My brother has hidden my nephews rugby playing...

[touchrugby]

Asking for my brother - I think he’s in a mess and I need to tell him what to expect and how unreasonable he was. Interested to hear from other divorced parents and sports teachers/ school administrators. I’ve tried to give as much context as possible.

My brother got divorced 4 years ago. They have (had?) an amicable coparent relationship- there was no cheating or unkindness in either side. My brother just became obsessed with giving his family a good life and he worked a lot of hours. When he wasn’t working he was a very engaged parent- my nephew is hugely sporty and they were always off doing sports- swimming, tennis, football, cross country etc. Ex SIL was a SAHP but eventually got frustrated (with justification) at never seeing her husband so went back to work and divorced him. They share 50/50 custody with my brother as the higher earner paying all DNs expenses.

My brother really wanted nephew to go to this very nice private school. To facilitate this he pays all the fees. It’s a great academic school so ex SIL was pretty happy-except for the sport. They’re a big rugby school and she was adamant that DN not play rugby due to injury risks. There was a big argument about it, with my brother and DN really wanting rugby, and her adamant that he wouldn’t play.

The school offers non contact rugby and eventually they agreed DN would do that. DN is in year 9 now and it’s recently come out that he switched to full contact rugby in the 3rd week of year 7 and SIL didn’t know. It’s come out because he’s recently been made captain of the A team and a few mums congratulated her.

It seems he hated the non contact team. He’s very gifted with sport and apparently it was a team of lads who just wanted to run around for a few hours and throw a ball. The school put little effort into it and there were no matches. He asked to switch to “proper” rugby and the school said they needed a parent to approve it- and my brother did.

His argument is that his son wanted it, the school did email SIL as well, and it’s been 2.5 years.
Her argument is that he knew her stance, he also knows she’s a bit disorganised and rarely reads emails especially ones about sport which she know my brother manages (she has over 10,000 unread emails on her phone!) and that my brother conspired to hide it.

She has a very valid point about the conspiring. She has a new partner. He works Saturdays so my brother used to have DN every Friday night so they could see each other, and he’d then take him to Sat morning matches before dropping him at SILs Sat evening. Brother and DN have both, in 2.5 years, managed not to say anything to her about his rugby which is obviously duplicitous, especially considering how good he is. Brother just managed all the kit and the washing and the games and it apparently never came up in conversation.

Shes utterly furious and is going to the school Monday to tell them to remove him from rugby. Brother planning on going to the school to tell them to keep him in rugby. DN is apparently going to refuse to return to his mums house unless she agrees to the rugby and is determined to continue.

I’ve maintained a good friendship with SIL. In many ways I’m closer her than my brother as I see her more (he’s still a workaholic in his non parenting time so he’s hard to get hold of!) I heard about the odd match but nothing specific, I assumed it was non contact and frankly don’t know anything about rugby anyway. She’s very unhappy with our family as obviously our parents knew as well. My dad watches half the matches!

Does anyone know what the school might do? My brother and nephew are digging their heels in and saying he’ll live full time at my brothers and my brother will therefore get full parental responsibility. I think this is rubbish and not legal. I am worried that a nice coparenting relationship is ruined and that SIL might lose my nephew. He loves his mum but he’s obsessed with sport and apparently A team captain at a school like his is a BIG deal. He’s already playing some 2nd eleven matches as well which is also apparently important. I don’t know how to feel about what my brother did. He has absolutely supported what DN wanted. My nephew is so happy playing rugby and so good at it and still uninjured, and it’s the game played by 90% of the school. She knew sending him there that if he didn’t play rugby he’d be a bit isolated but she will not have it.

Frankly I think there’s fault on both sides, but on balance how much more unreasonable was my brother and what the hell might happen next?

Your ex SIL is a twat.

I'm not blaming the school. I'm blaming the brother here.

Blimey - that's not something I'd be admitting to, but each to their own!

I don't think the father did the right thing either btw but the mum wasn't exactly parent of the year.

@JCLV Yes I suppose in the same way people who don't smoke get lung cancer. However, considering that my father was in the Glasgow study that was mentioned upthread and there was a proven connection in this particular situation you might want to wind your neck in.

The DB hasn't encouraged his DS to play rugby, he has support his DS who wanted to play rugby.

He may have acted "disgracefully" but she has been controlling in demanding what her DS should or shouldn't do.

Nobody here comes out smelling of roses.

Why is it all on him? Shouldn't the mother of the (then) 11yo child show an interest in his sports and activities?

This. All the posters blathering on about the importance of rugby are massively missing the point.

But when the child is with the father, she has no authority

You see, that is the attitude that brings about wars. Of course lots of people have to apply that maxim because they are co-parenting with unreasonable people but he was lucky enough to be co-parenting with a loving and thoughtful woman and he had zero consideration for the benefits that brought to him and his son.

Now he has damaged his son's relationship with his mother for the remainder of his teenage years at least.

My responses have nothing to do with the fact that it's rugby. It could have been any sport or activity - the fact is the mother deliberately chose to ignore a huge part of her child's life and education.

She ignored e-mails about it, never attended a single match (was too busy visiting her boyfriend), never read a school report about it and never spoke to her child's coaches. For two and a half years.

That's just as appalling (if not more so) than a dad encouraging his child to do a sport he loves.

No, we aren’t missing the point, the son WANTED to play contact rugby , his father supported him in his decision and an email was sent to the mother however as she does not read emails and it seems take any interest in her sons sports, she has unwillingly allowed this to happen.

I don’t agree with the father and she is not unreasonable however that ship has sailed and if she digs her heels in she is risking losing her son over it.

How awful trying to dictate your sons hobbies and something he is good at?
No wonder it's backfired on her.

I'm glad he pursued it and the boy has two parents not just her.
How would she have liked it if a parent had tried to stop her hobby when a child.
If she isn't careful she could lose her son too.

Everyone in the scenario is being unreasonable, including you OP for getting involved. You should have said 'Ooooh, this sounds like mess for you all' and then bowed out. If asked to pick a side you say 'Problem is, I can appreciate all sides so I can't pick one.'

Captaining rugby could be very advantageous for your nephew. Oxbridge and Russell group universities like to see sport on an application.

@Livinghappy I am in Ireland there have been success outcomes in the family courts.

I very much doubt a school would want the attention. The relationship with the son is already severely fractured, for his physical protection yes I would fight because I could never live with myself if he ended up with life changing injuries.

I don't believe rugby should be played in school in its current format where neurosurgeons are saying clearly every knock has an impact and the stats on ex rugby players presenting with neurological conditions outstrip their peers.

The mother contributed to that poor relationship by showing absolutely no interest in a sport her son loves. She couldn't even be bothered to attend a match because she was too busy visiting her bloody boyfriend!

Unfortunately it doesn’t take away the truthfulness of the statement , how many times to we see on MN that mothers and fathers disagreeing with each other on how to raise the children.

In an ideal world co-parenting would be harmonious however this isn’t an ideal world and the child in question is stuck in the middle as the mother is actively chosen to ignore that side of her son’s life.

The mother had stated her lack of interest in sports and (foolishly, as she now knows) expected that her ex would supervise responsibly. Which he clearly didn't.

No. She expected her ex would supervise the way she wanted. That's not the same thing. Her opinion doesn't automatically override his.

I do think though any point she might have had falls down if she has the information but didn't read it.

She must feel quite betrayed though-perhaps most especially by her son.

I won't condemn her for not going to matches if that has always worked for them-but of course that has also meant an opportunity missed.

OP has said her SIL is a great mum who deals with everything except the sport.

The thing is, if a woman posted on here that her ex was "furious" because he'd just found out their 14yo played rugby after three years, she'd be told it was on him for not being interested in their child's activities.

If she then posted that the reason he never attended a match was because he was too busy with his new girlfriend, he would be absolutely slammed for being a shit, useless dad.

I simply don't think that's relevant, especially when OP says the dad knows nothing about music or instruments but still goes out of his way to attend his sons performances and concerts.

You can't willingly opt out of a huge chunk of your child's life and education and then complain about it nearly three years later.

Sport is the issue, she buried her head in the sand, she is most likely a good mother however having ignored her sons interests as it does not interest her, she has also given her son the opportunity to not discuss any sporting topics that may have come up.

For me it reads like sports has become a mute topic when at his mothers.

The mother contributed to that poor relationship by showing absolutely no interest in a sport her son loves. She couldn't even be bothered to attend a match because she was too busy visiting her bloody boyfriend!

I didn't have to co-parent, but if I had and my child's father was interested in taking them to boring sporting events, I would have said that it was lovely that they had an interest in common and no need for me to muscle in there.

But, in your opinion, the mother was wrong for trusting her child's father not to lie and not to teach her son to lie to her and doubly wrong for having a "bloody boyfriend".

The mum is right. The injuries from rugby are not worth the idiocy of a few minutes' happiness. The father is just stupid or does not care about his son. Probably just stupid. In my child's school some male pupils were invalids by the time they were in S6. I personally was a competitive athlete with a clever mum (did not want to allow this) and a stupid dad (cheered me on). I destroyed my health in the process and by mid 20s it began to bother me to such an extent, that I understood mum was right. If only I listened to mum.

Sending a sporty boy to a good independent school and not letting him play rugby is a bit like taking your child to the beach and saying ‘don’t get in the sea’. It’s a given. The school will be on the side of the Dad and Son. They will have seen thousands of boys come and go through school, but very few (if any!), will have had life threatening injuries from rugby. I think SIL has been a bit naive and she needs to drop it for the sake of her relationship with her DS.

IMO it has nothing to do with whether she trusts him or not, and everything to do with her choosing not to show an interest in something that her child clearly loves and enjoys.

Loads of parents go and stand on the sidelines every weekend even when they'd rather be just about anywhere else - because that's what you do for your kids.

I also didn't say she was wrong for having a boyfriend either, I said she was wrong for prioritising her new relationship over her child's love of rugby every single time there was a match on for two and a half years.