To think she shouldn't put him in tights?

[TotoroElla]

Just trying to understand and find a way forward.

A family member's little boy is in foster care currently. He is 4 yo. The FC keeps putting him in tights. His mum is getting upset with it and doesn't understand why she keeps doing it. She has asked for her to stop and the SW has asked her to stop too. Mum doesn't feel it is very dignified for him to be at nursery wearing what is culturally a girls' clothes item. He was getting so hot in them the other day as of course he has trousers over them.

Can anyone shed any light as to why she is doing this or what his mum can do about it?

Clothes are provided from home, although FC has bought some things. He doesn't appear to struggle with the feel of trousers, it is just the tights.

Yes, I understand it is common in cold places.

Yes, very.

I have a 4 yr old boy and wouldn't put tights on under trousers that's so uncomfortable!! My son would have a fit!

If he's 4 and still in a nappy maybe the FC feels the tights hold the nappy in place. Also I'd be amazed if other DC knew what this DC was wearing under his trousers. How on earth would they know? I'm a FC and provided you put DFC in clothes that are clean and not broken it would be a non issue with my SW. If the clothing was dirty or broken it would be a problem. Just a thought but could the FC be trying to conceal the fact this 4 year old is still in a nappy?

Have nursery not brought it up? If he's as hot and uncomfortable as you say has mum not brought up that nursery haven't changed him?

Could it be that he does actually get cold at nursery and therefore the tights are appropriate there?

Op, I’m ashamed of my comment. I’m so sorry 😭

Dad is not on the scene? No grandparents? Poor bub, and poor mum. I am also a FC , some of the inappropriate clothes that arrive with children are astonishing. I have had to buy warm clothes for children who arrive in winter with one tshirt that doesn't fit.
I pay for those extra clothes myself, so I'm surprised the FC has gone and out and bought tights for no reason.
I'd be speaking to the nursery first - they will know if he is uncomfortable during the day.
I hope all goes well with ( what I am assuming is ) your sister.

You do understand that kids can go to foster care for all sorts of reasons that are not related to bad parenting?!

The OP has already stated mum is unwell.
Shame on you

You’ve been so patient responding repeatedly that your concerns are primarily about the child being to hot and the fc not taking aboard the mothers wishes. Of course it makes no sense for him to be put in tights if it’s not cold. And poor mum, dealing with cancer and then having her go wises pushed aside repeatedly. And poor little boy, away from mum and from the sounds of it uncomfortable and not able to articulate his preferences. Is there a foster organistion/social worker who could have a word with the fc? Good luck with sorting the situation out. Sure you’ll eventually get there.

Gently, @TotoroElla , I suspect that if your nephew's foster carer did start putting your nephew in socks there would be something else for your sister to concentrate herself on wrt the way her son is being cared for.
It sounds like a very difficult situation, I can't imagine how painful it would be if I couldn't be my son's primary carer.
I think it's a shame your nephew's social worker has responded in the way she has. It's not appropriate for social workers to attempt to micromanage the day to day care of little ones in foster care. And her reasoning is quite spurious.
I think you need to support your sister, remind her that she knows her son like noone else can, and she has a relationship with him that noone else does. But for now you need to trust that his foster carer also has his wellbeing at heart. She will do things differently, and that has to be ok for now.

I would ask for this to be raised with the foster carer's supervising social worker, she should be respecting the wishes of mum in this situation. Especially if the child is clearly uncomfortable. You've also mentioned that there is limited information being passed on from the FC, I would also raise this. Raise it at the next LAC review as well so the reviewing officer is aware. Is the child under a care order or section 20?

I wonder if the FC is putting him in tights due to the nappy, either way, not appropriate, and parents wishes as much as possible should be considered and respected if able to and reasonable, which in this respect they are.

Four is not a toddler or a nine month old. It's very different. It's not appropriate for him to be in tights. I hope this can be changed.

It’s really not that unusual for a toddler to be wearing tights under trousers. If he was as uncomfortable as mum makes out, then surely nursery staff will have noticed too but they clearly haven’t.

And 4 year olds won’t be bullying each other over this.

Your issue seems to be the concept of what you deem to be girls clothes. If it was a pair of long johns, would you still object?

Since your op was focused on it being undignified rather than him being hot I wonder if this is a communication issue.

If the FC thinks he's cold (and he may be in other environments to your relatives house) then she's right to ignore any superficial, sexist concerns like 'tights aren't boys clothing' and prioritise him being warm. I'd make sure the communication focuses specifically on him being too hot in them - and how you can tell that. That said, her house may be a lot colder than your relative's house so unless you know he's too hot before he leaves to go to your relative's house you still don't know she's actually doing anything wrong to dress him in them initially. If the transport is hotter than her house it may be just that he needs them taking off for the journey (personally I wear warmer clothes in my home than I do when out and about because at home I'm a lot more sedentary and get cold, but once I start walking I warm up quickly).

Also being 10°C isn't really that meaningful - what is he doing in the 10°C? Running around playing outside is going to require fewer clothes than e.g. standing waiting for a bus for 20mins or being pushed in a pushchair.

Loved tights for that age on my boys. Loads easier than socks which seam to come off all the time. Then pull a pair of trousers on over the top to leave the house. I tended to get slightly larger ones then then the rights but covers the tummy and back so they stay toasty warm.

SW needs a speaking too if they think tights are undignified. Are socks undignified? Or vests?

YANBU. Not because I think tights on boys is
wrong (mine wore them in winter), but because presumably she’s aware she’s upsetting the child’s mother by doing so. This needs to be a partnership of trust, so the mother isn’t needlessly stressed.

I used to teach primary in west London and when changing for PE in the winter would find that several of the boys were wearing tights under their trousers in y1 and y2. To my knowledge, none of the other children ever poked fun at them for it.

It was this temp here yesterday but somehow absolutely biting in the wind.

My DD wears tights most days as socks don’t last a minute. She pulls them straight off and her feet then feel like ice. Surely it’s purely that he’s been cold on occasion? I’d be glad they are keeping him warm.

I don’t have a son but if I did, I’d definitely put him in tights when a baby if anything like my DD and this would even be with shorts (eg like the royal babies), and encourage a layer like thick leggings under loose trousers when older. Some babies in my DD’s baby group wear a full babygrow under something like a full length romper so the foster parent isn’t the only one doing things like this tbh.

The issue of tights being gendered to you is irrelevant as they’re not on show in your nephew’s case. I would argue tights can be worn by boys albeit rarely are as in my example above.

Did you notice if the FC seems to dress particularly warmly or snugly herself?
I've noticed with some 'always freezing' people that I know that they are always overdressing their kids, even small babies despite all of the warnings that are constantly given about overheating.
Also as the kids get older and complain about being too hot they ignore the protests and overdress them despite them clearly being sweaty and uncomfortable.

YANBU. He's not a toddler - he's 4. It really isn't usual - I worked with families for 12 years - saw them at home, in nursery, in schiool, and other settings. Never once in that time, have I known a boy be put in tights. He's SEN, and OP states he can't make his preferences / discomfort known. 4 year olds absolutely DO notice and comment on clothing. Sports leggings and everyday tights are not the same thing at all. Teens make their own choices about what to wear - this little one lacks capacity to do so. He is likely too hot, running around nursery. There are 3 layers to pull down if he needs a wee - not great if he is struggling with toilet training ( fairly likely
if he has additional needs). I have never known a foster carer completely ignore a mother's feelings like this. It is bizarre that she is also ignoring the Social Worker. This needs to be addressed at his next review meeting.

@TotoroElla I'm sorry to hear about your sister, this must be all shades of stressful for you all.
My mum had cancer when I was little and I lived with various people until she was better, I can't imagine how upsetting this is for her, end of the day, if she doesn't want her child wearing a red t shirt, as his mum that is her choice.

I have looked after children of family/pals over the years as emergency FC and had an SGO and can't imagine going against the children's parents wishes in this way.

I was wondering because of SEN (I have 2 sen sons) if the wee boy is distressed being somewhere new away from mum are the tights to stop him smearing? Very common sen behaviour, often see smearers in leopards or something else to make getting access to smear more difficult? That's the only reason I can think of.

Either way, such a horrid situation and I hope, as my mum did, your sister makes a full recovery x

In the real world (not mumsnet world) boys don’t wear tights and whilst I don’t think nursery kids would tease him or necessarily notice, I do think she’s wrong to keep putting him in them when she’s been asked not to.

Some of the comments on here making assumptions about why this child is in foster care are disgusting. Do people not realise that there are others reasons children go into temporary foster care, not just because of poor parenting. I do hope mum is as well as she can be, assume she’s in treatment, it must be so hard for her having to hand over responsibility for parenting her son without this situation which is clearly upsetting her. FC is wrong to ignore her wishes

Tight are fine for boys. 🙄

Does the foster carer have TransGender issues?