WWYD: Son and Money

[ClamFandango]

DS (15yo) gets £60per month allowance, from which he pays for his phone contract (sim only: £6), and all non-school uniform clothes plus socialising, snacks etc.
He is not good at saving, although we encourage him to save £30 per month - so that it doesn't all get spent on snacks and small things. On top of that he will usually ask for money from family for birthday and Christmas, and usually gets given about £150 in total each time. He tends to save up for a bit and then blow the lot on a big ticket item (usually equipment for his music hobby, clothes or gifts for friends).
He recently bought his sister a v generous birthday gift, and a valentine gift for his girlfriend. Then he dropped his mobile phone and it broke - repair cost barely less than replacement (with secondhand reconditioned phone), so he spent £200 on a new secondhand phone, which cleaned his savings out and we had to advance him £60, which wipes out his next two months' savings (so his allowance is down to £30 per month, which is generally earmarked for phone contract and snacks at school).
This morning he was sad that he won't be able to buy his best friend a birthday present next month, and got very defensive when I suggested he was angling for a further loan / more cash from us. I said he wasn't getting any more money from me beyond the allowance, less the loan he already owes, and he had to learn to save more prudently.

We could afford to give him something to buy the friend a present, but the purpose behind the allowance is to teach him budgeting. We feel so mean saying "tough luck - you've spent up and that's it. Tell your friend you'll get him something in a couple of months' time". AIBU to take this stance?

Whether it's £5.60 p/w for all snacks including snacks for school, gifts and socialising, or £13.80 p/w for all snacks inc. school snacks, gifts, socialising, clothes, footwear, phone contract and savings, it's still inadequate. And if it's genuinely all OP can afford, then there are benefits and food/clothing banks available.

Think it’s dreadful you make a child buy their own clothes to be fair

It seems a bit low when he is just a child. If he has to buy casual outerwear too, that would be pricey. And paying for a new phone has wiped him out. Although I certainly can appreciate that you say it’s what you can afford and are teaching him budgeting.
I would give him the cash for the gift as otherwise he will look mean in front of his friends.
I was also going to ask whether you might have phone insurance in some other policy that would cover it. We have a monthly bank payment of £15 (First Direct) which covers travel, phones and the RAC (all a lot cheaper than the separate parts).

He's under 18 he shouldnt be buying his own clothes. Even if it's with your money you're expecting him to socialise and buy his own clothes on £24pm. Not happening. He should already have a wardrobe 'full' of clothing that you've gone "ok ds is growing, he needs new stuff, let's go buy it" after you've kit him out then anything he WANTS is on him but you should be buying the necessities out of your own purse not his pocket money. Also I'm a grown woman and I wouldn't be able to spend £200 without borrowing 🤷 so you're being harsh there too.

But it isn't - OP also clearly states that she covers his school lunch account, extra-curricular activities and when her son goes out she gives him a tenner to cover food. Plus the £300+ per year he gets for Christmas and birthdays for bigger purchases.

OP also says "Thankfully they socialise quite cheaply - after school activities, and only the occasional weekend in town" and that his slightly younger sister is managing to save on a smaller amount and buy plenty of clothes.

You should have replaced his phone for him... that's really harsh not to do so as a one-off.

I am confused by which way round you look at this - you give him extra money for lunch out with friends? I would have thought his allowance needs to cover his incidental spends like this, and you clothe him properly.

You also say you're on a tight budget but can afford to give him extra... which is it?

Despite the harsh word choice I agree. Growing up I was forced to get a Saturday job and as soon as I did I was responsible for buying all my own clothes, toiletries, snacks etc. I never had enough money to buy want I needed let alone what I actually wanted. It did not help build a good relationship with money, if anything it made a bad one as when I actually had a grown up job and access to credit cards I spent as I finally could.

My daughter isn't as old yet but I won't be making her buy her own clothes, they aren't a luxury they are a necessity. She had pocket money, she is encouraged to save (and does) and is learning that when she wants soemthing she has to save for it.

I think you must have missed the bit where the OP says he is on his fourth phone in six years.

Not really sure how kids are supposed to learn to look after them if they are getting bailed out every time they break them.

Out in the real world actions have consequences. Or at least they did for me when I was a kid.

At 15 I gave my daughter her child benefit. That was roughly £90 I think. That had to cover bus fares and lunches for school and any other leisure stuff. I bought her clothes and essentials.

Even shit trainers are £60.

That's a sixth of his entire 'disposable' spends after what he's been told to save. I'm on a tight budget op, and my kids respect that, but ALL of his clothes that aren't undies, uniform or coat is really unreasonable.

^^This.
Effectively he only has £30/month doesn’t he? You sound very unreasonable and controlling, not to mention smug.
Poor kid, I trust he tells his friends the truth why he can’t join them etc, it’s because his mother controls his life.

Exceptionally generous!? Are you having a joke?

I only have one child.

Her monthly costs are (roughly, for a standard month at school, not school holidays) and not including needing new shoes etc

Bus fare - £60
Lunch money - £80
Phone bill - £24
Pocket money - £40
Floating money I set aside to top her up for things like meeting a friend for lunch - £30

So that's £234 a month.

She wants mainly branded clothes but is a Vinted demon and the majority come from there, with basics and underwear from Primark. I cover pretty much all of this, she wanted an expensive coat that even second hand was £70, she offered to pay half, I said I'd go £50/20 and we did a deal. I probably spend about £300 a year on clothes and shoes, give or take. She will also get about £200 at her birthday and Christmas from various relatives which she'll use to buy specific things she has her eye on.

So that's about 3k a year. Plus school uniform and school trips (4k over the last 3 years).

And no, I'm not rolling in money. And no, her dad doesn't for pay anything.

I got £50 pm 20 years ago and definitely didn't save a penny so he's being quite responsible managing save £30 monthly and pay for his own new phone.

I don think he should have to be paying for his clothes unless they're big ticket or expensive items.
Maybe a contribution towards very expensive trainers etc.

If its a financial burden for you can you support him towards a saturday job?

But also he isn't obligated to buy friends gifts and maybe they can just hang out instead.

You'd be thrown by my family growing up then. When my brother was 12 he moved from "pocket money" to an allowance, and I was offered the same. So I brought my own clothes from 10 (nearly 11) years old. Like OPs son, parents bought uniform, including underwear and tights, and I had to budget my allowance to cover anything I wanted, including cinema trips, jeans, tops, and later make up. Oh, and contact lenses, although generally they'd be birthday / Christmas presents. Parents bought specs and family toiletries, anything fancy I had to budget for myself. I learnt that anything I really wanted I could afford, but that I couldn't afford everything. Great life lesson.
I can't fathom being 15 and still having your parents buy your clothes. It strikes me as a bit stultifying, but families are different, I'm not disgusted by it. OP like my parents, is providing funds, the teens need to choose how to cut their cloth.

My parents gave me my child benefit at 15. They covered my phone contract and clothes unless it was something in particular I wanted for example Ugg boots then I would put my birthday and Christmas money towards them. It does seem a bit harsh tbh. I would be looking around 20pw and you cover his basic clothes.

it sounds like he needs phone insurance...

You're really harsh tbh with your expectations. I feel a bit mean sometimes when I insist my DC save for something more expensive out of their allowance when they have to cover their sports complex costs and anywhere else with friends and I give them a bit more than that and pay for their phones and clothes because they're still at school and not working. £60 a month for what you expect goes nowhere nowadays. Sorry.

i imagine you put 50% of your income straight into savings too?

Also - asking a 15 YO to buy his own clothes?? How tight are you!

I'm sorry but your parents bought you CONTACT LENSES as a present? No wonder you don't think the OP is being unreasonable. Your parents were worse than she is!

If he has an ounce of initiative, there's masses of mucky cars out there need cleaning.

(Amazed that next door but one get a firm in practically every week to clean 3 cars when they have 3 hulking teenage boys only one of whom seems to play a team sport, the other 2 don't seem to do anything much)

I think what you're doing is fine in principle, but I do think that t-shirts, jumpers, trousers and shoes should also be covered by you, the parents. If he wants a jumper because all his friends have the same one etc then he can buy it himself.

As for things like birthday presents, if you can, just give him an extra tenner. Here and there it's not a massive problem. He is doing better than most adults I know tbh.

I think that's mean.
My nine year old Grandson gets £10 a week ( so £40).He doesn't buy his clothes.. snacks or any essentials.
He will save for a toy or game...or things he might want to buy on holidays..
But my gosh you can't expect him to save £30 a month and buy his own clothes.. trainers are expensive and hoodie etc.

Why is he spending £150 a time on presents for family (that you are funding)? It is such a waste.

Put a limit for everyone of £30 for birthdays and Christmas..

Why are you not paying to clothe your child? That's really shit. Are you not able to suck up the £6/month phone?