Society's attitude to sobriety

[ellie09]

I went alcohol free after New Year. Decided that alcohol was no longer for me.

I wasnt an alcoholic but I was on a slippery slope. I live alone with DS and would have spent evenings drinking secretly and many mornings feeling hungover, groggy etc. I also had horrible drunk experiences with alcohol.

It has been going really well. I found an AF red wine I really enjoy and have substituted having this a couple nights a week. My energy, mental health, everything has improved.

Its everybody else's attitude I am struggling with. For example:

1. Its somebodys leaving do at work on Friday and this person has begged and begged me to "please have a drink". I have consistently told them no as I am driving, but in the end had to make up some BS about being on antibiotics

1. Friends have planned a get together at a spa. I said I would be driving so can take us all up. Theyve also tried to poke and prod me into having a drink because "why not" and even arranged alternative lift with one of their DP so I can "have a drink and enjoy myself"

1. My own mother said it would spoil a prosecco tour that everybody wants to do on a group holiday in Budapest in April and that a couple would do me "no harm"

I havent told ANYBODY about the secret drinking (I was maybe having a bottle of wine 3-4 times a week) and they maybe thought it was just at the weekend. I do however, have a hard time stopping once I have had one, so I want to avoid being in that situation.

But why on earth is it anybodys business to try and persuade someone to change their mind?

This is the most difficult part for me in this journey. Everybody who isn't AF just cant fathom how somebody cant drink at events etc.

It is unfortunately the British attitude. "If you don't drink you are boring" and yiu can't just have a ew you have to get plastered. Good for you for trying to make healthier choices.

I've just finished Catherine Gray's excellent "The Unexpected Joy of Being Sober" which has lots of tips on how to navigate this situation, which does seem to be peculiarly British.

I live in France (where people will drink wine at breakfast) but whenever I've been out for dinner and not drinking, my fellow diners haven't batted an eyelid when they've offered me wine and I've said "no thank you, I'm on water". They've just picked up the water jug and poured me a glass.

And to the pp who asked about nice soft drinks: my current favourite is Schweppes non-alcoholic Spritz, a kind of bitter orange and tonic concoction. I know my drinking is a habit more than anything so I've replaced a 6 o'clock glass of wine with a 6 o'clock Spritz instead. That way, it feels like an apero style drink - I don't drink it at any other time of day.

I'm just say "I have a difficult relationship with booze so I chose not to drink it", and people usually stammer a bit then get me a lemonade. Fine.

Those of you who say this is about triggering the insecurity of people who don’t want to face up to the dysfunctional nature of their own drinking are totally right.

Someone stopping drinking confronts you with your own shortcomings but I think it’s part of a wider British culture of suspicion of anyone giving the impression they think they are “better than” everyone else. It’s a very negative trait.

I think in these circumstances it is worth distancing yourself from people who are mocking or undermining your lifestyle choices. It isn’t only about booze, it’s about people not supporting you in being the best version of yourself.

it’s bad they hound you as totally your decision

on the other side though, i simply don’t enjoy going on nights out with people who aren’t drinking. I just don’t and i don’t think many people do either.

why is that though @Alwaysanotherwine ? Genuinely curious. Do you find non drinkers boring, judgmental, just on another vibe etc?

Why does it make a difference to you what is in peoples glasses?

I mean, if they sit there tutting at you for drinking I could understand it, but I find it highly doubtful that ever non drinker you know does that so why?

Tell us you have an unhealthy relationship with alcohol without saying you have an unhealthy relationship with alcohol.

😀

YANBU, there was an article last a couple of weeks ago in BBC Science Focus that even drinking in moderation is bad for you.

Sobering science tells us that no amount of booze is good for our health. So should we rethink the way we drink?

This article is from...
BBC Science Focus Magazine
19 January 2024

During Dry January in 2023, the World Health Organization (WHO) issued a statement about alcohol that poured warm, stale lager on the idea that any amount of booze is good for you. There’s no such thing as a safe drink, it said.
Issued in The Lancet Public Health, the statement reminded us that “alcohol is a toxic, psychoactive and dependence-producing substance and [was] classified as a Group 1 carcinogen by the International Agency for Research on Cancer decades ago.” Sobering stuff, and a surprise for those of us who toast our health with the occasional tipple.
Everyone knows that drinking to excess is linked to a cocktail of ill health effects: damaged livers, hearts and mental health, plus increased risk of cancer. But most drinkers have also heard that, in small doses, alcohol bestows certain protective effects, such as cutting you risk of hardened arteries and reducing insulin resistance.
Of course, ‘moderate drinking’ is a subjective measure. In the UK it means 7-14 units of alcohol a week (14 units is about six pints of beer or a bottle and a half of wine). In Belgium, guidelines say that 21 drinks a week for men and 14 drinks a week for women is “low risk”. So why has the WHO decided that any amount of booze is a bad idea?
Well, the WHO statement didn’t appear in a vacuum. It partly resulted from a discussion about whether there’s a ‘threshold’ at which alcohol becomes carcinogenic, explains Dr Jürgen Rehm, from the University of Toronto, whose work looks at the harm of alcohol and other drugs on public health.
“While even [the alcohol] industry doesn’t deny that alcohol is a carcinogenic substance, there had been discussions about a potential threshold,” he says. “That led to a re-evaluation of the evidence and a reiteration of the statement from the International Agency for Research on Cancer that there’s no lower threshold.”
In other words, just a single drink a week increases your risk of cancer. This echoes what other researchers have found in recent years. “There are a number of studies on breast cancer, which demonstrate risk from less than one drink a day,” says Rehm.
And it’s not just cancer. In 2021, scientists

I haven't read the whole thread, but I think what you are describing may be age related, as a lot of young people - including my DC - don't drink at all. It's a bit like smoking to the extent that it is going out of fashion among younger people.

Personally, I enjoy a drink but it doesn't bother me at all if my friends don't drink. Why would it? What I don't like are people who are constantly going on about how much they do or do not drink or dry January or whatever. It's a bit like diet bores. Who cares, 'you do you'! These are the ones who appear to be watching and observing how much other people drink and are quite judgmental probably, I suspect, because they have a problem themselves.

Not saying you are one, by the way, OP, but I don't see why it's such a big deal just to say I don't want to today, not fancying it, or have given up, or don't enjoy it, or whatever. You don't need to give a reason, any more than you would if you were to say I don't eat avocados or meat or bananas or whatever. The fact that they are apparently trying to persuade you to drink suggests that you are giving people mixed messages, perhaps because you actually want to be persuaded.

to explain my earlier point

i think it’s because generally when i go out i’m out dancing or going to places like bongo bingos or lively wine bars with live acts etc

ime people sober generally don’t want to dance or party in the same way

i have never seen one of my non drinking friends go to say bongo bingo because they know it’s not really their scene if not drinking

non drinkers enjoy themselves but it’s not. true to say they engage in same days and nights out as drinkers - because they often don’t!

they modify their lifestyle to suit not drinking and that lifestyle often is less lively

Thanks for coming back @Alwaysanotherwine Well I think I’m fairly lively even though I don’t drink. Love going out dancing etc. but I can see if you want to go out with the pure aim of drinking to get drunk then you might think someone not drinking affects the atmosphere. There is sometimes a point in the night where everyone is drunk and making no sense etc and as I’m sober I can feel being tired etc and may call it a night earlier than those drinking, but I still feel like we’ve all had a fun time regardless of whose drinking what etc. maybe they all think I’m dull as hell though! Hope not!

I could go to something Bongos bingo and fully enjoy myself sober. I am able to let my inhibitions go without alcohol, but I know that some people can't. However I don't think that makes them boring at all.

I hate this and the U.K. has a real issue (in some age groups, not the young it seems) for pressuring people into drinking. For believing you can’t have fun sober. I rarely drink these days and I’ve had it so many times. I just drive and no-one can push you to drink then. I don’t like just going for a drink unless it’s just one after a walk with a group I’m in, I’d rather go for food with friends. I do have a few friends now who don’t drink either, whereas I’ve got some old friends who have continued to drink as much as we did in our late teens, when they are a few years off 50!

@IlsSortLaPlupartAuNuitMostly OP doesn't have to tell friends and colleagues anything of the sort. It's none of their business why she's choosing not to drink

Sorry yes, that was poorly worded. She definitely doesn't "have to". But if she doesn't then she will suffer the consequences of them thinking that she does still routinely drink and having to make up a different excuse for why she isn't every single time. They won't respect her situation if they don't know her situation.

Unfortunately it's not something that people are very happy to be open about when they are struggling with alcohol. So talking about it being frank with people, in my opinion, is the best thing that you could do if you feel able to do so.

People pushing alcohol on you need to take a good hard look at themselves. It's akin to when people try to give up smoking. Oftentimes at least in the past other smokers have been uncomfortable with this, and so offer the person a cigarette and keep offering them. And they're happy when they fail at quitting because that enables them to carry on with their own habit without having to question themselves at all or feel like they are being judged by you in some way.

The time I drank a fair bit was when I was at University, I can take it or leave it really. But over the years many people do seem almost offended if you do not drink. Last year I got very tipsy on my birthday on four drinks, they were bought for me so I drank them, because I have hardly drunk for decades now if I do it really affects me.

Just carry on not drinking and balls to anyone who comments, it’s better for your health, waistline and pocket.

This has been my whole life. I've never really liked the taste of alcohol, so I barely drink. I don't like wine...maybe the occasional cocktail but they cost too much to be a regular thing.
The amount of grief I get from just about everybody The implication that I'm some kind of killjoy or baby. It's relentless.

The UK is a nation of border-line alcoholics.

Stand strong and don’t let anyone pressure you to drink. Just be prepared for a lot of your relationships to drastically change/end. But you’ll have space for better relationships

I think it depends on what group you fall into. I think there are seven types of people who don’t drink.

You do know that drunk people are THEEE most dull people on this earth?!

I think it really varies by friend group.
I've got several friends who don't drink, all in different 'groups' (old school friend, work colleagues, uni mates etc) I've never heard anyone badgering them to do so (at least not since we were 17!) or really even mentioning it. If anything I find it great from a selfish perspective as they are often happy to drive.

You're unlucky to have so many people in your life who find it such an issue.

I think it's definitely an age thing - its much more common in the younger millennial, and even more Gen Z not to drink, so hopefully outdated attitudes about not doing so will become passe!