To not vote Labour because of their abhorrent views on the female sex?

[Lion400]

Starmer cannot represent women, he can’t even define us. Questioning a trans person is a hate crime, but misogyny is not. Sorry Labour, you’ve lost my vote. Have they lost anyone else’s??

‘On trans ideology, the vast majority of voters, and certainly a majority of traditional Labour voters from working class backgrounds, tend to cast a sceptical eye on the tenets of an ideological movement that asserts that biological men must be accepted as women – and be offered similar rights and access to women’s spaces and sports as women – simply by asserting their new status’

I'm not hostile to LGBT people.

The fact that sex matters and that women are harmed by the legal fiction that some men are women is well documented.

There are ways to ensure that everyone's needs are met, it's a pity that the Labour Party won't consider the needs of women fully.

What is TRSOH?

'The Right Side Of History'

I think the fact that most of you would seemingly be furious if a child like Brianna used the ladies’ loo is totally relevant to discussion. Trans women are already massively marginalised, discriminated against and at risk. Why on earth do you seem to think they’re more likely to attack you in the ladies’ than that they’ll be attacked in the men’s? 🤯

Women are not human shields / support humans for men. If transwomen need protection from other men in men's toilets, a third space should be provided / used.

And you'll need to provide solid evidence for this: 'Trans women are already massively marginalised, discriminated against and at risk.' I'm not sure the stats support it.

I don't think this is about feminism, women's rights or safety for these self styled GC posters. As so often happens people have knee-jerk reactions to things that are outside their narrow world view, things that go against ingrained societal norms. In short, this is about tolerance vs intolerance. And more than just tolerance, acknowledgment that we don't all fit in the same mould.

Although in case of lifeturnsonadime I suspect her obsession stems from the fact that she is at odds on this with her own child and this is her way of coping with it.

I think you know your lost your audience when even GB News was abhorred by Sunak's comment, no wonder the OP wants to delete the thread.

Hysterical thread about a non issue full of Tory bots.

CCHQ Must be worried about the outcome of an upcoming by-election 🤣

And the disturbing denials about the validity of trans identity, the denial of Brianna Ghey's having been trans being a motive for Brianna's killers, or the disgusting denial of trans people being marginalised, discriminated against and at risk are also noted.

There are many parallels in these kinds of attitudes to those who deny racism is a problem, such as the report from the Tories a couple of years ago.

Fully agree. Nauseating faux naivete posing as 'honest debate'. Tactic.

What I can never get my head around is what these women would think if trans men came into the ladies’ loo while they were there. Do they realise that some people look exactly like men but don’t have penises? Would they totally freak out? If so, where do they want them to go? 🤔

Oh my goodness, I'm not at 'odds with my own child'. She's fine as she is, a gender non conforming girl! Do you think gender non conforming autistic girls are all trans? Because they don't like wearing girly clothes and make up?

But OK make it a personal attack, nice.

Toilets are always used to minimise women's rights to safe spaces. Forget the fact that girls have been sexually assaulted by a transwomen in supermarket women's toilets for a second, and many women are probably OK with transwomen in women's toilets. The fact that some religious minority women and sexual assault survivors probably self exclude because they don't want to risk encountering a male doesn't much matter to women who think that women's spaces should be open to males who identify as trans women, afterall they're only minority women. Not the really oppressed poor trans women.

But I would have a problem with a teenage trans girl sharing a dormitory on a school residential with my daughter, afaik trans identifying teens don't access any body modification surgery (thank goodness) so I am I just supposed to pretend that my daughter is not now in a mixed sex environment?

As I said toilets are the thin edge of the wedge, focusing on toilets stops you thinking about women in prison, women in refuges, rape crisis etc....

What world view do you hold that makes you think it is OK for vulnerable women to have to encounter a male, even one who is a really nice trans woman , in those vulnerable situations?

No, you offered your own story here about how you fight on this very topic with your child.

Starmer told Sunak Brianna's mum, Esther was in the public gallery, and the clueless and utterly incompetent idiot Sunak want ahead anyway to make a cheap jibe.

The Tories will reflect on this disastrous performance and realise that this incompetent is going to lead them into the next election.

Although in case oflifeturnsonadime I suspect her obsession stems from the fact that she is at odds on this with her own child and this is her way of coping with it

That is a personal attack.

I have explained why these issues are important to me to give context. You have used that to attack me.

Take it up with MN. And maybe don't offer personal info on a thread if you don't like it being quoted.

You didn't quote it though. You used it to attack me.

I'll leave it stand, people can see who you are.

Well I think this page will be very interesting to any lurkers unaware of how low some people will stoop, to try to prevent women from voicing their concerns.

#Operation let them speak

And I notice how you have ignored all of the other reasons that women's rights are important on that post. Convenient.

The vitriol is something else

Ah the trans man strawman!

Was wondering when this one would be raised.

Women who reject womanhood are not a good reason for opening up single sex spaces to males. A transwoman being female is obviously entitled to use women's single sex spaces. Whether they want to is another matter.

If people think they might be men because they identify as l men I can't see how they can be upset by that really.

I could say this is a personal attack.

But you're clearly rattled so I understand.

I didn't see much point in addressing all your toilet-obsessed rambling that didn't make much sense. Honestly, lifeturnsonadime, have a break. Maybe even a KitKat.

odfod.

Stop being so patronising.

I’ve read this 5 times and still can’t understand what you’re trying to say

@hotinhereandthere
And the fact you didn't bother to read the rest of my post is fascinating.

Why are you posting on a thread at all if you're not engaging in the discussion?

My post was not just about toilets, just how toilets are used by tra's to minimise women's rights.