To not vote Labour because of their abhorrent views on the female sex?

[Lion400]

Starmer cannot represent women, he can’t even define us. Questioning a trans person is a hate crime, but misogyny is not. Sorry Labour, you’ve lost my vote. Have they lost anyone else’s??

‘On trans ideology, the vast majority of voters, and certainly a majority of traditional Labour voters from working class backgrounds, tend to cast a sceptical eye on the tenets of an ideological movement that asserts that biological men must be accepted as women – and be offered similar rights and access to women’s spaces and sports as women – simply by asserting their new status’

After 13 years of Tory chaos leaving the country completely fucked, I believe that Labour under Starmer will make for a fairer, more just society for everyone
Yes please, get them in

I did assume though that he was referring to this :
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/labour-nhs-england-itv-news-downing-street-b2428053.html

And tailoring his message slightly to make it more relevant to the event he was at.

But you're ok with blaming a particular group of women for the issues with Labour's obfuscation, rather than blaming Labour for the fact that they could easily allay those women's fears and are choosing not to? Can you really not see it?

life I told you yesterday I didn't think there was much value to engaging and you told me that was fine as I'm condescending and rude. So not much mileage today in you asking me questions as I'm not going to respond.

Because you can't

I have repeatedly said, I do not want to vote Tory. I have never encouraged anyone to vote Tory, not would I. Please point to the post where I said 'we should keep voting for the country to go further down the pan'.

All of the major parties hold women in utter contempt. That is the problem.

Clarification is good, it's the insinuation of some form of "queue jumping" I don't like

fair enough…but without clarification ‘insinuation’ is all we got

looking forward to the manifesto and hopefully clarification

Labour's "issues with obfuscation" are subjective so any disagreement i have is on the basis of not sharing an opinion rather than "blaming".

I think people are demanding something they aren't going to get, and in the process opening the door to a Conservative government who will do far more harm to women than Labour in the long run. This is not the time to be encouraging "protest voting", there is too much else at stake.

Tell you what. Why don't you go start an identical thread in AIBU about the Conservatives, post on that one as much as you have on here. Then we'll know this is about politicians not supporting women in general, rather than Labour specifically.

Halving violence against women and girls

How do you do that, if you think that some men are women?

Commitment to protecting women's sex based spaces

How, if 'women' means 'women and some men with a bit of paper we want to make it easier to get and which no one is allowed to ask if you've got'? Sex in the Equality Act means people of that sex plus people with a GRC who want to be seen as that sex. So womens sex based spaces are not just for women.

You yourself said Starmer was legally correct to say some women have a penis. How do you have laws to protect women, if by women you mean women and some men? It doesn't work, it cannot work, and someone at some point is going to have to grow a pair of fucking ovaries (irony) and sort it out. I don't think Starmer is that person, he's much too fond of fence sitting to grasp that nettle.

I think people are demanding something they aren't going to get, and in the process opening the door to a Conservative government who will do far more harm to women than Labour in the long run. This is not the time to be encouraging "protest voting", there is too much else at stake.

Interesting, this seems to be an express agreement that Labour is not going to be prepared to make the position on single sex spaces for women only clearly exclusive of all males (even ones with a certificate which states that they are legal females).

Isn't it a shame that the Leader of the Labour party has decided to put males first even after seeing first hand the harms done to women.

Go for it. I'll make the same suggestions for the Conservatives to get my vote, only they won't because I'm not a tory voter : S

It is the left that is letting women down on this issue.

The fact that the tories are also letting women down is irrelevant.

So women should just shut up about their fears and concerns, and vote for 'the greater good', even when that could very well mean worse for them?

No. The history of the labour movement is full of men telling women to suck it up and shut up and they'll get to women's problems when the important stuff (i.e., stuff which is more important to men) has been sorted. Are we nearly there yet? Clearly not. We'll never be there.

I do not owe Labour my vote, or my trust. It is for Labour (or any other party that wants my vote) to earn it. You can't shame me into giving it, you can't demand I give it, it's mine and if you want it, fucking earn it.

Because you can't

😂
No, I had a crack at explaining just why people don't respond on the last page or so.
It's not a question of "can't, it's you just know there's literally no point.
They'll put it back to the beginning again. It's circular.
Trans people medical care seems to be the problem for some, but have you noticed radio silence on the what about mental health care for people questioning their sexuality and struggling with feelings as put upthread?
It's straight back round to stuff like "so you want infertile people?!" 🙄

Trans people medical care seems to be the problem for some, but have you noticed radio silence on the what about mental health care for people questioning their sexuality and struggling with feelings as put upthread?

What radio silence? People have asked for a definition of what LGB healthcare should look like.

If a gay person needs therapy then they should have it. No one has said they shouldn't?

I'm not sure why mental health issues relating to being gay should be prioritised over other mental health issues, but if there is good 'peer reviewed' evidence that this is necessary then I'm all ears!

The fact that the tories are also letting women down is irrelevant.

How can it be irrelevant when they’re the only alternative. Or do you just hold Labour to stratospherically higher standards?

It is irrelevant to the way I will vote.

I'm not voting tory in any event for reasons unrelated to this issue.

I would vote Labour if they would prioritise women.

I'm not sure why you are failing to grasp this, I've been saying the same throughout the thread.

From me, using some of @lifeturnsonadime words because I agree with them.

Are we expected to

‘..ignore the fact that Keir Starmer has recently said -
-He will simplify the GRA
-He will reduce wait times for LGBT (trans) health care so peoples bodies align more with their gender feelings.
etc.

Are we seriously supposed to believe he will make these things easier for trans people then say well your birth certificate says you’re female, you've had surgery so that you resemble a female but the place for you is men's single sex spaces’

?

Starmer surely understands the illogical way in which he is framing this? I think he must do, but for some unknown reason he has attached himself to the Stonewall way of thinking, and women’s rights simply don’t matter.

• Stonewall a previously wonderful organisation started by a glorious man who was then cancelled by the trans mvt within the very same organisation he started.

https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/freedom-speech-simon-fanshawe-stonewall-trans-b1114871.html

If you want to vote for a party led by a man who has just taunted Starmer about knowing what a women is while Esther Ghey was watching in the public gallery, then you need to rake a good look in the mirror.

Starmer looked like he want to deck the odious little shit.

Disgusting of Sunak. Too busy getting his attack lines in to take account of who Brianna's mother being there. Horrible little man who is way out of his depth.

I don't think it is tasteful for either side of the 'debate' to use the murder of a child to support their position.

He is not fit to run the country, none of them are. Just get them out.

Did you listen to PMQs? No one was debating the murder of a child.

No one on here is doing that. What just happened was appalling.

I beg to differ you have literally raised it as a reason not to vote Tory.

I'm not voting Tory anyway.

The fact that a child was murdered has nothing to do with women wanting Labour to do the right thing by women or the fact that Starmer has said that less than 1% of women have a penis.