XL Bullies to be destroyed now!

[Babycatsarenice]

Sick of these monsters still being on our streets (I never see them muzzled as their irresponsible owners don't comply) and worse still knowing that they are still in homes with children.

AIBU that they should be put to sleep NOW

Yanbu OP. Anyone who disagrees with you is delusional and part of the problem.

Loads of dog lovers have agreed these dogs are monsters and should be put to sleep. But some dog lovers are still too blinded by their love of dogs and feel too sentimental about them to finally back down, hold their hands up and accept that these dogs shouldn’t be alive.

What is your suggestion for legislation that will definitely prevent any more deaths?

You'd have to make human beings sterile and take away anything that could be used as a weapon for that.

Humans are the most dangerous thing on this planet, and they make everything non-dangerous dangerous.

It's not going to help because then breeders create another breed that's similar but not illegal, and then that gets banned so they move on to the next one, etc. It's the same thing they do for drugs and legal highs.

"Blame the owners, not the dogs"

It's not about blaming anyone, at the end of the day it's about keeping people safe and these dogs aren't safe.

Dogs other than pitbulls have a low rate of mauling and killing in comparison, what you see in the media now isn't the hype that there was when we didn't have bloodsport dogs in family it's real, before it was media hype over a few incidences because it was so uncommon. Here is the wikipedia list of deaths by all dogs in the UK https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_Kingdom , the unusual thing about the recent maulings is that they're regularly killing adults. In the stats before this, alot of the deaths are on infants which while unacceptable is telling that the aforementioned breeds very rarely succeeded in killing an adult that could defend themselves. It's almost exclusively bloodsport breeds (pitbulls, american bulldogs, bull terriers) that kill healthy adults with no medical conditions, oftentimes alone vs working in pairs which is common for dogs like rottweillers.

If anyone is interested in further breakdown, it isn't a UK source but gives a good breakdown of attacks by breed and age of victim.
https://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statistics-multi-year-fatality-report-2005-2017.php

For none fatal dog attacks, here are some studies on dog bites, pitbulls also lead the way (an xl bully is a pitbull crossed with a molosser for size) https://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statistics-studies-level-1-trauma-table-2011-present.php

Please can we stop with the Kimbo bullshit?!

There is ZERO evidence that any of Kimbos genetics are actually here in the UK.

There is ZERO evidence that dogs related to Kimbo have killed anyone if they exist.

Twatty ego-boosting breeders claimed Kimbo lines to big up their crossbred mutts on pedigrees that are typically invented by the breeder and verified by absolutely no DNA proof at all.

One massively anti-dog outfit decided to jump on the Kimbo story and they refused to back it up with actual evidence (ie dna linking dogs to Kimbo).

XL Bullies in the UK are crossbreeds - mixtures of staffie, pitbull types, american bulldogs, olde tyme bulldogges, cane corsos and much much more.

Some of them will have been selectively bred for their willingness to lunge and yell and bark and grab stuff. Many of them won't and have simply been bred for their appearance with no thought whatsoever to their parents or grandparents.

In every case to date, I can find housing, husbandry, training and health reasons for an increased potential for dangerously aggressive behaviour (vs defensively aggressive ie a dog warning folk to back off and trying to get away).

In many cases, the reason was a total lack of appropriate training and a highly aroused dog 'playing' the way they had been taught to play - grabbing at limbs and not letting go (just visit tiktok to see people teaching other people how to teach their dogs to do this!).

The common denominator in dog attacks is people - failing to meet the needs of the dogs they choose to keep, choosing highly unsuitable dogs for their circumstances, using aversive training methods, training for 'protection work' (ie, to grab people by the arm or leg).

100,000,000% agree! I'm sick of hearing about innocent people & kids being mauled to death.

I'm also sick of hearing about people thinking they know better than veterinary professors who've proven that tendencies of this violent behaviour is quite literally evident within the DNA of these animals. But yet Jeff on Facebook knows better! 🙄

Yeah I'd have them all put down.
People who argue its the owners etc.. is the same arguments people in the US day about gun control. Get rid of all of them

Bring in dog licence for breeding

All the animal charities clearly state it’s not the dogs it’s the owners.
Its not one size fits all
Animals and humans can be aggressive if they are brought up to be.
The problem with xl bullies is their jaws are so strong they can do serious damage.

Id say jail the owners of all aggressive animals that aren’t or can’t be controlled

Should all xl bullies be destroyed now…..No. no more than the wrongs of a death sentence for murderers, rapists and drug dealers that all ruin lives
Should xl bullies owners be jailed……Yes. If their dogs cause death or serious injury they should receive the same sentence as if they caused it.

Should xl bullies that cause harm be destroyed. If they cannot be rehabilitated and only on the advice of those qualified to make that decision then yes.

@WiddlinDiddlin "In every case to date, I can find housing, husbandry, training and health reasons for an increased potential for dangerously aggressive behaviour (vs defensively aggressive ie a dog warning folk to back off and trying to get away)."
Surely this tells you it's a breed problem? Rescued animal testing beagles and rescued puppy farming goldens aren't killing people or inflicting serious bites en masse, there are no retired greyhound deaths. Surely what you say supports a ban, when certain breeds will maul and kill people unless they're properly managed? Your argument against aversives is exactly why XLs should be demonised and banned - if they go wrong, they can cause a dog to kill people therefore they're not safe for anyone to own.

Highly qualified and experienced Veterinary professors have proven beyond any doubt using science that this behaviour is evident within the dna of these 'animals'. It is NOTHING to do with how they're raised ffs

Where do you live? I live in a nice village near to a city and they're everywhere. Always being walked by some absolute tool with their knuckles scraping the ground. Of course, no muzzle and sometimes off the lead (post ban)

I have and they're scary fuckers.

This is the type of post I mean - it doesn't move anything forward just to dismiss those you don't agree with us as "delusional".

Some more constructive argument on this thread elsewhere tho, so that is positive.

Thank you for being open to debate @AddictedToBooks and I readily admit that if I knew someone with lovely XL, I wouldn't be so quick to demonise the breed. Unfortunately, everything I have been reading so far, from history of lineage to dog behaviourists biews, supports the view that these dogs are unpredictable and coupled with their sheer strength, I don't think we can take the risk. But for the moment, if the restrictions of the ban are being enforced, it is a good first step.

Evident within the DNA? How does that work then? Did they look at it through an electron microscope and see little snarling faces in amongst the nucleotides?

Do you know what every owner says after an attack “it’s never done that before”

It's amazing how some are blind to this. Every single dog breed has been bred over time to enhance certain characteristics that humans find beneficial. And yet, XL Bully supporters ignore the "donor" dna of fighting breeds. I do feel sorry for the dogs as they didn't have any choice in it, and as I've said before, it's the breeders that need to be shot. If anyone is going to try and create a nice companion breed, why does it need to have its roots in aggressive breeds?

That said, the way they are raised does have significant impact. Only to make the fuse shorter or longer, but if said fuse is sufficiently long, it may never go off. Depends on how much you want to stake on that word may though.

I'm so sorry you've gone through that but so pleased your cat found his way to you and rescued you ❤️

I took often wonder with my animals who rescued who.

And for those saying it's the owner not the dog, it's been proven recently that they can single out genes that cause a dog to either have episodes of predictable or unpredictable aggression. It would be interesting to see the results of these tests on XLs and bull breeds. https://laboklin.com/en/products/genetics/hereditary-diseases/dog/behaviour-propensity/#:~:text=Dogs%20that%20are%20heterozygous%20for,the%20homozygous%20genotype%20A22%2FA22.

Border collies herd
Sighthounds chase
GSD’s guard

XL pitbull crosses are bred from fighting dogs hence the dog aggression and now human aggression of these brutes.

Nico bred of Killer Kimbo was human aggressive- it slaughtered a 4 yr old.

These are unstable

They look so sullen with dead cold eyes, completely different to the keen intelligence of border Collie -

Border Collies don’t make good pets either- they need work- but they don’t maul people to death - or kill other dogs.

The dimness and lack of trainability coupled with violence is not a good combo.

No, it hasn't been proven. No, they have not singled out genes that cause a dog to have episodes of aggression. Read it again:

"Dogs that are heterozygous for A22 (A0/A22 or A10/A22) are reported to show behaviour considered by some owners to be adverse and/or potentially undesirable. However, dogs with the most extreme behaviour are more likely to have the homozygous genotype A22/A22.
Please note that behaviour is composed with many other factors that could influence or trigger aggressive behaviour (e.g. painful diseases, persistent environmental stress or inappropriate educational methods) besides to this genetic variant. Moreover, this test only provides information about a single genetic predisposition of the dog. This result does not allow any presumption about the actually trainability or communicative behaviour of the dog.

@AntonFeckoff I read it just fine, my point is that dogs that are prone to get into the zone and are unable to be switched off often have a22 in common. The thing you bolded is just the same as the fact that there are plenty of psychopaths in the world and not many will go onto become serial killers, because nurture comes into play. However a dog is not a human, and given the fact that we're dealing with a species barrier it would make sense to not have dogs that can be nurtured (with a genetic predisposition under the surface) to being doggy psychopaths if a good amount of human error is involved. Because there will always be human error.

Tell me you're not a scientist without telling me you're not a scientist