HR departments see employees as the enemy

[Donke]

I have worked in several public sector orgs (NHS, civil service etc) and their ability to stonewall and gaslight is unbelievable. Why are they so convinced that they can do no wrong and that employees are stupid/dishonest/incompetent?

I am currently fighting with HR over my T&Cs, which should follow a locally agreed protocol. They are refusing to accept that it exists or that they have the skills to use it which makes no sense because every other trust in the region uses it. They will not open their minds to an outside pov. I have had similar before where they insisted on refusing to pay me sick pay. Why??

You are spot on. More than once, I have had to explain the law to an HR department!

HR doesn’t attract the brightest and the best, as anyone who has dealt with them can appreciate

YABU to write off all HR because of your experience in one particular sector.

I work in HR and My colleagues and I absolutely do not see employees as the enemy.

However, equally many friends and family often end up asking me for advice in dealing with terrible HR (particularly public sector) so I’m not going to disagree that there are a lot out there.

In my experience if the culture is terrible so is the HR. Any good HR people tend to leave these cultures because they can’t get any employee positive initiatives through and it’s demoralising. It ends up being a self-perpetuating cycle for that reason.

HR are representing the employer and that should never be forgotten when dealing with them.

My experience is the opposite. No support whatever to a manager ( not me) trying to get rid of a really, really poor performer - we are talking years of dreadful standards).

I was HRD at a number of large Universities. BA and MA plus a number of professional qualifications. Achieved a lot. Bright enough for you? What’s your special status by the way?

We are not all bad 😟 however as an hr professional I have dealt with some really bad HR that have no clue about employment law or common sense. I also deal with cases that go to employment tribunal so can see how bad management/poor decision can end up. Yes I have to work to protect the Business but if the employee is right then it’s about how to rectify it, support them going forward.

could you call ACAS for some advice on your situation?

This is nothing new. HR are there for the interests of the employer.

Yupp. You're a unit of labour. That's it.

I have worked in house as a lawyer for nearly 20 years and I think this has got worse (from an employees POV). I have worked with some fantastic HR professionals and don't recognise an issue with them being incompetent but they absolutely are there to protect the company.

I would say 10 years ago they saw themselves more as trying to balance employee well being with company protection.

Most are very much on the side of the employer.

However I have come across a tiny handful who are very good and want everything done by the book so it is fair to both employees and management. Our head of HR seems like a good egg.

“HR are there for the interests of the employer.”
Every thread re HR we see this hackneyed bullshit. Every employee is there in the interests of the employer, otherwise no one would have a job. The “interests” of the employer are generally broad. For the purposes of HR those interests can equally include addressing, for example, incompetent and/or bullying managers as much as it might include dealing with under-performing staff. Of course there are bad HR staff, but I’m unaware of any occupation that doesn’t have its share of twats.

I left the NHS due to bullying and totally incompetent management and HR.

I cannot speak on all HR professionals, however, I can attest NHS ones are bad. Although, their job is to protect the employer. They often make bad decisions, which has impact on the employer. Tribunal cases are a prime example.

my experience of private sector HR has been as has been stated above, that they are first and foremost for the employer and so I’ve expected every dealing with them to be framed in such a way. Having worked in a sector where there was lots of restructuring and downsizing, my feeling was it must be either a depressing job or one where a good skill to have is to be able to compartmentalise well. I know work in the public sector and haven’t had much dealing with HR but know one of the team quite well - very pragmatic, kind and compassionate.

It's because they are not there to help employees. The role of HR is to protect the organisation from employees.

I was once in a job [quite high level in a civil service role] which they decided to make the department redundant. I had 2 redundancy meetings with a member of HR and my manager. Meanwhile I was seconded to another role which was still in play when the rest of my department had gone.

When it came to me being made redundant they pretended that I did not have a permanent role, wasn't being made redundant that this was just the end of a timed contract.

I mean, we had meetings which were still in the diary, at their request entitled 'Redundancy Meeting'.

Fuckwits the lot of them.

I once sat in with another team member at another place, when I had to stop a disciplinary meeting and tell the HR Consultant that what they were doing in the meeting was actually illegal and I couldn't sit in there and let them screw over my colleague for one second longer. I marched her out and she never went back.

Hilariously they tried to withold her last month's wages and ended up paying her twice.

Fuckwits the lot of them.

Agree. I find the institutional closed-mindedness horrible. Of course it is necessary to ‘protect’ the employer to an extent but you don’t do that by pissing off all your employees

People think HR are there to look after staff. Bollocks. Never forget who pays their wages. They are there to keep the drones in line

I always think it's the opposite - employees see HR as the enemy!

HR departments are not there for the benefit of the employees. Their function isto make sure the employer doesn't get sued. The employee very much is the enemy. The HR department is doing its job correctly if the employees receive all of their benefits that they are unambiguously fully entitled to and get as little as possible in excess of that.

If you can prove that you definitely have the right to something you aren't getting then go ahead and prove it.

Bit like recruitment.

If you’ve had a lot of dealings with HR in every job perhaps they’re not the entire problem.

Have you tried contacting ACAS? I’d also suggest joining a union if you’re not in one already.

Oh stop it. HR professionals often have law or psychology degrees. It's not a simple role. It's not full of dullards even if you've had issues.

I once got summoned to HR for not going to work during a snow storm (despite me informing my supervisor by phone as per company rules), as another person in the village had made it in ( she didn't live at the bottom of a very steep un -gritted hill). Imagine the look on the HR person's face when I pointed out the section in the company's own hand book that stated " if you feel it is not safe to drive during bad weather then DO NOT attempt to do so. Others may feel differently but it is up to you to use your own judgment". I asked why I was being disciplined for following the company's own guidance. The matter was swiftly dropped.