AIBU that our friends are much richer than they've let on?

[richmanpoorman]

Long and weird one, that has completely split a friend group.
18 years ago we attended antenatal classes and met a lovely group of people. Out of 8 couples in the class, 5 have stayed in the same location and we’ve all become super close. We see each other all the time in big and small groups and go on a holiday once a year. The children are all very close.

Now all our oldest are 18 they’re all looking at university. The kids were all out having a drink and the subject of funding came up. They’re all doing a combination of loans plus parental contribution except one lad who drunkenly admitted that his parents have a fund for him and his younger sister, for university and house deposits, of around £850k.

Under any other circumstances this would have been none of our business… except for the last 18 years they’ve pleaded poverty. As a group we are all in a relatively comfortable situation, with the exception of this couple who despite quite impressive sounding jobs were very open about struggling financially with a big mortgage etc. Therefore we’ve all been really careful. Every time we’ve gone out for we pick a budget option. Every holiday has been planned based on the fact that they could only pay half what others could afford so we’ve spent 18 years staying in some pretty grim self catering places. In context, say they paid £500 for their share of the accommodation- another £500 (or even £250) from each couple would have been a nice upgrade holiday wise.

It turns out that they made a decision to only live on one income, and to totally save and invest the other income. Apparently they have just therefore never factored it into consideration as it went straight into various investment accounts, so they were technically broke as it wasn’t then easily accessible. One year we all actually paid for her son to attend rugby camp as they didn’t have the cash. It wasn’t a lot of money (£20 a day) but the audacity feels huge.

3 of the couples have stopped speaking to them. (Tbh it might have landed better if the last holiday self catering place hadn’t had been so totally grim, with the younger daughter of one of the families injuring herself due to some shoddy maintenance….)

DH and I are more on the fence. While as a group we all earn roughly the same we do come from different backgrounds- DH and I a more modest teacher/ nurse/ bookkeeper/ florist combo compared to some of the others who did have significant financial help early on in life. This early financial help is clear in the lives they live- with similar earnings we have a much smaller house, state schools etc. Family help early on has made a massive difference to the lives of some in the group. The couple in question have explained that they both come from very impoverished backgrounds, with a lot of financial insecurity. Good degrees and careers landed them in a group of friends where it was obvious the impact money had early in life (eg house deposits, no loans etc). So they made the decision to do that for their children. They’re not materialistic themselves so didn’t miss skiing/ nice clothes/ smart cars/ home decor etc, so they just decided to “hack” their kids into a fantastic start in life.

Our other friends argue that the impact of another £1-2k a year on a few nicer holidays and dinners etc wouldn’t have materially impacted the fund, and would have meant that we could have had better group experiences, plus there’s all the intangible stuff like not suggesting we stop for coffees because it felt uncomfortable that they wouldn’t get anything, and being careful talking about other spending in case it seemed insensitive.

I’m so upset. We had such a lovely group with such a strong bond and now it’s all a mess. We’re the only couple still talking to everyone which in itself is causing problems. I’m posting here because we’ve just been added to a group called “Skiing 2025” with all of the group except this couple, which seems pointed (because we’ve never even suggested skiing before because of the cost.)

The kids are upset. The son is deeply depressed that he started this and they’re trying to stay friends separately.

I suppose my AIBU is “am I being unreasonable to be pissed off that my friends were richer than they let on?” and more broadly what would people do?

Ps- I’m aware some of them are on Mumsnet….

The couple are a pair of shysters and I’m not surprised people are pissed off at them. Friends don’t lie to friends and that’s what they’ve done. It’s very easy to say “ Hey we’re trying to save this year so if you want to go to x then crack on we’ll bow out” My friend earns more than me and sometimes she wants to do something I can’t afford. That’s fine. I don’t do it. What I don’t do is pretend I can’t afford it so she subsidises me or let her talk herself of going because I want her to have the experience.

ComeAlongPeggy
I don't think it's about having to explain details of finances so much as this couple have made a calculated decision to lie for almost 20 years.

When I'm invited on days out or visits or meals, I rsvp based on what the activity is and whether it's ok my budget. If out at a play place or a park, I can bring my own coffee when others get take out. It doesn't bother me saying "that sounds fun but it's not in my budget this month" or "we're saving so I'm looking for free/inexpensive activities for the DC this half term".
That's true of many friends too.

We all know everyone will have different household incomes, different financial commitments and different budgets for disposable income.

The issue in OP's situation is that this couple have chosen to deliberately create a facade of poverty when in reality it was different financial priorities.

Like many people DH and I had to rough it somewhat on holidays, with friends and without, when we were younger. We were all in the same boat financially.
We were young and we had fun but if any of us were substantially poorer and we’d taken that into account so as to include them…. (And that may have happened to some extent from time to time)…
Well, I think that to discover later that it wasn’t true would change the way we felt about them.
It’s the deceit.

I'd not really care tbh. They have inadvertently made everyone economise over the years. Lucky kids to have parents who will put themselves through 18 years of scrimping to give them a great start in life. I hope the kids appreciate what their parents have done for them.

It sounds like they had great childhood experiences. Even OP says they had great holidays.

You are making it sound like what a shame the poor DC had to slum it every single year on holiday in a self catering cottage instead of a 5 star hotel.

This thread is quite mad.

I should add I'm also not British. I honestly think this must be a factor as I am reading this thread and it's replies in disbelief.

Yikes. That’s not being careful with money, it’s about fleecing their friends for years. A ‘friend’ who did this to me would be my friend no more. Disgustingly selfish and just… disgusting!

Ok, so the rugby was £100 and beyond that you all just did cheaper activities but you enjoyed them and the family’s company for 18 years. At any point you could have made the choice for the more expensive option and the may or may not have participated.

Ask for £100 back and call it even.

It's the lying isn't it? I have plenty of friends who choose to budget and are frugal- they don't lie about it, they just say they want to save. Only thing I'm not clear on is if you all knew each other so well then how come no one worked it put earlier?! I don't know my friends' salaries exactly but eg if they're a teacher and a plumber I have a rough idea of their income...

Where were they fleecing their friends for years?

It also sounds like the rugby thing wasn’t a priority for them or their child.

This all sounds mad to me from the knowing the ins and outs of each others income/savings etc to the amount of group holidays taken… no matter the budget…

Is it a shock to some to find out people don’t like being lied too?

Oh we are very up front about it. We always say "We'll be taking a packed lunch/flask" and we never fake poverty. We just see some things as a waste of money and are upfront about it. We wouldn't say we can't afford glamping pods etc. We'd say we didn't want to pay that much because its not worth it (to us) and we'd rather go camping. The trouble with that though is that some people see that as a challenge and try to convince you. So it could be that these people have gone down the 'can't afford it' narrative. Which I understand, because groups can be pushy.

What would you have done differently if you had known the reason? They still would have had the same amount of money to spend and you would still have been left with the choice of doing it cheaper or not inviting them.

I agree with a PP who drew an analogy with a couple who decide to use a large portion of their income to pay off mortgage quicker or pay extra into pension.

In those situations would you think the couple has been dishonest about how well off they are? Would you think of the extra mortgage/pension payments as “hidden” money they could have spent on holidays and coffees?

In this case the couple tied up the money so they never had access to it - so in their heads they genuinely did not have the extra money. A bit like paying extra into pension via salary sacrifice. Is it even dishonest for them to say they don’t have the extra money?

Agreed….

and to the people who wonder why they didn’t say anything upfront….look at some of these responses in this thread. I’d make a killing if I were to hold a torch and pitchfork sale 🤣

What would you have done differently if you had known the reason? They still would have had the same amount of money to spend and you would still have been left with the choice of doing it cheaper or not inviting them.

They wouldn’t have felt guilty about leaving them out.

Wow that's some commitment saving a whole wage for 18 years ! I do find it odd though as you have been friends for 18 years that it never came up in conversation when talking about children going to uni or buying new car or whatever. Normally others finances aren't other people's business but as their choices have impacted the groups choices without the full facts I think I would be a bit miffed too .

To be fair it sounds like the dad who paid for the couple's child did this completely off his own back.

It's the dishonesty that's the problem.

I know a couple like this 'oh we can't afford it'. What they actually mean is 'we don't want to afford it, we want to use our money differently'. I realised this early, going out was always a pain as it was the cheapest option, so I didn't entertain it. Unfortunately the cheapest often turns out to be least value first money.

So they have lied to you. You have accommodated their wishes to include them and they have just gone along with it. Did you ever suggest a dearer place, did they ever choose/book it? Did they always pay equally for food etc?

I assume with the rugby thing you paid because you thought they couldn't afford it rather than you sometimes paying for each others kids.

I think I would quietly let the friendship drop, I don't think I'd ever forget this.

People will always be surprised at what other people spend money on. I have plenty of friends who buy one or two coffees every day, some people get their hair and nails done every few weeks, some people go to Disneyland. I would see all of these as a massive waste of money because they’re not things that bring me joy
My point is that if someone says “this is what I’m happy to spend” on a group holiday, we just have to accept that. It may be because they spend £500 a week on organic ready meals, or they are putting a child through intensive tennis coaching, or they only go to a Mayfair salon for their hair, or they’re saving for their children’s university fees, or whatever.

I liked my NCT friends a lot and am still close with two of them. But, for example, when I chose private school for my dc, one of the dads just couldn’t get over his reverse snobbery about it and was horrid to me (none of the others were, I didn’t make a big thing of it). So anytime I might have said no to a group thing that cost too much, he’d say “well that because you have ridiculous posh school to pay for” type comments and it was so annoying and also felt quite bullying. If I could have kept the school quiet, I would have done!

I just wonder how much “oh go on, you only like once” “don’t be so boring!” Etc comments your friends would have had over the years if they’d explained that they were living on one salary and why.

I do get why people were upset. But I can also see the other side!

Totally agree, but this appears to be the only money outplayed to them. The rest was just aligning costs with their budget.

Absolutely agree with this

I think you book holidays but no longer subsidise them. If they can't afford it then they don't go.

I have worked with/friends with a couple of people who either inherited substantial sums or started up their own business that then sold for a similar sum. Both are fairly frugal in their day to day lifestyle (apart from maybe their DCs private education) so you wouldn't necessarily realise from looking at their life, but one in particular who inherited is always on the cadge and "forgets" his credit card (despite a bank account with Coutts!) I think there's an element of they don't believe it will last or the reason his family have money is that they have never spent any! 😂

I have never plead poverty but I did have a friend who wanted to know our financial situation she was quite free and easy with telling us what her extension cost, how much she had given adult children, it was obvious she did it so we would join in with we are planning or we gave answers. It came to a head when she put her house up for sale for 750k with her comment of course you could afford to buy it. I just evaded what was a thinly veiled question.