XL Bullies to be destroyed now!

[Babycatsarenice]

Sick of these monsters still being on our streets (I never see them muzzled as their irresponsible owners don't comply) and worse still knowing that they are still in homes with children.

AIBU that they should be put to sleep NOW

@IsEveryUserNameBloodyTaken the Office of National Statistics collects and publish data on death by dog bite or strike every year and every year since pitbull types were banned the number of deaths by dog bite or strike has increased.

I don't see how can that be called a success?

I thought we were talking about XLBs, not Pitbulls. Whilst XLBs have Pitbull in the mix, they aren't the same. They've been bastardised with other genes.

I know right….pit apologists and their chihuahua comparisons.Its like a mantra they all repeat.Wish they would come out with something original.

If Pits were fully legal we may have had far more deaths by Pitbull in the last 30 odd years.

In USA and Brazil deaths and maulings by Pits are so common.

They are always escaping from chains or from some crappy back yard and wreaking havoc on the local children or vulnerable people.

Shelters are heaving with the things - Idiots breeding them and filling shelters with them.

That bloke killed by them in Compton recently was partially ingested by the Bullies he bred.

They make societies where they proliferate dangerous.

Exactly I said the same and then someone asked where are the stats for that….well duh

The number of pitbull types registered as exempt has also remained steady. There are just as many of them today as there were when they were banned.

Yes but if they weren’t banned back then there would have been far more around owned by any Tom Dick or Harry.At least with the ban owners know they have to keep their nose clean so to speak.

How about we euthanise all the dangerous humans as well?
Or is it only animals that deserve this treatment?

They shouldn’t exist in the first place.
Coming from the breeds once used for bull baiting and more recently dog fighting that shouldn’t happen either.
Oh and you missed a word out “Or is it only dangerous animals that deserve this treatment”.

Why do people always think this argument is some kind of gotcha?

Humans and animals do not have equal rights in our society. If they did, cats would be sent to prison for murder for killing mice.

We don’t genetically modify humans to have certain characteristics, particularly violence.

All dogs are fake in principle, created by human whims. All the creations that have gone wrong and result in violent dogs incompatible with safe society should be uncreated again. Same for creations which result in discomfort and health issues for the dogs themselves. Uncreate them.

I agree.

It IS the owners, not the dogs. Sadly though it would never be acceptable to put the owners to sleep. The only next option in order to prevent more deaths is to cull the dogs. Brutal and I would weep for the dogs but humans come first and it’s the only solution.

From a welfare point of view, I agree. But if we "uncreate" them a breed at a time all that will happen is the will move on to the next creation/breed and destroy that.

Which is why restrictions on breeding would have a bigger impact than banning breeds. It would stop unhealthy or aggressive animals from being bred in the first place. It would also reduce the access certain types of people have to these animals as no responsible breeder is going to sell their champion-bred staffy pup to the local crackhead.

This 👆

Although since it is a point that has been made repeatedly, I fear we are talking to unreasonable people.

Sadly it IS the dogs. {Aggressive fighting types} They have been selected for hundreds of years for 'Gameness' -the desire to carry on mauling no matter what.

Kindly people have taken Pit bull types on as puppies and had their children killed.{EG:
The Bennards and others}
There are so many cases of people who are what would be termed 'Kind' owners who have been mauled- not to mention pets and other animals.

Dogs bred from fighting lines are going to have that trait in them.

Border Collies - born to herd.
Even in a pet home these seek to 'herd' children and become totally ball obsessed and frustrated if under stimulated mentally.

Working Cocker Spaniels - endlessly on the go, yet sedentary people still buy them as ''Pets''.

Lurchers- innate drive to chase , to go from 0-30 in a split second - denying the nature of any dog and saying ''It's the people'' isn't true.

People can only ameliorate a dog's innate drives- but the capacity to flip into mauler mode is still there. These XL Pits have been so grotesquely inbred that this makes the fighting with pet dogs and cats, and attacks on children and the vulnerable even more likely.

Herding, chasing, tracking/scent work etc are all behaviours that are innate to the genome. Aggression within the species and towards non-prey animals is not.

That's why you'll occasionally find a terrier who likes to herd or a collie who likes to chase.

Are you incapable of understanding that the ability to attack & the ability to cause harm are separate things, or are you just pretending?

So why do Pit bulls exist? They are selected to be 'game' and to maul larger animals and then when bull baiting was outlawed, the idiots realised that these Bull types will happily maul each other.

It's what they love doing, which is why so many of the XL ads looking for new homes
''Nala is looking for a new home without cats or dogs or young children
Nala is dog-selective on walks
Nala is strong and needs a strong owner''

For this read ''Nala wants to lay in to any dog she sees on a walk''

XL ads looking for new homes

There won't be any more of these in the UK now as it is illegal.

They were bred, originally, as ratting dogs, which is why terriers were used when "creating" them but that doesn't mean their aggression is an innate behavioural drive like herding or tracking is. It comes from a fear response. The fear response is present in all mammals (fight, flight, or freeze).

If you lock a chihuahua in a pen with a bull it will either freeze or fight. The same would occur if you locked a rottweiler, springer spaniel, labradoodle, human, or hamster in with a wild bull. Clearly, some of these animals would have a better chance of surviving than others but the base response is still the same.

You can strengthen the chance of having an animal whose response would be to fight rather than freeze via selective breeding but that still does not change the fear response into a base behavioural drive. It is still a fear response.

Fighting breeds were selectively bred for their fight response and this historical breeding has resulted in the propensity for aggression toward other dogs but they were not typically bred for aggression towards humans. The opposite was true. The dogs needed to be handled while in a high state of arousal and so any dog who showed aggression to a person was not bred from as they weren't useful.

Not all fighting dogs will go on to develop dog-to-dog aggression, even dogs who have been used as fighting or bait dogs can go on to live happy, healthy lives in the right environment (Micheal Vick's dogs, for example)

That's not to say breeding for aggression may not have been an issue in more recent times and aggression can be bred into any animal with a fear response (see the silver fox study).

I'm not actually a fan of XL Bullies. I will happily admit there is something untoward going on with the breed. I don't think enough data exists for us to know for certain what that is. On the one hand, they have been responsible for a high number of attacks, on the other hand, all of the publicised attacks were a direct result of handler/owner negligence. Without in-depth research it is impossible to say these dogs are innately aggressive by breed alone.

My gut feeling is that they are the victim of the perfect storm. They gained sudden popularity during lockdown. The dogs who are maturing now didn't have the same opportunities for socialisation as dogs born before lockdown. They became popular with the wrong types of people who are not interested in breeding responsibly and who may well be breeding for aggression.

But the point is banning them is not going to change anything. Bull breeds are not inherently different, behaviourally, to any other breed. They have all the same base drives and the same fear responses as a labrador. What has happened to them as the result of poor breeding by unscrupulous people could happen with any breed.

We need to shift the focus to responsible breeding and ownership if we ever want to see a difference.

@Frequency

But the point is banning them is not going to change anything. Bull breeds are not inherently different, behaviourally, to any other breed. They have all the same base drives and the same fear responses as a labrador. What has happened to them as the result of poor breeding by unscrupulous people could happen with any breed.

It couldn't happen with 'any breed' though.

Because most other breeds can be overpowered IF poor breeding and dickhead owners make them dangerous when they go into attack mode.

Any dog may be dangerous but most dogs can be overpowered if necessary. It is rare that, when in attack mode, an XL bully could be overpowered. Even by multiple people. Guns and tasers have had to be used on them.

So while we could have an epidemic of collies, chihuahuas or labs with poor breeding and shit owners having fear responses manifesting as aggression, the outcome would not be the same. It wouldn't be multiple catastrophic injuries and deaths because they can largely be overpowered.

That is the difference.

So while we could have an epidemic of collies, chihuahuas or labs with poor breeding and shit owners having fear responses manifesting as aggression, the outcome would notbe the same. It wouldn't be multiple catastrophic injuries and deaths because they can largely be overpowered.

A lab or collie could very well do a lot of damage in a short space of time and while a collie could be easily overpowered by a single person I very much doubt an aggressive lab could be brought under control so easily, they are powerful dogs when they want/need to be.

Besides labs, collies and lapdogs do not make up the entire canine population besides bull breeds there are also guardian breeds like Rottweillers or Carpathian Shepherds, Mastiff breeds, and Northern breeds like Akitas or Malamutes all of which could do considerable damage, and are physically large, powerful breeds.

Frankly, I'd rather take my chances with an aggressive XL bully over an aggressive Tibetan Mastiff or Cane Corso.

@Frequency

A lab or collie could very well do a lot of damage in a short space of time and while a collie could be easily overpowered by a single person I very doubt an aggressive lab could be brought under control so easily, they are powerful dogs when they want/need to be.

They couldn't do anywhere near the same level of damage as an XL bully if all else was equal about the situation. You must acknowledge that, unless you have no experience of any of the breeds involved and haven't seen pictures of the breeds and the injuries from maulings?

If left alone in a room with an incapacitated victim yes they could eventually cause catastrophic, life changing injuries and even deaths. But in a situation where owners and passers by are present, they are far, far more likely to be overpowered and brought under control by multiple people working together.

It would be vanishingly rare for a lab or collie to have to be shot or tasered to be brought under control if multiple people were trying to overpower it using things like brooms / metal bin lids etc as has been the case with XL bullies recently.

It seems foolish to keep suggesting there is so much equivalence between XL bullies and common pet breeds.

I don't think anyone should own a dog they can't overpower. It's foolish.

And if there are children in the home, it's utterly selfish.