To think change is desperately needed in schools?

[GibberingPeck]

I work with young children. Today I was hit twice and scratched on the face so hard it drew blood. This has not happened to me before and I’ve worked in schools for many years. I was trying to stop a child hurting another child. The school’s stance seems to be that I shouldn’t have intervened or somehow dealt with the situation badly. I think they saw I was bleeding, but ignored it as they have so much to deal with. This year, I think I’ve seen more violent and aggressive behaviour from children than I’ve ever seen. And no way of dealing with it - it seems to have become acceptable or ‘the norm’.

I'm in Scotland. Started teaching in '84. It's been getting gradually worse over the years.

I quit in 2018 because of my husband's ill health. Now that I'm a widow I've gone back part-time to top up my reduced teaching pension.

It was bad before; it's immeasurably worse now. My HT told me to expect to be sworn at. I didn't think they'd be prepared to take on someone in her 60s...She actually told me "We just need a warm body in front of the classes." (This is secondary.)

I'm seeing teenagers openly vaping in corridors, etc... Stopped an assault in progress one day; broke up a fight the next.

Behaviour of some pupils is absolutely feral. I feel sorry for those who want to learn.

I was initially told that I could see what I think of the place and then accept a contract if I wanted it...I've never heard the like. I've told them I prefer to keep it casual.

Bluntly, they'll take me for as many hours as I'm prepared to offer - they're so short staffed.

There’s a hell of a lot of adults in their 30’s and 40’s being currently diagnosed with ADHD and Autism. We were just told we were lazy at school. Many of us broke down in our teens, I’m in my 40’s but self injury, eating disorders, severe depression were rife amongst my friends. Many of whom have now been diagnosed with the above.

@Walkiesandtalkies 100 per cent true.

Those blaming parenting - look around the streets where you live - look at the thousands and thousands of cars that now line the streets instead of large numbers of children playing - 20/ 30 years ago - ALL children played outside for large parts of their waking day - every single day. They learnt how to get along with others, how to self regulate - they made decisions, took risks.

There was also usually a parent around at home a lot more than now.

There were not as many after school clubs, I don't think I knew anyone who went to one - I had a working mum but parents took turns picking us up and sharing playdates.

Children are literally not living how they should be - ie how they evolved to live. They are not playing, they are not free .

And the shift towards screens for toddlers - that has happened even since my 11 year old was a baby (when it was unusual for a child to watch tv before about 2 or 3) - is incredible and alarming.

I imagine there will be some kids in each class who were brought up in homes where parents were on screens most of the time, staring at phones or watching tv.

Yes to this.

I actually think this is one of the biggest problems. Social media fuelled blame culture. It's so easy to point the finger at the state and the Tories and cuts and this and that. I'm not for once second saying what's happening with lack of services is right, BUT this blame culture is sick. When Boris was in office there was a point where people were blaming him for the failures of private companies and he rightly said that it's not the govts responsibility to bail out every badly managed company. That's not how the world works.
As lovely as diagnosing all these kids would be, what are we actually trying to achieve here? Most NHS services start and end at diagnosis. There was a mum on another thread desperate for an ADHD diagnosis as she would expect the school to then bend to her daughters needs. Wtf?? This is the attitude so many parents now have. A diagnosis that absolves all responsibility from the parent/ blame the govt cuts as that does the same. That's the two things that seem to be happening en masse

@Sherrystrull that is sad - I think phones are to blame. JUst total addiction among that age group.

Exactly! Having to put up with vile behaviour and gang pack culture while watching every word u say and the pressure from above to be perfect at marking, classroom management and results when trying to get blood out of a rock even in gcse classes is unbelievable!

Some parents are so quick to judge something their child has said and looking for blood in a rampage (can see where their dc get it from) and kick off not knowing or even trying to know the real events. That poor teacher is taking 5 mins at the end of the day for a wee, have a hot coffee for the first time in the day, Mark books they know will take forever as, despite explaining every little thing, some will rip pages, do no work.

Eh u said our Jake was stupid and couldn't have his dinner. Erm no, I said he was acting in a silly way and had the choice to stop throwing stuff around the room or would have to stay behind to pick up his mess and then go to lunch. In detention situations meals are reserved. Hey go to the papers and complain about it, your dc is getting a free hot reserved meal and they refuse to have it, offered sandwiches, still refuse! I mean, really, parents please support teachers!

This was all done before, in the 1970s.

It was a horrible failure back then too.

I’m sure it’s parents on phones rather than interacting with their children

I fourth it.
My cohort this year are by far the worst I have ever had and lots seems to be down to parenting. I have several 4 years old with no additional needs who are not toilet trained, one of which is often still breast fed at the door before they come in each morning.

Listening and attention is incredibly far behind what I would expect at this point in the year and so is their PSED. Many are unable to tolerate delay or respond to simple day-to-day demands such as washing hands before snack without becoming physically aggressive. I am hit, kicked and bitten on a regular basis, again by children who have no additional needs. When I speak to parents they often just shrug. We struggle in nursery with a high adult:child ratio, heaven knows how Reception will cope when they move up.

How stuff can be misinterpreted -
My friend had a parent come storming up to her saying "Don't you fucking dare say we're poor"
Friend had absolutely no idea what this tirade was about.

Turns out she'd told the child off for not getting on with her work and had said, "You can't afford to waste time - you need to get on with your work"
The only word the child had heard was afford, so had gone home and told her mother "The teacher said we can't afford stuff"

So many times parents come barging in without finding out the whole story. However, they're not in the slightest bothered by it.

That's why teachers are leaving in droves! Poor behaviour, lack of support from parents and management. It's been going this way for quite a while now. Trying to teach the new technology children, they are always fidgeting with the need for instant results and having their phones in their hands, remote, game consoles, etc. Bored within minutes and the death by PowerPoint doesn't help either. When I was a young teacher, I did interactive games, made them get up, move around, have fun, play, and learn, at secondary level! They enjoyed it and learnt by heart.

So glad I'm not I'm not starting out now, the behaviour and pressures from above with every move and a piece of data analysed is just unbearable.

If I went home from school in the 70s and told my mother the teacher had told me off she’d say “well you must have done something” I don’t recall her ever steaming up the school to eff and blind at the teacher. Parents were authority figures as were teachers. Kids were wrong. They could be told off. Nowadays it’s “rights” and entitlement gone way too far and run away with itself

But there are more children now than ever before getting diagnosed. There was for certain more undiagnosed ASD, ADHD, dyslexia in the 80s, and behaviour wasn't this challenging. There were definitely behaviour problems, don't get me wrong, but not of the scale or extent that we're seeing today.

So of course things could be even better if ALL children could quickly access diagnoses, and even more importantly support, but undiagnosed ND can't really explain the increase in violent behaviour among children.

You are correct. The first 2 years (if I remember correctly) are key so lots of face to face talking, interactions etc rather than plonking in front of screens. Taking them out to new and interesting places (not just to the shops on a weekend) and really engaging with your DC.

I work with many of the most dysregulated, aggressive children in the city I live in (ones who have been removed from mainstream due to behaviour). Almost all of them have been physically abused by parents or witnessed domestic violence. Children who live in fear are unable to learn or develop emotional regulation skills. Fear and punishment is not the answer it's the root of the problem. Apart from kids who have asn, it's usually trauma that is the reason.

My experience is that parents feel like their child can do no wrong, despite considerable evidence to contrary!

Honestly, my eldest might be one of these (if she weren't home educated).

But she gets relatively little screen time (lots of hours when ill, but that's rare, and usually less than 2 hours a week). She has lots of time outside playing energetically, lots of playdates as well as all the time with siblings, lots of visits to relatives, lots of downtime for free time at home, nearly every meal eaten together as a family around the table, and a mostly home-cooked diet that's full of fruit and veg and goodness and low in UPFs.

And yet she has severe ADHD - probably genetic. Plus a significant speech delay. Her vocabulary is years ahead, but her articulation is terrible so it's hard to understand her. I don't know why - we talk so much together as a family. I really did try with potty training and from an early age - she was 90% trained aged 1, but she was still having accidents aged 5 and isn't night trained.

And the last three weeks she's started having violent tantrums. I'm beside myself with worry. I'm clearly not a great parent, but I'm truly trying so hard. Certainly not lazy or unwilling to discipline or thinking she's someone else's "problem".

Professionals sometimes offer helpful tweaks to our routines/habits/strategies, but nothing major. Every single one has told me what a wonderful mother I am- I know I'm not, but I don't know how to improve things.

Please don't think all the parents of these children with SEN are lazy or too arrogant to listen to advice, or even just working long hours away from their children. I have no idea why my child is one of the "problem" ones, but it's not for lack of effort on my part 😞

No my point is I don’t think there is any actual increase in the percentage of children with ADHD etc. it’s just recognised more now.

The increase in violence is from a different cause in my opinion.

Teachers know all this but are bound by Gove's 2014 curriculum and Ofsted. It goes against our training (well, certainly mine) and child development / psychology. Yet another reason why teachers are leaving. We know what's wrong but are powerless to correct it.

How many times do we read on here about parents going in "All guns blazing" if there is an issue at school?

Why do guns need to blaze? Why not just have a conversation? Hear what the school staff have to say?

I was working in the 70s like several of my friends. DH and I shared childcare, we had no family nearby and nurseries were non existent where we lived. My children turned out OK, and my teenage grandchildren, whose parents all work get good reports at school.

I’d like to bet that many of the children who are not school ready don’t have full time working parents. I see parents not engaging with small children, preferring instead to look at their phones. @OldChinaJug you have my sympathy, as do many of today’s teachers.

I certainly don't judge you! There have always been children with SEND, and there have always been a small number with really very extreme behavioural difficulties, disregulation, sensory overload, meltdowns etc, and I've always felt this is entirely innate, and not a product of environment or parenting.

But there seems to be an explosion in the sheer numbers of children who are falling into this category these days. And some of those must be in part down to something we're doing differently as a society these days.

What’s happening in schools is just a reflection of what is happening in society in general. People no longer have respect for authority, for others, or themselves. I’m currently job hunting for a TA job supporting the teacher in class and doing small group work, but all the job adverts are for TAs to do 1-1 support with children with behaviour problems. That’s what I currently do and I’m looking for an out because it’s fucking dreadful.

Screens for parents and screens for kids. Both distracted and neither engaging with the other. I see it all over the place. Went to a family wedding last year. The adults on our table constantly faffing with their phones and the kids were handed tablets as soon as they sat down. We had no conversations on our table outside of our immediate family.

When both parents are working full time they find it easier to parent a screen-sedated kid. Cartoons are a catastrophe for language learning - infants pick up language by watching mouths as people talk and animation just can’t show that effectively. Plus cartoons can be paused, stopped, started and changed at will - there is no learning the give and take of conversation. As a society we should be supporting small kids to be able to stay with a parent as much as possible rather than shoehorning children into expensive nurseries.