To not want to go to Rome with Mil

[theotherfossilsister]

Mil can be very nice. She is great with ds, but there is a lot of tension between us. Dp is an only child and his dad died in November. We went to stay with her for two weeks after this although we live in the same city. I understand why. It was a big trauma for her and dp. My own dad died when I was pregnant with ds which was also hard, but I was very focused on the pregnancy then. I'm also one of four and lucky to have a brother who lives near my mum and supported her. I know it's harder for only children. My mum lives in France so it's a long way to go.

Mil and sadly fil to an extent massively overstepped when ds was born. He was in neonatal for a long stay and they'd turn up when they knew I had my breastfeeding support, and insist on coming in, so I had to go and sit in the pumping room while they held ds. Dp didn't stand up to me and I felt very vulnerable. Later I ended up in mother and baby unit.

There were other things too, like during my pregnancy I broke my arm and shoulder and could literally do nothing for myself but the week I had surgery for it they decided to go to Fils home town for two nights and take dp. They said it was very important dp went as his dad was ill, etc, but I was having a general anaesthetic (really bad break otherwise they'd not have done it when pregnant.) In the end the consultant told dp he needed to stay, and sadly for pils fil was too unwell to go anyway.

Stupid little things like this still really rankle still. It feels like mil doesn't see me as important.

I'm currently really agorophobic but working with an OT on exposure therapy. One of the things which feeds agrophobia is shame so I'm trying really hard to not be ashamed, but mil doesn't believe my agrophobia is real. I have an exaggerated freeze reflex where I literally freeze so hard that I fall over and I am carry a walking stick for this, recommend, but mil is disgusted by this. I'm working on getting well so hard and also on accepting and coexisting with the agrophobia.

It's really hard but I'm making progress

Dp wants to take Mil to Rome at the end of this month, and as it's important to her that DS comes I need to come as well, because I simply cannot be away from my twenty month old for five nights. I'm dreading this trip but understand it's something mil needs after her bereavement.

I also have limited annual leave and I'm trying to use it to write. Lots going on. I'm dreading this trip though

And yes, I know Rome is lovely.

This is a very good point!

OP I think the answer is simple, though not easy. Tell DH that decisions about where DS does and doesn't go need to be in his best interest. Going on a trip to Rome is not in his best interest (take it from me, I took an 18 month old to Delhi and it was an absolute nightmare trying to combine a city break with a young toddler, and I've been to Rome and think that would be equally challenging). What is DP's rationale for why he won't go without DS? I would also say to him that his mother will need dedicated time and attention from him that he won't be able to give if he's wrangling a toddler - MIL presumably now spends a lot of time alone so dedicated one to one time would be nice for her. If it were me I'd put my foot down and say DS is not going unless they choose a more toddler friendly destination. If you do end up going, make sure you choose a hotel with a pool and a restaurant and then you and DS can hang out there for much of the time so it's less intense with MIL (perhaps you could even get a villa with a private pool, perhaps better for your agoraphobia?).

There are loads of places to stay outside Rome that aren’t so busy and won’t be a worry for you. Why not book a cottage and MIL and dh can take the train into Rome or busier places to site see when they want to. You can stay away from all that with your dc if you want to.
We took ours abroad to busy places and walked round museums and went into restaurants all the time, they didn’t kick off or get bored.

For 5 days I think that could be a lovely break for you all.

A child able to walk easily, all day, is a million miles away from bumping a buggy over cobbles and up stairs.

A Toddler won't even know he is in Rome.
My parents took me round Europe from 5 onwards - I remember the golden horses heads above shops in Northern France as a first memory - and assumed them to be saddler's shops.

Mum pulled a sad face and said ''Not saddlers.. ''Chevaline''... Horse butchers.

Europe was very different then...Dieppe was a beautiful port and the small ferries used to pull up alongside the old port.

They no longer do.

Pic of the heads that I thought were saddler's signs.

As much as your husband is weak so are you! How you didn't tell your in laws that they would have to wait when visiting you in the hospital at the wrong time! Now stand up to your mil and husband and say you are not prepared to travel. Tough if it means so much to get them she can wait.

I am picking up on this bit of a post you made @theotherfossilsister "Things are complicated by the fact that dp visited my own mum with me last month in France"

Things are not complicated at all.

These are two very different scenarios.

You needed the physical support of you DP while you visited with your mother last month. He doesn't need your physical support. He might appreciate your emotional support but you can still be supportive by actually not being there. Both he and his mother will be able to negotiate Rome without you being there. You will be able to attend to your baby without MiL being around too.
This trip is for them and not for you.

If your DP can't see that, then you have a bigger issue and it's not about your MiL - it's very much to do with your DP.

Sending you lots of strength.

Rome with a toddler would be very exhausting. It is a busy and tiring city (in a good way).
it's not really for under 10's imo

When are they planning to go? Remind them how hot Rome was last year at the height of the summer. Dragging a small toddler about in 35-40 degree heat wouldn’t be fair.

Edited - ignore me, I can see now you say it’s the end of this month, sorry!

Not the same ! Did you visit your mum at her home?

Make sure you discuss this at counselling. He's far too enmeshed with his mum at your expense?

Are you still breastfeeding? That's a reason your child can't go without you.

And how hands-on is MiL anyway?

Because she'll miss him?

It's not an unusual response

Why is your MIL disgusted by you using a walking stick? I think she sounds like a nasty judgemental bitch. You need to use your stick. It’s an essential mobility aid to stop you injuring yourself during your freeze response. She is a truly horrible person for expecting you to manage without it. Would she push someone out of wheelchair and expect them to walk? Or hide an asthma inhaler from someone with breathing problems?

Sorry to say it, but your DP is almost as bad as his mother for not standing up for you. You are getting treated and dealing with a debilitating MH condition. He needs to understand that your recovery depends on him being supportive and kind towards you.

Rome is not a suitable location for you or your child. Tell DP that neither you or DS will be going, but he is welcome to go away with his mother.

The main point that you need to explain to the counsellor is that DP doesn’t listen to you or respect you. He is scared of his mother, who is cruel and domineering towards you.

No, no and no. You need to set some boundaries now. If you give in to this then what is next? Your MIL is now on her own - will she be part of all future holidays and family occasions? She needs to make her own life and your husband needs to start standing up to her. Of course he can go away with her but you don't have to go. I am sure they will have quality time without you and your son there. Please start putting your foot down.

Missing your point about your MIL here but wouldn't a zimmerframe in front of you be more helpful than a walking stick if you're falling over? I'm disabled and I do have a walking stick but I don't find it particularly useful to be honest. I realise this is a totally different reason than with a disability but I do know that a walking stick won’t stop you falling over. Even if you've a tiny, petite frame

I would also think that a break away from your child for a few days (and that is all that it is, a few days) would do you the power of good.

I don't know if you've been apart from your child for any considerable length of time but this would be as good an opportunity to be apart. It's with your MiL who you yourself say is good with your son. Your DP will also get their eyes opened as to how difficult it is to get out and about in a major city with a baby and might appreciate a little more (though it shouldn't take a trip to Rome for that to happen) what you're going through.

Definitely talk it over during your session.

How come 1 dm is insisting on being with her ds but the other one is being unreasonable to want to be with her ds? 1 being a toddler and the other a fully grown man....
Mil is a sly fox imo.
And dh a sap.
Is Rome very buggy friendly? Can hardly be letting your ds out and about by the sounds of the city from other posters...

Totally unreasonable of your DP. And so what if MIL is disappointed? It's their own making, not yours. Let go of whatever guilt you are carrying. They can go. And it will be a hell of a lot more enjoyable without a toddler.

There is NO comparison between Rome and someone's home in rural France. None.

Also, the crowds in Rome in summer season would make anyone shudder!!!

Re: the Rome issue, I have to say that I'm on the fence about but. You definitely do have a DP problem, I quite agree with the others. However refusing to be away from an almost 2 year old for a few nights is a bit unfair. If you and DP split, you could potentially be away from him for a couple of weeks if he took him on holiday and you wouldn't have a say in it.

I think there's a huge difference between rural France and someone's home v Rome - a major European tourist attraction!

It's good that you're having couples counselling. I hope you can use that to discuss your DP's apparent lack of respect for you and inability to be an adult where his mother is concerned. Seriously, Rome is the smaller issue here. If you aren't able to sort out respect, boundaries and better communication, then you will have years of being treated like you don't matter, and your son will grow up absorbing that behaviour, until you decide you've had enough. I hope the counselling is early enough to enable you to make changes.

I would suggest you all take a sightseeing trip to London (or other major city) for the day trying to replicate what a day in Rome might be like with a toddler in tow. It will be unenjoyable and might make DP see 5 days in Rome with a toddler to appease his DM is absolutely bonkers.

What makes her needs take priority over yours? If you give in now, you will create a precedent and be expected to repeat.

it's important to her that DS comes

Its way more important to ds that you're well.

If I knew your dh I would tell him for you that you're not going. But I can't so I'll just have to support you to tell him instead.

Good luck.

This.

He's not listened to how YOU feel. He's only listening to his mum and what he wants.

Reflect on your invisibility.

I'm sorry I can't wrap my head around this. You have been very unwell mentally and physically and you have a small child. Its a total nonstarter.

You know you are ALLOWED to be selfish at times, right? If there are circumstances where it would harm you, not to be for example.