A question to all those who think school refusal in schools is increasing due to lazy, enabling parents...

[Edsspecialsauce]

The question I always have is why?
Why would we choose this?
I hear all the time that it's all our fault, it's just parents letting them get away with murder. Enabling their behaviour etc
How come you get families where one sibling is fine in school and the other has to be dragged in screaming?
Why would I choose to spend my whole time in the playground begging?
Why would I choose to be on a final warning at work due to absence?
Why would I choose to be on antidepressants due being completely burnt out after five years of struggling?
I'm a single parent and my DC is disabled. I could probably get benefits and home ed, so why if I'm not bothered about her education am I dragging her through the school gates, crying (I'm often crying too)
Every day, five days a week, for years.

@Edsspecialsauce honestly, don't even dignify the @Jifmicroliquid-type post with a response. There's no fixing wilful ignorance.

It's incredibly complicated, yes there are people who try everything, I've been there, but there's also parents who don't encourage their kids to go to school, tends to be secondary aged and at DD's school they had many persistent offenders, school refusal was due to can't be bothered basically. Finally statistics show sahp's and wfh are more likely to have kids with lower attendance rates. It's very complicated because there's lots of causes, lots of family set ups ... hard to generalise about an individual but at a population level you can be all about the importance of parenting and making them go to school each day even if they do half days.

I lost 2 jobs due to dd, I know I tried everything to send her and keep her in school. It paid off because that awful time did pass

It's so hard. I'm sitting here with a knot in my stomach and heart racing knowing I have to try and get my 15yo in. She hasn't been in since September so it's pretty futile but the stress still spirals.
It's CAMHS and the schools fault for ignoring me for years when I asked for help. Now she's at crisis point and won't leave the house.

No, I didn’t. You’ve taken a thread that isn’t about you, made it about you and then been person about others.

The OP asked if it was lazy and I said , yeah I know some people that gave up. They do not home educate or make any effort anymore. I also said I could understand this as it’s hard.

I never said everyone was lazy. I shared my experience. You’re the once that got on your high horse as apparently home education is the answer. It’s your answer, but I’d hate it tbh.

my daughter not going to school would have been a failure for her, she does brilliantly when she is there. Letting her fail during her bad patches WOULD have been failure on my part.

so thanks, but the only judgy person here is You. Have a wonderful home educating day!

Me too. My parents forced me into school and it caused lifelong damage. Decades later I’m still having therapy. I learned that I wasn’t safe, I couldn’t ask for help, I just had to keep my head down and silently tolerate whatever anyone threw at me, because there was no escape. It’s a terrible thing to do to a child.

Kids aren’t stupid, they know when an environment is unsafe or upsetting for them and that’s why they refuse to go. I’d like to think that the increase in school refusal is due to more parents listening to their kids, supporting and protecting them.

Years ago as a naive newly qualified teacher I 100% thought the parents were to blame and just needed to be a bit tougher. Much older and wiser me - who now has a school refusing ASD child as well as an older child who happily goes into school - would like to time travel and give my 22-year-old self a slap!! No one would choose this, it’s horrendous. There are SOME parents who enable, but the vast, vast, vast majority are not.

@megletthesecond just to slightly stand up for CAHMs, they have experienced a huge increase in the amount but also the acuity of cases referred to them. This is on top of chronic underfunding, staff working through the pandemic and wages being stagnant. I know as an individual, it's hard not to feel like you're being failed, and you and your child undoubtedly have been failed, but it's the government's underfunding of the NHS which is to blame.
I would encourage everyone on this thread to keep writing to your MPs about this issue.

Our CAMHS worker has always been absolutely brilliant.

also, if I quit my job we wouldn’t afford a house. So you were obviously able to do so, again HUGE oversight to assume that is affordable for others.

Some people are forced to quit, despite the financial implications, because they can’t leave their children alone and CAN’T get them into school. If your teenager will try (again) to kill themselves at the first opportunity they can’t be left at home alone. 7 year olds can’t be left at home alone. If there isn’t anyone else, then their mother has to be there, come hell or high water. That is reality for many parents.

Home education isn’t a matter of affordability for many, it’s a matter of survival.

You made a nice dig congratulating me at being able to afford it- I am at home anyway because I’m disabled and unable to work. I’m unable to feed myself frequently, never mind drag an enormous child into school and potter off to work.

So yeah, since I’d already been forced out of my career, then my home, then my hobbies, I am at home to teach my kid- lucky lucky me.

Ed I did contact my MP at the start of the year quoting NICE guidelines about CAMHS and autism assessments, so that might help. My daughter has never even seen anyone from CAMHS, she doesn't reach their threshold as she only self harms. We just go round and round on waiting lists.

You really need to look back at what you said- not getting kids in a failure- and have a think about whether that is actually true, or whether you have some reason to be so judgemental, and then defensive.

Attitudes like yours make it so much harder for other parents struggling with this situation, which is why several people have picked you up on it.

I know why I made the decisions I made, it’s been good for us and I’m 100% confident I did the right thing FOR US. Nowhere have I said it would work for everyone else.

It must be agony to take your child somewhere she truly hates day in and day out. I cannot imagine what it must be like. Why are we forced to put our children through this? - and waste their one and only crack at childhood? School suits some and not others.

I can’t leave my kid alone. I can’t even have knives in my kitchen.

there are many other options than home education, seems to me that you are just projecting on this thread so I’ll leave you to it!

@Youcannotbeseriousreally @Wallawallawallaby I think this is such a personal issue and it's completely down to you and your family to decide what's best. My best friend took her ASD child out of school and now home educates and we disagree about what the best thing to do is. She thinks it's cruel and damaging that I make my child go in every day.
My reason for not home educating is that I would lose my home, which is my son's home too as well as my daughters. It's also that Im just not that good at teaching my daughter. I want to be her mum.
But my main selfish reason is that I get so much from my job, I feel confident that I'm good at it, whilst I'm not that confident that I would make a good teacher for someone with complex additional needs.
We would also annoy each other as we're both chaotic and very social. A twice weekly hour long session wouldn't be enough for her. She needs daily interactions with friends who know her and adjust to her manic, sensory seeking nature. I think a lot of home Ed kids who didn't know her would back off!
If I had a child who loved being home, could do self directed learning, had their own interests and didn't miss the social side of school then I wouldn't think twice. We would be super skint but could just about survive. I couldn't afford all the tutors, groups and days out if we did.

I have a Y5 DD who suffers extreme anxiety which she masks at school. She is diagnosed with DLD and likely autism. She is slightly below average but largely due to her anxiety under pressure etc.
She hates school most of the time we have moved her from state to private in the hope a smaller class would help. It has but she still hates it a lot of the time. I know senior school will be a nightmare. We get her to school every day but the tears and anxiety over the weekend/nightly are heartbreaking. There have been some days it is almost a physical battle to get her to get out of the car.
I worry if forcing her will long term affect her mental health but home schooling feels like it could socially isolate her.
We are one step away from her refusing to go on some days: I can already tell the school judge me for taking her out for therapy once a week to help her.
I also have friends who secretly judge as they think it would never happen to them.
I wouldn't stay in a job which drove me to tears on a daily basis.

I said what I said because it’s my experience. Like I have clarified. I struggled for 18 months but we got through it. Many many kids ( and mine has all the things used here as an excuse, bad mental health , ASD, ADHD etc etc) come out the other side. She went to school in year 7 with no issues. I knew she could do it again and alas she can. I just had to be strong and we all supported her ( different entrance, reduced timetable etc , we did it all) some kids can’t but I wish people wouldn’t take every post like it’s written about them. Maybe you all hold some guilt at not trying harder?

you’re talking to me like I don’t know. And I do know. But I had a different approach to you ( that worked) you just don’t like it!

My reason for not taking her out of school is because I knew they could educate her better than me. I was a single parent. No on else was paying my mortgage and moving out being homeless and having no money was not going to help her mental health one bit! I also enjoy my job - my boss was very Supportive too.

your reasons are entirely valid OP!

people on Mumsnet are so defensive. Also sometime projecting their own insecurities or guilt.

Do you know any though?

I have never met any.

I know the daily mail can always dig a few out to show off but really… i’ve walked a lot of walks in life and in my experience rich / poor / single parents / blended family / any race, religion - the overwhelming majority of people love their kids and want whats best for them. Unless there’s a secret society of dreadful parents somewhere i haven’t been I think they are pretty rare

@Youcannotbeseriousreally I've been there too and that’s a horrible stressful situation - hope things improve.

the govt (all parties) needs to take the crisis in children’s mental health seriously and do more than put up posters. 11 percent of kids with a disability, for the most part being failed and those are only the ones with a diagnosis.

i have a feeling populists will see the below as people trying to get on the gravy train, (if only, the cost to our family has been huge) but really, it’s a huge and expanding crisis - why don’t our schools feel safe?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/9fd0bf76-8f57-4a60-84d5-084f9edbf2f4?shareToken=b1b17e1f6f3bfd5c0443b421a25a8b93

you knives and paracetamol etc are in the car here. It's a nightmare isn't it.

@Youcannotbeseriousreally Ffs give your head a wobble.

Your experience is not every experience.

Other people are not failing their children by doing things differently to you-

its crass and unnecessary to come onto a thread from someone looking for support for a really difficult situation, read a load of responses from other struggling people, and post about how YOU refuse to FAIL your child by letting them stay at home.

This is why several people pointed out to you that making different, but no more ‘easy’, decisions for their children, does not make them or their children failures.

If what you meant was “I am frequently able to get my daughter into school, and she gets a lot from it when she is there, so for us it’s worth the battle. I’d feel like I’d failed her if I didn’t keep trying”- then that’s what you should have written.

Ok. You’re not actually reading words at all are you. I find you incredibly rude and defensive actually - your head needs the wobble if you don’t think you’ve done all the things you’re accusing me of here in this thread.

no, I frequently DID NOT get my kid to school, for 18 months.

you just don’t like it because you gave up. That’s on you. Now I have a job to go to so do enjoy your day.

My son is doing really well being home educated, I have no reason to feel guilty about ‘not trying hard enough’. He has far more academic success now than he did before.

But I am also able to see that my way isn’t THE way, which is why I don’t pop up on threads telling people that to not do it my way is failure. I hadn’t even mentioned that I home educate until you posted about people failing their children by not getting them in.

Go back through my posts if you like- not one says anything about how other people manage or what they should or shouldn’t do with their families- I have only said that EBSA is not a result of lazy parenting, and being forced to home ed isn’t failure.

Quite why you don’t like that I don’t know- were you hoping for a round of applause for your superior performance?

This infighting is why we never get anywhere.
The child who is being brought into school kicking and screaming is being failed.
The child at home with a mum who is tired and burnt out and unable to work is also being failed.
The mum who has to wipe her face and go into the office forty minutes late and try to explain to her colleagues why she's late is being failed.
The mum who has had to give up her career because the school system has given up on her child is bring failed.
WE'RE ALL IN THE SAME BOAT!
You cannot say that your child can't access school because someone else is able or forced to homeschool. Similarly just because a child is homeschooled it doesn't mean that their needs are greater than those who have to attend school. It might just mean that circumstances allow it or the parent is physically incapable of doing so.
Sometimes the difference between being able to get them into school or not being able to get them to leave the house is just access to a car or being five stone heavier. I'm lucky I'm a big lass and my DD is a tiny dot of an eight year old.

great post OP