What does your network think about trans people?

[deeter]

Immediate family think it's all a bit silly, trans people should be treated well but you cannot change sex. Women's spaces should be protected etc.

But interestingly all of my university friends think trans women are women (did go to a London uni with well to do sorts).

I'm 31 btw.

What a bizarre post. We obviously disagree but I’m not going to accuse you of lying about your beliefs. So odd.

It's quite something isn't it.

Your husband isn’t a woman because it sounds like his gender identity and sex are aligned.

Trans women don’t threaten my dignity. I’m happy to accept them in my spaces.

We obviously disagree but I’m not going to accuse you of lying about your beliefs.

You are lying about biological fact - not 'your beliefs'. Can you no longer tell the difference? Is this what happens in a post truth era? 🤔

Trans women don’t threaten my dignity. I’m happy to accept them in my spaces.

Earlier in the thread you said you didn't want Isla Bryson, Katie Dolatowski and Barbie khardashian in your spaces.

All transwomen by their own testimony.

So what gives?

This 💯 you cannot change your sex.

You might feel more stereo typically masculine or stereo typically feminine and chose to select a gender from a list of over 150 choices but it still doesn't mean you can transform yourself from actual biological sex.... it's in your DNA. Basic science.

Trans people are human. Some of them will be violent, some will be rapists, most will be ordinary.

Same as literally every other group of human on earth. Including children!

You can support the rights and values of a group as a whole without excusing the acts of criminals.

You can support the rights and values of a group as a whole without excusing the acts of criminals.

So do you want them in your space or not? You said they were 'women' so 🤷‍♀️

No one is saying that they can. For trans people and their supporters, gender is distinct from sex.

But you can speak for yourself and your own understanding of gender. You are a woman and you are not trans, so presumably you are of the female sex and also identify as a woman by gender. So, for you, what does having the gender of woman mean? How do you know you have it? What is it, that is separate from your biological sex, and shared with trans women that means you know you're a woman by gender? Because I know I'm a woman because I'm of the female sex, but what criteria should I use to identify my gender?

Your husband isn’t a woman because it sounds like his gender identity and sex are aligned

If a big manly man with a beard wearing a suit stood in front of you and said 'I'm a woman' would you believe he was a woman? Welcome him into your female changing room?

There's never an excuse for hate

It's not 'hate' to want our single sex spaces kept single sex.

The naivety (or stupidity) of those happy to remove actual women's rights and protections in order to pander to the feelings of a subset of men absolutely astounds me.

For trans people and their supporters, gender is distinct from sex.

Agreed. So they can keep out of single sex spaces then.

And no, before you start the gender/sex sleight of hand - they aren't gender specific spaces, became there are dozens of genders and spaces have never been aligned to dozens of genders.

How about the trans women who have attacked and raped women with their 'female' penises? What about them? There are a list of these trans women offenders in prison, they all day they are women. They have all attacked women

Trans people are human. Some of them will be violent, some will be rapists, most will be ordinary.

And you want to remove any boundaries

Every single person I know in rl would support trans rights.

I makes me really sad that mn has so much anti-trans content.

The things I read here about trans people remind me of how people spoke about gay people in the 1980s - all the focus on "my narrow understanding of biology says your experiences and understanding of your own identity are invalid, so I'm going to treat you like shit" stuff is dead on.

all the focus on "my narrow understanding of biology says your experiences and understanding of your own identity are invalid

Please do inform us about how your 'superior' understanding of biology shows us that people can change sex

Maybe read the thread?

I'd be interested too.

Sounds like the young person on Question Time who told Professer Robert Winston when he stated that you cannot change sex that science had moved on. Completely deluded and actually believed what she was spouting to a Professor!

So of the 125 transgender prisoners counted by the prison service in 2017, 60 had been convicted of sexual offenses, including 27 convicted of rape. Do you think they should be housed in the female prison estate given that to you they are literally women?

I only realised last year that Mumsnet is an absolute hotbed of transphobic beliefs. Other organisations have cut ties with this site because of how hateful the views expressed by the majority of its users are, with no attempt at moderation.

For trans people and their supporters, gender is distinct from sex

Ok, so again, IF GENDER IS DISTINCT FROM SEX, WHY DO MEN WHO CLAIM TO HAVE A GENDER IDENTITY NEED ACCESS TO FEMALE ONLY SPACES WHICH ARE BASED ON SEX?

Trans people already have the same rights as everyone else.

What they demand is that the males suddenly and inexplicably become immune to any and all social norms, laws and safeguarding that apply to all other men based on nothing but some nebulous claim to womenhood.

It IS NOT a human right for grown men to have access to women and girls when they are at their most vulnerable and i will naturally assume that ANY man ignoring these boundaries is a threat.

People have just robustly told you that factually you cannot change your sex although you can select your gender.

That biological women need protection from all men since its impossible to say which are dangerous or not, some men are dangerous and some trans women are dangerous (that's why they are in prison). Many men and many trans women are not a risk but no way to tell so protect all women by keeping all men out of women's and girls safe spaces.

These points are not transphobic.

Characterising trans people as dangers to women is transphobic.

Screaming in all caps about how trans women are not women is transphobic.

Talking about ‘blokes in dresses’ and their ‘dicks’ (the way many women on Mumsnet do) is transphobic.

Many people in the real world consider Mumsnet to be a transphobic online space.

Funny how they just keep repeating the same lines and the 'mumsnet hotbed of transphobia' shite without actually answering any questions.

That doesn't work here.
We've been at this bullshit for years and NOT ONE person has ever come up with a convincing argument for gender identity ideology and why we should, for some strange reason, prioritise it over sex.

Because they can't. Only threats and emotional blackmail. Or calling us meanies and flouncing.

'Trans' is a feelings based ideology. Nothing to to with biology.

Have you just assumed the posters DH's gender identity?

That is literal violence.