To want every woman in England to vote Tory at the GE

[Hurrydash]

Wow. I started a thread with 1000 posts on a topic in 12 hours and Mumsnet got ‘full’

One more off the bucket list!

So MN told me to start a new thread if I wanted to post anything else. I didn’t particularly but there were some queries raised in the first thread.

Thank you to all first thread posters, even the small minority who were abusive to me and/or my opinions. Coherent arguments may have been more persuasive.

I have read many posts, but not all. I do have work to do!

In answer to some queries:

Yes I was drunk - explains GR typo in the first title not GE. Although that could well have been a Freudian slip too.

I am English living in England.

I’m not an entitled git living in a Stately home eating cucumber sandwiches. Like most I have been hit very hard by mortgage rate and utility price rises.

I restricted my request to English voters because I don’t understand other UK countries voter motivations.

a) Scotland has voted in a party which in my opinion is morally bankrupt (maybe financially too?) and totally incompetent.

b) Wales has elected a party which means when they go for a drive they’ll likely be overtaken by cyclists - maybe very fit joggers too

c) I genuinely don’t understand Northern Ireland politics. Didn’t even know there were no Tories there till reading it on one of the posts.

Totally get why so many won’t vote Tory, but for me freedom of speech is a die in a ditch issue.

Here’s what Angela Eagle is reported to have said will be in the Labour manifesto:

“• Strengthening the law so anti-LGBT+ hate crimes are treated as aggravated offenses”

For this I read anyone stating biological facts risks being banged up. JKR no doubt top of their hit list.

So give me another option to stop this madness other than vote Tory.

If all posters on the first thread had said they weren’t going to vote Labour due to their threat to women’s rights maybe Labour would have paused for thought about their policies. But seems very many women will vote Labour anyway so they don’t have to worry.

Very very happy to vote Labour and kick the Tories out if they will commit unequivocally to protect women’s rights, parents rights and freedom of speech. Otherwise not a chance.

Show me the waiting times,

The data on NHS waiting times is easy to find. I'm sure however that you will find a way to spin it and say that they've improved under the Tories.

The UNICEF report measures the rate of change, not an absolute number. Acceleration, not velocity.

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn07096/

Poverty in the UK: statisticsResearch Briefing
Published Friday, 01 December, 2023

No, you show me. It’s your argument not mine.

Wales has elected a party which means when they go for a drive they’ll likely be overtaken by cyclists - maybe very fit joggers too ... Totally get why so many won’t vote Tory, but for me freedom of speech is a die in a ditch issue.

for me and my family, cycling is a "die in a ditch" issue, quite literally... I'll be voting Labour mainly for environmental reasons. It's the most important issue IMO, and even if they've ditched the big plan, I still think they'll step up - certainly more than the Tories.

Oh, but how did these left leaning policies even appear under the evil Conservatives who have the total destruction of the country as their ultimate goal?
Yes, I have very little tolerance for hard left views. People who tend to hold them usually have very little actual idea of how the socialist utopia really looks like.

It says

The increase in child poverty over the period means that as many as half a million more children lived in poverty in the UK in 2021 compared to 2012. Child poverty rates in the UK are therefore the worst among the world’s wealthiest nations.

They inherited them and have been trying to destroy them for 14 years. I remember this country under the last Labour government when we had decent public services. It wasn’t utopia but it was functional.

You can always vote for a bit more of this

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-68701486

Boat Race: Oxford rowers criticise sewage levels in River Thames

But this again is on the relative poverty definition basis.

Is relative poverty ok then?

You realise that the conservatives didn’t implement the policies you speak about in your previous post?

You are making yourself look quite silly.

Well, this is anecdotal evidence. I moved to the UK in 2010, and from my own perception the healthcare system was broken even then. Used to go back home for medical / dental, until I could afford medical insurance here (still go back for dental).

NHS - collapsing but no more funding.

Rwanda scheme - unworkable but unlimited funding.

I am ok with looking silly, don't have any insecurity on that front. That's how we all learn.
Relative poverty will exist everywhere, just by the definition of it. In Sweden that is so often praised on MN as the socialist heaven on Earth, 12% of children live in relative poverty.

You have options, pay or go to another country

Never mind people without those options

I came here before the Blair government and never had the need to go back home for medical treatment as the NHS was very good.

But it doesn’t appear like you are open to learning? You have your stance and that’s it, even when proved wrong.

NHS ranking in 2010 (published in 2013, but I think some of the data is from 2010, but significant that all the data is from before Lansley's reforms took hold).

I don't have time for a full research on the topic for the purposes of the internet discussion. Will a specific counterexample work? Say Poland, a country spending almost half of what the UK does.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36583328/

29% in the UK and rising:

Is it rising in Sweden?

Thank you! It is surprising that with all formal metrics being #1, the NHS is the last on the "healthy lives" metric.

Yes, rising in Sweden too.

I can't see where I have been proven wrong. Insulted, yes. Proven wrong with numbers or facts, no.

It almost sounds like you are ok with rising child poverty as long as children are becoming poorer in other countries too.

Strange.

I just posted some facts to counteract your assertion that the NHS was broken as far back as 2010.

And what about all the rest of the rankings?