That puberty blockers should not be promoted for children by any charities or celebrities for children.

[WandaWomblesaurus]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-68549091.amp

https://archive.ph/hmIvY

Loads of news today about the NHS stopping puberty blockers being given to children who think they are trans. Puberty blockers are sometimes prescribed for children who have precocious puberty, however a narrative that has been pushed by Mermaids, Stonewall and celebrities like India Willoughby and Emma Watson (who gave a large donation to Mermaids) - that puberty blockers are safe and "lifesaving"

WPATH guidelines in the USA which the UK NHS have followed in procedure have had leaked documents and videos showing that they knew that children didn't have the ability to understand the long term effects.

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/mar/09/disturbing-leaks-from-us-gender-group-wpath-ring-alarm-bells-in-nhs

https://archive.ph/h0BtF

And a new Finnish Study debunks the idea that children who say they are trans are more suicidal https://archive.ph/h0BtF

However Mermaids, Stonewall and India Willoughby are pushing puberty blockers as safe.

https://x.com/stonewalluk/status/1767603259932361036?s=

https://www.tiktok.com/@mermaidsgenderr*/photo/7345520902936726816?isfrommwebapp=1&senderdevice=mobile&senderrweb_id=7345629783211378209

https://x.com/indiawilloughby/status/1767595379921404151?s=46

AIBU to think that anyone pushing puberty blockers at this point is unethical? And that they should never have been allowed to be given to children who did not need them for precocious puberty where the risks are weighed up against the side effects and they are only used short term?

I would like to see these individuals and organisations pushing puberty blockers onto youngsters dragged through the courts.

Honestly, how do you 'regulate' for a child to have a limited intimate life where they cannot orgasm, and where they have lost their fertility, and likely to then be a life long patient, albeit it may be a shortened life, based on a philosophical belief in an identity?

Now that studies are showing that the drugs are also not 'life saving', what is it about this area of medicine is it that you feels warrants such a low standard of care?

Same

As I understand it the majority of young people in this situation, if left alone, will realise that they are not trans. So part of the issue for me is that you end up medicating a lot of children, with all the risks that entails, unnecessarily. And there are risks, it's not a harmless 'pause' button. Even when used for precocious puberty, there is the potential for long term, serious, effects on health.

Add in the number of children identifying as trans with trauma or other issues, which appear to be glossed over almost entirely, and any attempt to suggest dealing with those issues first will have the activists up in arms over 'conversion therapy'.

Hopefully some proper research will be done now. Hopefully the young people already on PBs will be properly monitored and outcomes recorded.

I suspect it's only a matter of time, sadly. Keira was probably the first of many. And those who have suffered heavy damage, poor little Jazz Jennings comes to mind, compensation will not be a luxury but a necessity to deal with a life time of ill health, ongoing treatment and surgery, and a major impact on being able to earn a living. Done to a perfectly healthy kid with all their life chances intact and ahead of them.

I'm not a doctor or health care researcher who studies data from medical treatments but I know a large number due to my job. In order to get a job in my firm to interpret scientific studies, you have to have a PhD to even get an interview. I guess my point is that it's extremely difficult for any lay person to fully understand these studies and whether they are all agreeing or disagreeing, whether the study was well done or badly written (read anything by Ben goldacre to scare you about how badly medical studies can be set up, run and documented) and therefore come to any conclusions about what the long term impact may be. So maybe this is one of those decisions that should be left to the young person in conjunction with their doctors and guardians. Rather than a lot of people online deciding that it should be stopped across the board with, and I include myself in this group, no qualifications to make that decision. Leave the experts to expert is my general rule.

I think I would want to know those numbers. So how many teenagers have issues and then how many of them decide to seek some kind of intervention. Of that group, how many seek medical intervention as opposed to therapy. Of the group that go down a medical route how many are accepted into some.kind of medical treatment. How many denied and why (is it because the decision is made it's not right at this time, or lack of funding/access or parental objections etc). Only that will really begin to give us clear indications of whether your assertion that 'most kids grow out of it' is correct.

And yet, the people who are clinicians and who DO have all those qualifications that you discuss are stating the same things as 'a lot of people online deciding that it should be stopped across the board'.

Would you care to tell us which of the studies that I have posted up thread are wrong? Would you care to tell us which of the experienced clinicians who are stating clearly there is no evidence and that these drugs need to be stopped being used for this purpose you disagree with?

Are you trying to declare that we should not discuss this here because we are not qualified and therefore we should leave it up to those qualified? Have you read the WPATH leaks report? Have you actually listened to the videos leaked? Do you understand that there are significant ethics issues here?

@VickyEadieofThigh

Puberty doesn't cure it for all. We have a trans relative who displayed dysphoria from a toddler - not expressed in a direct way at first, refusing to wear dresses, insisting on playing "boys" sports, pulling heads off dolls - only learned the concept of trans in their teens which was before the current explosion of cases. They are 29 now and very happily transitioned.

Personally I want to see far better support for young people struggling with mental health issues which may include trans. Medication arguements are simply a distraction, we need to start working out why it's become so common compared to before! I personally don't agree with medication under 18 unless in exceptional circumstances, but I think we should allow young people to be individuals rather than conforming to gender stereotypes without medical interventions.

So, you haven't done any reading on this issue and read the studies or the papers? I am happy to start posting more. I have the links handy.

There are some very articulate de-transitioners active on Twitter - some of whom are embarking on legal proceedings. We are at the very start of understanding the full horror of this.

My DD came home from school a couple of years ago, with the view (from a life skills or PSHE lesson) that puberty blockers were a good idea, and could be used to effectively "pause" puberty for those with gender dysphoria or felt conflicted about their gender.
There was no info on any long term impacts.

The decision has been made by experts

So far, there is scant evidence that these treatments provide benefits

Except for the well funded pressure groups, weaponising suicide and insisting on the cancellation of any kind of dissent and even questioning

Plenty of benefits for them ...

Leave the experts to expert is my general rule.

You sorely need to read the WPATH files.

Have you? It's all posted above.

These are the 'experts'. Have a read and let us know if you think this group are acting in children's best interests.

I think the release of the WPATH whistleblowing has been hugely influential in this decision.

Not that you'd know that from its coverage in mainstream media. 🙄

Following this material, it is no longer an option for the NHS to say they were following WPATH and were happy with their approach and credentials. A key foundation stone has been dislodged.

I think I would want to know those numbers. So how many teenagers have issues and then how many of them decide to seek some kind of intervention. Of that group, how many seek medical intervention as opposed to therapy. Of the group that go down a medical route how many are accepted into some.kindof medical treatment. How many denied and why (is it because the decision is made it's not right at this time, or lack of funding/access or parental objections etc). Only that will really begin to give us clear indications of whether your assertion that 'most kids grow out of it' is correct.

This conversation, the concerns, the whistleblowing, goes back years. This is not the beginning of a debate, its action taken by the NHS after years and years of debate. The Cass report is due in April and will cover some of this, you can read transcripts of court cases, the Bell one in particular, that looks at many of these issues. But frankly what we think at this point is irrelevant, the NHS has acted. Many other countries are acting similarly.

I didn't make it up, it's not my assertion, the stats are out there if you google.

As for how many receive treatment, well that's an interesting question isn't it. How many are getting meds online, bypassing the NHS? I know of people who have done that and it's a whole other area of concern.

This is really dangerous misinformation.

Yes. Very concerning

I think you might have missed my point which is that I have no idea whether the studies or the commentary on them is accurate, driven by any personal views or biases. I don't know those individuals commenting on any of the studies to know if they are experts in the field, reliable commentators or none of the above but these threads always seem to continue to quote people and organizations as gospel who I've never heard of and have no idea of their reliability to assess multiple studies and data. And please don't use the 'i'm trying to silence people' argument. I'm not silencing debate just suggesting that maybe, assuming neither of us or most of the people on this thread have any qualifications in medicine or the data fields, that whilst we can certainly have our own opinion, we might not be best placed to advocate for a complete shutdown of one branch of medicine. I would never have breast augmentation because the idea terrifies me but I accept for other people that maybe an option they choose to take. Medical treatments all have risks. I have monthly injections which can reduce my bone density but it's an informed decision I made in conjunction with my doctor because the treatment benefits out way the risks - for me. And that's my point. It's about a personal decision made with all the information available and with the support of people with better knowledge than me.

Again the question: should adults with alternative preferred realities be provided with a platform to speak with children when what they share will be their preferred edited reality alone? And children will innocently trust what they are told?

Here is that German review from 27th February 2024

Beyond NICE: Updated Systematic Review on the Current Evidence of Using Puberty Blocking Pharmacological Agents and Cross-Sex-Hormones in Minors with Gender Dysphoria

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38410090/

Results: The newly conducted literature search revealed no newly published original studies targeting NICE-defined critical and important outcomes and the related use of PB in minors with GD following PICO criteria. For CSH treatment, we found two new studies that met PICO criteria, but these particular two studies had low participant numbers, yielded no significant additional clear evidence for specific and clearly beneficial effects of CSH in minors with GD, and could be classified as "low certainty" tfollowing modified GRADE criteria. Conclusions: The currently available studies on the use of PB and CSH in minors with GD have significant conceptual and methodological flaws.
The available evidence on the use of PB and CSH in minors with GD is very limited and based on only a few studies with small numbers, and these studies have problematic methodology and quality. There also is a lack of adequate and meaningful long-term studies. Current evidence doesn't suggest that GD symptoms and mental health significantly improve when PB or CSH are used in minors with GD. Psychotherapeutic interventions to address and reduce the experienced burden can become relevant in children and adolescents with GD.

If the decision to use PB and/or CSH is made on an individual case-by-case basis and after a complete and thorough mental health assessment, potential treatment of possibly co-occurring mental health problems as well as after a thoroughly conducted and carefully executed individual risk-benefit evaluation, doing so as part of clinical studies or research projects, as currently done in England, can be of value in terms of generation of new research data. The electronic supplement (ESM) 1 is an adapted and abreviated English version of this work.

(I have added paragraphs for ease of reading)

And this is my bolded take out.
"Current evidence doesn't suggest that GD symptoms and mental health significantly improve when PB or CSH are used in minors with GD."

Me too,
It's heartbreaking.

Yes. I've seen training materials from a range of trans activist groups - all including the lie that puberty blockers pause puberty and are reversible. These materials are aimed at children, parents and adults who work with children - including medics. All promote immediate affirmation of children.
Most of these materials / training have to be purchased and there are sadly enough "useful idiots" working in education and health who purchase and disseminate them.
That's how all this works - to the financial & ideological benefit of queer theorists and to the detriment of children.