To wonder if DINKs will be more lonely when older?

[Aintbaint]

Ok, so hear me out. This isn’t an US v Them thread …
I have a lot of Double Income No Kids friends - for various reasons, mostly choice.
So for most career has been their main focus, followed by their partner… Most have been very financially comfortable, travelled a lot, able to afford holiday homes, successful work wise etc basically all the benefits of no kids!

But now we’re all in our late 40s and 50s and slowed down a bit, retired early, separated or divorced, Quite a few just seem to to have lost focus, seem a bit depressed or unhappy, and don’t have the same focal point that having kids can bring.
I stupidly thought that kids would get older and we’d have our independence back but obvs kids are always there in someways - you never stop worrying or thinking about them or doing stuff with them. So still that focal point in many ways and Indaynthat as someone who does have a FT job they like and hobbies…

YABU - of course DINKs are just as happy and not lonely etc

YANBU - it’s harder as you get older when it’s just you or you+partner and work isn’t as important or you retire

Similar here. Single, childfree and at long last getting to enjoy living on my own after seven years as my mother's carer and a lifetime of living with her. I would hate being surrounded by family, much less having to do stuff for numerous people all the time. Caring for one elderly parent (now by necessity in a nursing home) was burden enough. I'm happy with my cats and friends. I don't like children at all and adult children are no guarantee against loneliness - my sister left home at seventeen and I don't even know where my pig of a brother lives, I haven't seen him in over forty years. Last time I did was when he broke Mum's jaw pushing her through a plate-glass door.

My Mum worked in sheltered housing, and said it was shocking how many old people did not get visits from their children.

That said, my own elderly Dad is almost 400 miles away, so I do only see him once a year. He wasn't the best Dad to be honest, so that doesn't help.

We had a lovey old lady 2 doors down. Her adult kids hardly ever stopped by, despite being local. I remember he saying to me that she needed new trousers, and that her DD had been promising to take her shopping for the last THREE years. Still hadn't done it though!

I don't think having children guarantees you any company in your old age.

It sounds like you are jealous of childfree couples. We are well able to find focus without selfish adult children.

Last night I had a medical emergency and my friend jumped out of bed and came round, then slept over at mine. In the morning we went for breakfast.

This Christmas 5 of us (single and no kids) spent the day together, we had a barbecue on the (freezing) beach then afternoon in pub with games.

As a child free woman I have inadvertently grown a friendship group where the vast majority don't have kids. I think our friendships are deeper because we actively rely on each other.

I'm not saying not having kids makes you inherently more interesting at all, but because it's not the norm, you often find people who don't have kids have made other non standard decisions, and so many in my friendship group are also self employed or working in creative fields. Not having set hours AND not having family obligations means we tend to have a lot of time to eg go off on "workations" together but also a lot more time for activities and volunteering in our communities.

There's no one size fits all answer, but looking at the people I know I would say the people without kids tend to have a more varied and more flexible life and a much wider and deeper friendship group.

This discussion comes up all the time and it drives me mad. There are all kinds of topics on this site and I would guess that the majority of them have nothing to do with children. Nutrition, TV, Books, Royal Family, Travel, Cleaning tips, Relationships - there are all sorts of things on here. I have learned a lot being on here and I've also been able to support other women in relation to a particular medical issue and I'm childfree and single. So shoot me.

It’s the lack of imagination that gets me on these threads. The amount of people who can’t imagine that different people have different outlooks on life, different priorities and differ wants and needs.

I have the intelligence to understand what makes me happy and fulfilled might not be the same as the woman standing next to me.

i understand that people with ten children can be lonely and depressed, or joyfully happy. I understand that being childless is a choice and privilege for some women but a personal tragedy for others.

why are people arguing about this? We are all different! Are people this desperate to validate their life choices?

I would say that grief is more of a factor when it comes to ageing. No amount of company makes you feel better about people you miss through bereavement.

This Is a fact of life Op, one day you or your partner will pass away and one of you will have to soldier on without the other. Sorry to be blunt but if we are really gonna look at the issue of loneliness well…

Nothing in life is guaranteed, apart from death. You would be better to focus on what gives you pleasure today in this moment than to be worrying about imponderables.

oh, and If these lonely DINKS are friends of yours you could think about including them in fun activities or whatever.

80% of my 2 largish friends circles are childfree, and nobody is family orientated. All of our lives are friends and socialising related.

I agree

having children isn’t a guarantee for companionship, ultimately they are their own people- they may move far away or you may find yourself ‘forgotten’ as life gets busy and parents get deprioritised Or you may be a terrible parent that they want nothing more to do with you.

now my opinion for what it’s worth that those who find themselves lonely children or not, are those who’ve made their career their soul mate, to the detriment of everything else (friends, hobbies, family, pets etc). It’s great to work hard, earn a good wage, get fulfilment from your career, but ultimately the company doesn’t care, the show will go on without you (in most instances) and your career won’t be there to hold your hand when you’re scared.

I think that is a hugely simplistic view on loneliness.

lots of people living with loneliness didn’t have careers - many never worked.

yea I am sure there are some career driven people who go on to suffer from loneliness in their later years - but equally housewives, the long term unemployed, etc etc can also suffer.

there is an unpleasant undertone of this thread that loneliness later in life is a punishment for not living a conventional life. If you don’t have children you will suffer, if you prioritise your career you will suffer, if you are happy now in your choices, just you wait! A smug mother of three will be laughing while you son in you fancy, empty house and all the holidays in the world won’t compensate for what you have missed out on😂😂.

everyone is different!!! Please broaden your horizons

please read what I actually wrote, that having children isn’t a protective factor against lonliness, not what you inferred that only people who gave their all to their career are the only people who can be lonely.

i then said children or otherwise, what I’ve witnessed personally is that those who seem to be the most lonely are those who only invested in one area of their lives in my specific example, work.

But the vast majority of people who have posted agree with you, @Bellyblueboy. I do also think that Mn attracts a disproportionate number of posters who struggle with relationships in general, and that, if they're lonely and friendless for whatever reason in their 30s, working FT, with or without children, it's not very likely that they'll have a very connected life in their late 80s.

I don’t think you can generalise. We went through a lot of fertility treatments to get our children and I used to fear an old age without family (I was being very melodramatic in hindsight). In reality we’d have an amazing lifestyle without the children as we’d have so much more disposable income! Not that I regret them in any way, they are amazing teens that I enjoy being with, but those I know without children have lots of great holidays, lovely houses etc. I think you have to enjoy what you have, after all being childless isn’t always a choice, and having children is no guarantee that they’ll actually want to spend time with you (I hope they do)!

Absolutely agree, I don’t rely on others for my contentment and happiness, I do that for myself. If friends and family add to that (and a lot of the time, they do), it’s wonderful, if not, it’s fine, I am still complete within myself. I’d have to be, living alone.

Everyone can be lonely. If you’re happy being loved up with a significant other, or you have children, good for you, but nothing is a guarantee of never being lonely.

This is such an interesting thread, and this reply is similar to my experience. I work in a residential home for the elderly, and we have some residents who have children, and some who don't. The residents who have children and are close with them definitely appear the happiest - generally happier than those residents who chose not to have children. But the least happiest residents are those who had children, devoted their lives to raising them (and often played a large role in raising their grandchildren, too) but have then been - essentially - dumped in a home now they need care. Their families rarely visit, and when they do it's usually that cursory 10 minute drop in every month/a couple of times a year. They rarely pick up the phone in-between. But in my opinion they are wonderful at doing the absolute bare minimum needed to be remembered in their parent/grandparents' will. They are the loneliest group because they do have a family, but the family just don't bother. It's pretty heartbreaking, really! And you wouldn't believe the amount of people who suddenly come out of the woodwork once someone has sadly passed, and discussions about their will begins.

I think people underestimate the importance of careers for women. 'Career man' is not a phrase that is used. It's never levied at men who work all their lives that they will be lonely in their retirement. When my husband left me for another woman, the fact that I had a career helped me greatly, both financially and to have indpendence to keep me going. That sunscreen song 'maybe you'll have a trust fund, maybe you'll have wealthy spouse, but you never know when either one will run out' is true. I don't think it's a given that if you enjoy your career you will be lovely. It's possible to have a career that you love AND a family AND a fulfilling personal life. It's a conspiracy to women to suggest otherwise and feeds into women accepting less than they deserve.

This thread is the perfect example of the stigma, judgement and othering that childless/free women experience on a day to day basis. Check yourself please we are all different, all individuals and most of us has so much more to define us than our income and whether or not we have children.

Being a parent does not confer you almost saint-like qualities OP. Your post is mean in spirit and highly offensive towards women who, through choice or circumstances, do not have children. You dismiss those of us who had sub-par parents and its trauma due to emotional abuse. Show me a young person or adult with substance misuse and I'll show you a traumatised child. I suggest OP, you remove your judgy, smug tinted glasses.

I was very lonely within my nuclear family; an emotionally distant father and enabler of my narcissistic mother, consequently, I am now very low contact with my parents and non contact with my sibling. There are countless lonely children within families, even more within the care system.

I forged a life filled with friends, hobbies, charity work and employment. My friends comprise of childhood friends, friends through my work, both voluntary and salaried. I also have a very close friendship with my elderly neighbour, we go for lunch on a weekly basis, attend concerts and plays. Her middle aged children see her very infrequently despite living relatively local to her. With my wider friends, we travel, have dinner parties and socialise frequently.

My sibling's child moved in with me as a tween because she couldn't tolerate her mother's chaotic lifestyle and emotional negligence. For the years she lived with me, I continued cultivate my friendship groups as I believe it's important to demonstrate that relationships, in whatever guise, need work and compromise. I raised an independent, emotionally strong and secure young woman who is now on a gap year travelling. I have impressed upon her she owes me nothing, and if it comes to a stage where I need care, I'll arrange to move into a care home or residential village and she is to continue living her life. I won't be lonely due to not making my darling niece my sole focus and ensuring I nurtured my friendships.

We see so many posts from parents whose adult children aren't close and rarely get in contact. And so many posts from people who have gone or want to go NC or LC with their parents. Having children isn't a guarantee against future loneliness. I actually wonder if it isn't a lonelier feeling to have children but not be close with them in their adulthood than it is to not have them at all.

Even parents who get along well with their children into adulthood will need to accept that they may want lives that take them away from their parents. My daughter has chosen to board until the end of Secondary, as doing so gives her the best foundation for her future career goals. I miss her terribly, but it's her choice and I respect that she's made it.

Both parents and non-parents need to create lives for themselves that can be satisfying in their later years. And they should be lives that can be lived independently. What that looks like is going to vary from person to person: starting a business, involving oneself in hobbies, travel, volunteer work, caring for pets, etc.

In.the words of Doctor Seuss: "Whether you like it or not, alone is something you'll be quite a lot." It really is in our best interests to like being alone.

I am actually glad the Op started this thread, as I have learnt so much on how to live, from varied posters with their varied lives, families, friends and situations.

I am so glad you're content with your lot but that sounds horribly stifling to me, and you're being unnecessarily judgemental about a life without family.

Our childfree life has loads of meaning - we prioritise each other and our friendships and travelling the world and experiencing new things together.

Tbh quite a few of my mum’s friends only see their elderly parents on weekly visits to their supported living home - and they’re considered the “involved ones”. Having kids in this country is no guarantee you won’t be lonely in old age.

My family are of Mediterranean descent, retirement homes are still not really the done thing.

@TarantinoIsAMisogynist Thanks for replying, I was just curious, because there’s an odd dynamic between the parents and childfree in my DH’s family, I.e., if you have children you’re capable of cooking and hosting everyone; if you’re childfree, you’re somehow not. It’s totally bizarre! It also means that the chikdfree get to relax a lot more, which I do envy, tbh. 😂

If you’re having kids so you’re not lonely in old age you’re having kids for the wrong reason. Also DINKs have the right idea, they’re probably a hell of a lot happier and more fulfilled in older age than I ever will be.

The posts about lonely people in residential homes are making me sad.
Regardless of our own decisions to be parents or childfree, it’s a reminder that we shouldn’t be neglecting our parents and grandparents (if we have them). It isn’t a massive inconvenience to regularly ring someone and visit them when we can. Even if it is, what’s a 10-minute phone call? My Dad often isn’t particularly nice to me, but you can’t neglect someone in their mid-80’s. As a society to make an effort. 🙁