to go to a racecourse (NH most likely) where horses die.
Such noble animals and their racing injuries are often so severe, it usually mean euthanasia if they take a bad fall.

It's notdirint work hours though. Or at least only an hour of it is. You are not obliged to go OP I don't see why you need to book a days leave either. Just do your normal work day

But you are supporting horseracing by money passing into the racetrack's coffers.

I think your team leader is being ridiculous and should have asked the team where they wanted to go, especially since it's supposed to be a reward for hitting targets, etc. If he wanted a fancy meat restaurant you could go to Hawksmoor which also has some veggie options. HR should pull him up on not being inclusive of the whole team.

but its a disgust of meat, not a disgust of you. The smell of coconut turns my stomach. I have friends who eat and enjoy food with coconut in and I am not disgusted by them but I still find the smell nauseating.