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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder why people aren’t worried about this??

840 replies

Mummytotwonow · 25/01/2024 19:28

https://news.sky.com/story/time-to-think-the-unthinkable-and-consider-uk-conscription-says-britains-former-top-nato-commander-13056148

Sorry if I’ve missed any threads on this.

It’s not just sky news reporting this but for days now in the media this is being raised.

AIBU - to be extremely worried and concerned about this?

Is anyone else not worried?? Are we being prepared ready as “the higher up” know more and the threat is bigger than we’re told.

what age would it be from and to??

l‘m so scared for the world our children are growing up in 😢

Time to 'think the unthinkable' and consider UK conscription, says Britain's former top NATO commander

General Sir Richard Sherriff tells Sky News that even if Russia is defeated in the war against Ukraine, it is going to remain determined to rebuild another empire, subjugate Ukraine, and then move on to other ex-Soviet countries, like NATO members. Tha...

https://news.sky.com/story/time-to-think-the-unthinkable-and-consider-uk-conscription-says-britains-former-top-nato-commander-13056148

OP posts:
Thread gallery
12
Hillsmakeyoustrong · 28/01/2024 12:36

@Justpontificating depends how long the war lasted. Depends how long your frontliens are. So many variables...

Two years in and Russia has lost around 350,000 soldiers to date. That doesnt include casualties. You need also need to rotate the soldiers, if possible, although many on Ukraine's frontlines have been so for two years. A million is not so many in Ukraine's invasion.

Naptrappedmummy · 28/01/2024 12:37

DP also just made the very good point that if women were conscripted men would feel they had nothing to fight for. The biggest driver to fight would be protecting their girlfriends/wives/families back home. If women were ordered to the frontline and they knew their spouse was at high risk of being killed, what’s the motive to keep fighting? Nothing to protect back at home.

Justpontificating · 28/01/2024 12:49

Naptrappedmummy · 28/01/2024 12:37

DP also just made the very good point that if women were conscripted men would feel they had nothing to fight for. The biggest driver to fight would be protecting their girlfriends/wives/families back home. If women were ordered to the frontline and they knew their spouse was at high risk of being killed, what’s the motive to keep fighting? Nothing to protect back at home.

I agree
Keeping moral up is key
Although on the basis in ww2 single men with kids didn’t have to fight then if a couple have kids one of them wouldn’t have to ‘go to war’.

Obviously those with adult children wouldn’t necessarily be exempt, unless they’re over the age bracket etc.

I thought the ( current ) figures for conscripting women were interesting to note though.
Those figures would be very different though in reality.

llizzie · 28/01/2024 13:41

''We are told that the risk comes from Russia primarily. Why did you use Gaza and UNWRA as a reason to support your pro-conscription viewpoint? ''

So says Yasai reply to my latest post.

The fact is that were it not for the invasion of Israel on 7/10/23 we would not have been aware of just how wicked Hamas and Jihads actually are, and the implications of the invasion are so serious. We now have evidence to show how far reaching this invasion actually is. I asked what alternatives there are to conscription. You have not answered that. Instead, like a 'good'un' you divert attention away from the topic. You and countless others have condemned the withdrawal of aid. It should be withdrawn. Don't you know that in most countries IF YOU GIVE MONEY TO CHARITY AND THEY USE IT FOR SOMETHING ELSE it is illegal and donors have a right to stop the flow. Why should the world pay hard earned money to support terrorism? The League of Nations made a law which says civilians should not be targeted by war. How does that make you feel knowing that Hamas is actually hiding in civilian institutions for protection? Who would have known that terrorists would be that devious, that they would use that law to their advantage, a law passed in all innocence, following the Holocaust.

I am shocked at your comment about the cutting off of funds to the UNWRA and the sufferings of the Palestinians because of that. Countries have been giving taxpayers hard earned money to the Palestinians in good faith, for decades, only to discover that the Palestinians were not receiving it at all: it was all going to pay for the digging of tunnels, payments to Hamas and Jihadi armies and rockets fired into Israel, and that is WICKED and if the Palestinians are suffering, it is their own fault. There are no innocent Palestinians: we found that out for sure in the past 100+ days. The Palestinian medics knew where the hostages were and did nothing. The medics deliberately kept patients in hospital, deliberately aided and abetted the invasion on 7/10/23, deliberately put pregnant women and their families AT RISK after they signed THE HIPPOCRATIC OATH which begins 'FIRST DO NO HARM'.

For that they deserve all they get. If they are suffering, then that will tell them how criminally responsible they are, not just to the Israelis, but to the Palestinian people themselves.

The saddest thing, though, is that the ordinary Muslims of the world just want to get on with their lives and live in faith as their ancestors did. Now Islamist terrorists are destroying their world too.

I am not sure that I actually came out completely in support of conscription, but it is not just the invasion of Israel on 7/10/23, is it? We know what happened that day. That was an act of genicide against Jews, because the justification for that attack was from Hamas itself: ''We will kill all Jews, all over the world, no matter where they are''. Since that date, Hamas and Iran, and Islamic Jihad have openly admitted that they knew about the invasion weeks before it happened. The IDF warned Hamas of their entry into Gaza to take back the hostages. Every country in the world condemns kidnapping. In some, it is a capital offence. Did you expect the IDF not to do that? If Hamas health ministry knew about the invasion in September, why were there still patients in the hospitals? Why were pregnant women not evacuated? There should not have been premature births. There should not have been any births in North Gaza: there should not have been any patients either. I had a tinge of resentment when I heard that so many patients were kept in hospitals so long. The NHS kicks them out after a day or so.

Yasai · 28/01/2024 13:58

llizzie · 28/01/2024 13:41

''We are told that the risk comes from Russia primarily. Why did you use Gaza and UNWRA as a reason to support your pro-conscription viewpoint? ''

So says Yasai reply to my latest post.

The fact is that were it not for the invasion of Israel on 7/10/23 we would not have been aware of just how wicked Hamas and Jihads actually are, and the implications of the invasion are so serious. We now have evidence to show how far reaching this invasion actually is. I asked what alternatives there are to conscription. You have not answered that. Instead, like a 'good'un' you divert attention away from the topic. You and countless others have condemned the withdrawal of aid. It should be withdrawn. Don't you know that in most countries IF YOU GIVE MONEY TO CHARITY AND THEY USE IT FOR SOMETHING ELSE it is illegal and donors have a right to stop the flow. Why should the world pay hard earned money to support terrorism? The League of Nations made a law which says civilians should not be targeted by war. How does that make you feel knowing that Hamas is actually hiding in civilian institutions for protection? Who would have known that terrorists would be that devious, that they would use that law to their advantage, a law passed in all innocence, following the Holocaust.

I am shocked at your comment about the cutting off of funds to the UNWRA and the sufferings of the Palestinians because of that. Countries have been giving taxpayers hard earned money to the Palestinians in good faith, for decades, only to discover that the Palestinians were not receiving it at all: it was all going to pay for the digging of tunnels, payments to Hamas and Jihadi armies and rockets fired into Israel, and that is WICKED and if the Palestinians are suffering, it is their own fault. There are no innocent Palestinians: we found that out for sure in the past 100+ days. The Palestinian medics knew where the hostages were and did nothing. The medics deliberately kept patients in hospital, deliberately aided and abetted the invasion on 7/10/23, deliberately put pregnant women and their families AT RISK after they signed THE HIPPOCRATIC OATH which begins 'FIRST DO NO HARM'.

For that they deserve all they get. If they are suffering, then that will tell them how criminally responsible they are, not just to the Israelis, but to the Palestinian people themselves.

The saddest thing, though, is that the ordinary Muslims of the world just want to get on with their lives and live in faith as their ancestors did. Now Islamist terrorists are destroying their world too.

I am not sure that I actually came out completely in support of conscription, but it is not just the invasion of Israel on 7/10/23, is it? We know what happened that day. That was an act of genicide against Jews, because the justification for that attack was from Hamas itself: ''We will kill all Jews, all over the world, no matter where they are''. Since that date, Hamas and Iran, and Islamic Jihad have openly admitted that they knew about the invasion weeks before it happened. The IDF warned Hamas of their entry into Gaza to take back the hostages. Every country in the world condemns kidnapping. In some, it is a capital offence. Did you expect the IDF not to do that? If Hamas health ministry knew about the invasion in September, why were there still patients in the hospitals? Why were pregnant women not evacuated? There should not have been premature births. There should not have been any births in North Gaza: there should not have been any patients either. I had a tinge of resentment when I heard that so many patients were kept in hospitals so long. The NHS kicks them out after a day or so.

Justify cutting aid to hundreds of thousands of innocent people all you like. You’re getting what you want anyhow - they continue to be trapped behind a wall just as generations before them always have 🤷🏽‍♀️ they’ll continue to die in their thousands each month. Belittle those who try to amplify the voices of these people all you like by labelling them “Hamas sympathisers” all you like. Just don’t expect people with long memories (Iraq invasion) to be falling over themselves to die for King Charles and the UK foreign policy.

HelloWorldItsNiceToMeetYou · 28/01/2024 14:07

Mummytotwonow · 25/01/2024 19:42

The difficulty is we don’t want our children or husbands to go and fight if there was conscription - but would it be more horrendous allowing Russian soldiers terrorising us all??

It horrendous to think these things, but one day this might happen.

Edited

Husbands and children... I don't imagine women would be exempt in this day and age.

Naptrappedmummy · 28/01/2024 14:18

HelloWorldItsNiceToMeetYou · 28/01/2024 14:07

Husbands and children... I don't imagine women would be exempt in this day and age.

We’ve been over this.

Women would likely be conscripted for background roles, but not combat.

HelloWorldItsNiceToMeetYou · 28/01/2024 14:21

Naptrappedmummy · 28/01/2024 14:18

We’ve been over this.

Women would likely be conscripted for background roles, but not combat.

Says who?
I don't think the folk on this thread would beaking the rules...

Naptrappedmummy · 28/01/2024 14:24

HelloWorldItsNiceToMeetYou · 28/01/2024 14:21

Says who?
I don't think the folk on this thread would beaking the rules...

Says virtually every military in the world since time began. Women in frontline roles is actively damaging to the war effort. A tiny number of female professional soldiers may have combat roles, but conscripting women for it would be a disaster and would never happen.

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 28/01/2024 14:36

Megifer · 28/01/2024 11:32

Imagine getting all sneery about mothers saying their kids aren't going to fight. The alternative is "yea ill be dead happy about it"

Stop being fucking dickheads. have the day off.

Edited

It's not a matter of being sneery, but of being realistic. Conscription, by definition, is not a choice. If the govt says your sons fight, they fight.

I don't think anyone on this thread has expressed pleasure at the thought of conscripts going into combat.

Also, this is distracting you from the Coalition Government's complicity in the Horizon scandal, which is far more important right now.

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 28/01/2024 14:42

windowframer · 28/01/2024 12:00

There must be some mistake here.

The UK is a democracy, so its government could never engage in human rights abuses against its own citizens.

Hahahahahaha

The citizen can apply for legal remedy against government abuse through the courts.

All govts are corrupt to some extent, whether democracies or not. This is why an independent judiciary is so important to keep the bastards in check.

llizzie · 28/01/2024 14:52

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Yasai · 28/01/2024 14:59

This reply has been deleted

We've now deleted this as it refers to a deleted post.

Yasai · 28/01/2024 15:03

Do you remember when we illegally invaded Iraq and we didn’t provide our servicemen with the appropriate equipment.

I find it hilarious when people assume that anyone in opposition of war is somehow a sheltered mouse who hasn’t heard of terrorism. I have several friends and family members in the armed forces and it is my cousin who fought in Iraq who has reinforced my belief that we entered illegally.

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 28/01/2024 15:03

@llizzie There are no innocent Palestinians.

This same rhetoric was used by the Russian soldiers to justify their rape of little girls during the Rape Of Berlin. In their eyes, there were no innocent Germans.

There are innocent Palestinians. Even if every adult is complicit (which they aren't BTW), there are Palestinian children. Children cannot consent to war. Children cannot consent to the perpetration of terrorist acts.

You should be ashamed of your inflammatory rhetoric.

Yasai · 28/01/2024 15:07

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

windowframer · 28/01/2024 16:14

Naptrappedmummy · 28/01/2024 12:37

DP also just made the very good point that if women were conscripted men would feel they had nothing to fight for. The biggest driver to fight would be protecting their girlfriends/wives/families back home. If women were ordered to the frontline and they knew their spouse was at high risk of being killed, what’s the motive to keep fighting? Nothing to protect back at home.

To win the war as quickly as possible, thus reducing the odds of their partner being killed in action? Also presumably noone's talking about young children being conscripted into this imaginary-but-terrifying war of group imagination.

Anyway, I think we ought to acknowledge how incredibly brave and self sacrificing all the gung-ho women on this thread are, to volunteer their husbands and male relatives to risk their lives while they stay home and bake cakes. 😀

thenovice · 28/01/2024 16:44

I don't think you would say you'd rather live under Russian rule than fight if you had ever lived in Russia. Ask Ukraine. See how desperate they are to avoid living under Russian rule. Living with a sick knot in your stomach that they are coming for you. Being snitched on by neighbours who make up stories against you to earn brownie points. Always being found guilty if they accuse you of anything. Having your children sent off to fight Putin's wars.....

windowframer · 28/01/2024 17:54

Yeah but top quality vodka.

LuluBlakey1 · 28/01/2024 18:19

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2024/01/28/world/israel-gaza-jordan-news

If the US retaliate to this, I dread to think what will happen. It feels on a knife edge.

Mirrorpillar · 28/01/2024 18:37

LuluBlakey1 · 28/01/2024 18:19

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2024/01/28/world/israel-gaza-jordan-news

If the US retaliate to this, I dread to think what will happen. It feels on a knife edge.

Yeah have to say this could have huge repercussions.

Tomatina · 28/01/2024 18:44

MuckyEyebrows · 25/01/2024 19:46

Let who take your children?! You think the UK government are going to be kidnapping kids and sending them off to Russia?! lol

It's actually Putin and his henchmen/ henchwomen who have been kidnapping Ukrainian children. Thousands of Ukrainian children have disappeared into Russia since the invasion.

Tomatina · 28/01/2024 19:20

Willyoujustbequiet · 25/01/2024 20:38

To be fair for many people it couldn't get any worse than what their lives have become under this government....

It will never happen OP. People will refuse after the mess and lies that was covid.

It couldn't get any worse? In Russia you could be arrested for writing a post against the government's war in Ukraine, and expect a hefty prison sentence in a not very nice prison. So yes, to be fair, it could get a lot worse.

llizzie · 28/01/2024 19:46

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · Today 15:03

It is difficult to comment too much on your post, because you are partly right, but I draw back from saying that all children are innocent, because I do not think they are. I think they are being educated to believe the west is so immoral and a bad influence on them, that they have to be guarded and confined so as to avoid that influence. When you have generations of children brought up to believe that their way of life without education and opportunities is good and everyone else in the world is bad, then how can they know what innocence is? If children are trained to hate, it is not their fault if they do. THAT IS THE ROOT of terrorism, taking away the innocence of children. It is not their fault. That is what is wrong.

Look at our way of life: it is fraught with problems, and we are educated. Look at the guidance expectant mothers expect and should receive, how they need a proper diet, through pregnancy and childbirth. Look at the books on bringing up babies and steering them through life, then consider the position of women denied basic education, for fear it will make them as evil as the decadent west. That is the upbringing children have in these countries of conflict and terrorism, and control by men. They are innocent until they are able to walk and understand orders. The boys have a somewhat better life, in that they have privileges women and girls do not have, and as soon as they can co-ordinate movement of arms, they are taught how to throw stones to kill and maim. Then they are trained to carry out executions by stoning on any women who step out of line. How innocent are they? They are trained to hate. It is not their fault.

Look at the posts on mumsnet over the years, where mothers have exchanged information, the help the one gives to the other, then see what Islamist terrorists have done to the women they control, who are never able to communicate, or learn even the basics, because even the religion of their ancestors is taken away from them with a new form with harsh new rules.

AliceA2021 · 28/01/2024 19:50

The son of a Hamas leader shared his story. He said he was and children are taught hatred of Jewish people from very young. It progresses he said from there. He became a hamas fighter as lots do.

His story and that of a lot of others. Taught hatred and how to kill from a young age.

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