To be so flabbergasted by my husbands response to me asking him to get a vasectomy.

[Mumsgotaheadache01]

I've recently lost our 4th baby. Ive had 3 previous miscarriages. With 1 live birth, Of our very young child who has additional needs and was born with a birth defect. Was an IVF pregnancy. I have pcos, fibroids, fluid in pelvis the list goes on. And have only recently stopped breastfeeding our child. I really don't want to go on hormones for birth control as I don't want to mess up my hormones and my body anymore. I suffer enough and have had all number of procedures, tests, examinations, surgical procedures, scans and hormones pumped into my body. I just want to be left alone. I've been injured while giving birth very traumatically, many stitches, hemorrhaged etc. We don't have sex often for many reasons. Mainly being I'm exhausted from being mummy and in pain a lot. When we do it's lovely and I do love my husband very much. But this evening I asked him if he would think about getting a vasectomy. So we can enjoy our sex life again in the knowledge I won't get pregnant and have a miscarriage or another baby. Before I could even put to him my point of view he flat out refused. And said "I wouldn't put myself through that". I am just completely shocked by how selfish that is. It's upset me so much. Aibu to be flabbergasted or should I just calm down and try a see this from his point of view.

I find the importance some men put on their virility after their family is 'done' baffling. Do they think less of women post menopause too?

Virility and fertility are not the same thing. You’ve illustrated a point I made upthread about them often being conflated in the heads of many men and some women.

@Anotherparkingthread well that's pretty different situation to a marriage where it is a joint responsibility, and where the risks from surgery through to pregnancy are much higher for the woman.

I don't understand why anyone thinks it is even remotely reasonable to dictate what a partner should do with their own body.

But nobody is doing that though are they?

Why do you view it as the OP ‘choosing’ to do things that hurt her body and then suggesting vasectomy as tit for tat ? OP and her DH are in a long term relationship so it’s likely that choosing to have a baby was a mutually agreed decision because both partners wanted to be parents. So it’s also reasonable to assume that if they were unable to successfully conceive naturally, the decision to have IVF will also have been a mutual one. So given the distressing effects of mutually agreed treatment on the OP, why does DH get a free pass to unilaterally disengage from even contemplating taking responsibility for the long term method of birth control she clearly needs and wants ?

I wasn't married and I love sex! No husband involved.

Not a comparable situation then......

The op is in a relationship where birth control should be a joint responsibility.

I've had the same issue. Doesnt want a baby but doesn't want to wear a condom. I got rid

My husband was like that but I worked with a guy who wasn't one of the "most" and he had to have follow up surgery. I changed jobs a year or so later so not sure if he ever fully recovered. I do think men are entitled to think about possibly being in pain for the rest of their lives even if it doesn't happen to most.

I'm saying that the person who doesn't want the pregnancy has more chips in the game.

It is often stated on here that if a man has sex with a woman and is aware that she isn't taking contraception then he must accept the consequences regardless of wether he wants a child or not.
In the same vien op must accept that as a consequence, if she falls pregnant as a result of them both having consenting sex then it does fall on her shoulders to carry the pregnancy and all it's risks. As she is not prepared to do this she needs to make her own arrangements independent of him to ensure that it doesn't happen if this is something she doesn't want.

Entirely compatible. I didn't want to get pregnant so I took autonomy of my own reproductive choices. It was me who did not want pregnancy. It was me who ensured it did not occur.

I'm saying that the person who doesn't want the pregnancy has more chips in the game.

But he doesn't want a child either by the sounds of it? OP hasnt said the conflict is future children, but the means to prevent. And surely, as the loving spouse of someone who does not want to be pregnant, he has the same chips in the game as you say? Marriage is a partnership, it's not him vs her.

It doesn't completely dismiss OP's experiences.
Saying a man who doesn't agree to a vasectomy doesn't love or care about his wife isn't being factual as he does have a right to his body.

Same as a woman can choose to keep trying to have a child or not.

What OP went through is because of possibly joint choices, but we don't know who wanted to keep trying for kids more or if it was indeed an equal decision.

Making the decision to change your body should be left to the individual.

His body, absolutely his choice.

Clearly he doesn't feel as done as OP about the risk of having more kids.

As a loving husband, he could have handled the conversation better, but like pp have said, that's a discussion that should have been had way back.

@Anotherparkingthread so yes then 🤷🏼‍♀️

In a marriage, particularly a marriage where the woman has had to endure a significant amount of physical stress and pain to give them both a child, do you not think that birth control should be a joint decision and joint responsibility? And that the OPs husband at least owes her a conversation about it?

I do think men are entitled to think about possibly being in pain for the rest of their lives even if it doesn't happen to most.

Yes of course, I was hugely empathetic of my DH and didn't minimise the situation by comparing to what I'd been through, he was nervous (as was I!) and understandably, especially as they rarely have to undergo medical treatment for that area like we do, and nothing is without risk.

"Most menare risk averse. Most women take risks with fertility every single day. In part because most men seem to think their willies are just too special."

Most studies conclude that men are more risk tolerant than women as it happens.

Your second statement is just more misandry.

Entirely compatible. I didn't want to get pregnant so I took autonomy of my own reproductive choices. It was me who did not want pregnancy. It was me who ensured it did not occur.

Except in a relationship this is usually a joint decision. Therefore birth control is a joint responsibility.

Most women seem to completely dismiss the risk and I know it is rare for a man to have the issues my colleague did but it was devastating for him. As I said he did have surgery to try and correct it, it certainly wasn't an instant success but I hope it did eventually sort the problem out.

Usually in a relationship both partners care about each other and make sacrifices for each other. "Why should I?" doesn't come into it. If that's your attitude towards your own partner I feel very sorry for them.

So why are so few willing to take the risk and get a vasectomy? Is it because it's easier for them to outsource the risk and responsibility of family planning to their wives?

It’s very likely from what the OP says that IVF in her case was because her body lacks the ability to distinguish viable embryos from those that are unviable - hence the number of miscarriages and the live birth of a child with a birth defect. So it doesn’t necessarily follow that she has any problem conceiving normally, but has a high risk of miscarriage/birth defect. I don’t think it’s a question of whether either partner does or doesn’t want another child, it’s more a question of saying enough’s enough and putting an end to the trauma and disappointment. So yes, some form of permanent birth control would seem to be the solution and to that end she has put the question of vasectomy as the simpler option to her DH, only to be dismissed out of hand.

Because she had the choice to or not? And that goal has passed now:

They had a shared goal to become pregnant. - They both looked at options of achieving this goal and she decided she WAS willing to take the physical implications of ivf/pregnancy.

Now they both have a new shared goal - to have sex without getting pregnant.

She has said no to one method of achieving this goal - hormonal contraception.

He had said no to another method of achieving this goal - vasectomy.

Neither is WILLING to do what it takes to achieve this goal, over the physical implications.

So to answer your question, the last shared goal where she made the choice to put her body through all that, to my mind, doesn’t mean he has to forfeit his right to decide what he does with his body now.

You can’t point fingers at someone and say YOU got a baby from my body so now I get to decide that you have a vasectomy. That is forcing. And that is not ok is it?

But he definitely can’t complain if she refuses to sleep with him going forward. And he definitely should have thought his words through far more carefully and acknowledged that she did A LOT for their last shared goal and CONSIDER that maybe it’s his time to take one for the team.

And that’s the real issue here isn’t it? It’s not so much that he said no. It’s that he just shut her down immediately instead of even thinking it through - ie he didn’t show commitment to them as a team. He’s happy to ask big things of her body but doesn’t want her to ask big(ish) things of his.

although honestly, OP I’m pretty sure that’s just a man’s automatic response to someone suggesting putting a knife to his balls. I probably wouldn’t take it personally

(And before you try to paint me the villain again, I know - having had multiple kids and allll the rest of the crap we women have to put up with - that a vasectomy nothing compared to what op has been through. But men do not really comprehend that)

Yep. You had it right first time. Men may not be generally risk averse, but I doubt the study asked specific questions about risking their manhood !!

"So why are so few willing to take the risk and get a vasectomy?"

Well the op's husband aside many men do take that that as lots of posters here make clear.

There are a couple of reasons aside from being being " precious about their penises".

Religious reasons.
In modern society high divorce rate.

Risks of chronic testicular pain,increased risk of prostate cancer, ed risks etc.
My body my choice working both ways....

No means no. Doesn’t matter if it’s an immediate no or a no a week later.

Is it worth it?

Good question. I'm not sure yet, it's quite a recent change. Some side effects are actually positive, others I'm unhappy with but will give it time.

DH has to bear the brunt of my moods for now. But he would at least be happy to use condoms, and we could with trial and error probably find a condom which didn't irritate me.

There's no way he'll have a vasectomy unless I force him into it and obviously, morally, that's wrong.

What's my alternative?

Not painting you as any villain - far from it, I think we’re on the same side, in that the real problem is the words he used to shut her down with no discussion, and as you rightly say, with no consideration of what’s gone before. But I would also add that after what the OP has been through in terms of physical effects, I don’t think she can be blamed for not wanting more surgery or hormones pumped into her.