For not choosing the underprivileged child?

[PolitePeep]

Named changed for this as maybe outing, plus I probably sound like a huge bitch.

We have 1 DD age 12, hormonal tween stage. But generally a polite, thoughtful, well behaved kid.

DD has a few 'best' friends, one from school, one who's a sports team mate and one who she's known since a baby as I'm friends with the mum.

Having an only we are able to have kids over whenever DD fancies. Take a friend with us on days out etc.

School friend I find rude/ungrateful and treats me like I'm an annoyance and not to be interfering in her time with my DD.

Other two are polite and happy to chat while I'm giving them a lift home etc.

Here's the guilt part. The two polite friends each are from backgrounds where they get plenty of holidays, treats, days out etc.

I feel bad that I don't want to spend my weekend days with the school friend and so we invite one of the other two to days out/weekends away. As I know she won't get to visit where we're going.

My DD generally prefers to take one of the other girls as she sees the school one 5 days a week.

Should I feel guilty?

It's totally fair enough to take which ever friend dd chooses if they want to go.

I'd give school friend a bit of a break tbh. It's hard being the one who's always in the position of saying 'thank you' and not having good things/treats/times to share.

This.

You are right to pull her up every single time if she doesn't say please and thank you.

I would also tell her that if she continues having a bad attitude then she won't be welcome at your house.

You even need to ask!!!???

Easier to take the middle class kids out.

Better your daughter doesn’t mix with the riff-raff outside school.

Why point it out? If it was a rude rich kid would you say what her background was? It’s got nothing to do with it. Take the child you want to take.

I don't think a bit of gratitude is too much to expect from a 12 year old.

I think we can all see the sort of relationships this girl is going to be embedded in as an adult if she continues to think it's ok to be as rude and ungrateful as she is. She's going to be treated the way she treats other people and be very lonely as a result.

I wouldn't tolerate her rudeness in my house either.

@Allthatwegotisthispalebluedot

"I mean you already think of her as the ‘poor one’, and now she’s expected to be wildly grateful for a biscuit."

I literally wrote that all I wanted was recognition.

I'm not fucking offering her clean clothes and scraps of bread like I think I'm Mother Teresa.

If I'm having any guest and know of something they're fond of and I have the chance I'll try to get it in before they visit.

Is that not normal?

With this girl especially I know perhaps my presence makes her awkward so I'm as casual as I can be but not getting snacks in would be me treating her differently to other friends.

My best friend's mums growing up would do similar. One would make us special ice creams with whipped cream and flakes in. Even up to age 18 we'd all laugh and smile as she'd carry the tray in. It was lovely. She couldn't speak much English so I think she saw it as a way to bond with her daughter's friends without chat.

Another would make a rice pudding anytime she knew one of our group was coming and let him have the crispy corner pieces.

Generally if I was at a friend's house there would be times I'd be sat in a room with their parents/siblings and we'd be watching TV/eating/chatting.

This friend very much won't be involved with us so I guess we each feel alien to each other. Perhaps that's a more interesting thread than my guilt at not wanting to take her places is.

I would have been the kid looking like I was being rude. What was actually going on was that I was completely overwhelmed by a parent being nice, giving me anything, not hitting their kid, there being carpet on the floor and a clean kitchen, the air smelling nice and their expecting me to speak when that always seemed to end up with my being punched in the side of the head at home.

I had no idea how to speak or behave around nice adults because I'd never been around any. I could just about handle the kid that I knew, but not their home and their parents as well. Especially as it would result in my being shouted at when I got back if i mentioned any of it. Problem was solved in the end because my mother because suspicious they were fishing around me for a disclosure of abuse if I relaxed enough about it with one, stopping me going round altogether (explained to me as 'they don't like you either, I told you they were only doing it to look good and laugh at you behind your back') - and the other decided I wasn't the sort of child they wanted around their only when there were nicer kids from nicer families about.

Quote…Put dinner down in front of the girls (I'd checked it was something she liked - and laid the table, was going to eat mine later to not be in the way) I got a thank you from my daughter and a "where's the ketchup" from friend.

I gently replied "did you mean thanks Michelle, please can I have some ketchup with mine" and got her the ketchup. DD told me later she'd said I was mean. I'm sure she felt embarrassed…END QUOTE

OP, you were beyond rude to say that to the girl. A little graciousness from you wouldn’t go astray.

YANBU but just wondering if DD ever has all her friends together and how that works? What you do for her birthday?

@ohdamnitjanet "Why point it out? If it was a rude rich kid would you say what her background was? It’s got nothing to do with it. Take the child you want to take."

It's the entire reason for the thread.

If all 3 of the kids got taken on days out by their own families. Or never did. Then this wouldn't be an issue. I'd not give it a thought. Just "well she's too rude to spend a whole day with".

But that's not the case. Hence my guilt. Took sports friend out today - she's been to the place we went multiple times before - only second time for DD. She had a great time, said thanks a load of times, enjoyed her lunch politely etc. Just her telling me she'd been before made me think about the other girl.

I'm putting my own idea of what's important for kids to experience onto everyone, I realise that.

(None of these kids are rich by the way. The rude one doesn't get taken on days out, never been on holiday, to a museum etc. It's not a comment on money so much as experiences. We aren't rich, combined income is way below anything you'd see on a MN post, we live in a 2 bed flat. So you can drop the rich/poor assumptions. To most on MN my DD is rough and underprivileged I'm sure.)

Oh my @NeverDropYourMooncup

I'm so sorry you had to have a childhood like that.

Shows my naivety. I really wouldn't ever anticipate a reaction like that for those reasons.

I really really hope this child doesn't have a life like that. I've chatted with her mum and she certainly didn't seem in any way unkind or abusive.

OP I don’t think you’re unreasonable. If this friend was rich and rude to you you’d still not want to take her would you?

I had a friend who was from a big family with 2 FT working parents and not particularly well off. She regularly got invited on days out with my family as she was grateful, polite and always said to my mum how nice it was to go out for the day (she spent almost all school holidays sat at home with nothing to do I think). Therefore when choosing a friend I did often choose her as I knew she’d be grateful (she was also a close friend, I wasn’t a charity! But I had 2 or 3 others I was equally close to and I always chose her for days out.) Had she been rude to my mum I wouldn’t have asked her again.

Well we've not done anything big since primary school age when we'd invite the class (or just the girls from the class in a couple of cases) and then out of school friends would bring a friend/sibling.

We did swimming and then pizza last time so was a bunch of them and they were kept busy and then food etc so it wasn't really any issue.

Or we have a day out or it's school holidays so we might go away. So then friends aren't involved or only one is and she sees others at other times.

Because they're all separate it's not like how my childhood was when we were all in the same group. I do hope in time she is keener to do more with some of the other girls in her class as think for within school it's easier than 1:1 friendships in many ways. But they moved up from the same primary so have clung to each other a bit.

I had the opposite. My dd had a friend who was neglected by her parents and was always very appreciative. Eventually she went to live with her wonderful grandparents and was no longer interested in joining in with us. It is one thing to be underprivileged and quite another to be unappreciative

I taught girls like that, OP, and used to just say, "Please don't look at me like that". I didn't care if they were upset about it - if they gave me a dirty look, then they'd get pulled up on it.

If she doesn't say thank you, then I'd just say, "You can say thanks if you like" and leave it at that.

You're doing her no favours letting her get away with being like that to adults.

I think you're bring nice to be so thoughtful about it but maybe you're overthinking a bit. Let your dd take the lead on who she wants to invite to what.

Try to shrug off the rudeness: you're having the kid round for your dd's enjoyment/benefit not for your own social interaction. Lots of teens/tweens can be quite rude and unmannerly, try not to take it personally or psychoanalyse it, or train her out of it ("what's the magic word"!) If she makes your dd happy, and isn't doing any harm, that's all that matters imo. She may well learn what your expectations are gradually by watching your dd.

Hah. None of us are middle class. Nice assumption though.

I've no doubt you'd scoff at my 2 bedroom rental flat and second hand car.

Just because I think a child is underprivileged doesn't mean I'm a middle class snob.

These are all regular, state school, kids. The sport is once a week in a church hall.

So whatever picture you're painting of me needs changing I think.

Thanks. You're 100% right.

To add - my 'what's the magic word' was very jokey at a moment when we had been chatting a little and I could tell she'd be receptive and she did in fact say please that time.

I never ever want to make a child feel uncomfortable or upset, probably half of the issue as then I feel like I let visiting kids act in ways I'd never let my DD which also I'd feel guilty about.

The older they get the more they'll just fix their own food and drinks anyway so I'll just leave them to it more.

It’s fine. I never want to encourage my kids to have their less polite / more rude friends over. I don’t really care about their home circumstances - you can’t solve the world’s ills. Our plates are very full and we do our bit for each other where we can but your job as a parent is to bring up your own child as well as you can so that they are a good human being and a contributor to society. by doing a good job at being a good parent you will be making the world a better place through your child’s contributions.

I think you're putting too much pressure on this child and taking it far too personally. Just accept that her manners aren't great and her upbringing hasn't prepared her to interact with you very well. It doesn't make her a bad person. If your own daughter said thanks then that is all you need really. I mean I'm not saying you should take her out if you don't want to. But stop expecting her to be grateful for things she didn't ask for

I think the approach you’re taking sounds fine - it’s the polite friends who your daughter wants to take anyway and you’re not excluding the other one. You clearly do give her a different experience when she visits you - even if only the example of a house where manners are expected. You don’t have a responsibility to give her more.

I would say though, gently, don’t let her get under your skin. You’re clearly finding this triggering, perhaps your daughter’s never challenged you in quite the way this girl is. Just take a bit of a step back and don’t take it personally.

Underprivileged children from chaotic home lives don’t get a chance to learn social graces. Just role model and not pressure.

Please/thank you - fine. Recognition that you baked her favourite snack is a bit much!