To think many services and professionals infantalise new parents

[Annacondas]

Since becoming a parent for the first time last year (DD is one next week) I’ve been shocked by how often parents are infantalised. Often told information that’s not really true just to make them feel better.

Things such as
‘fed is best’ - no fed is the bare minimum expected of a caregiver. Factually breast milk is better for your child than formula - and I say this as someone who chose to formula feed because I like my sleep This also spills into weaning, with parents who gave their 10 month old nothing but chips for dinner told ‘well he went to bed with a full tummy, remember fed is best’ no no no.

Food before one is just for fun - again a total myth, food before one is essential for oral development and nutrition as there are a fair few nutrients that aren’t passed well through breast milk or formula (Iron is the main one) but many doctors, health visitors etc. keep telling parents this to stop them worrying about their child’s eating, but it’s simply not true. It then leads to those parents telling others this myth making whole swathes of parents not consider food before one as important.

‘You can’t do anything to help kids meet their milestones faster’ - again, factually incorrect. There are many exercises that parents can do with their child to help them roll, crawl, walk, talk etc. a lot faster. Yes it’s not necessary to do those things and most children will hit their milestones eventually, but it doesn’t make it any less inaccurate that parents ‘can’t’ do anything to speed this process along.

Those are just the ones I’ve seen and heard over the last few months but there are many more I’ve forgotten along the way.

AIBU go get annoyed about new parents being treated like idiots, or is it maybe the case that many new parents are idiots and this kind of nonsense is necessary

@Silverbirchtwo you might not think there is anything wrong because you’re able to believe people take them as they’re intended.

Unfortunately the very people these simple prompts are designed for are exactly the type of people who might not understand the message behind them.

I saw a young mother post a picture of her 8 month olds dinner on a parenting group last week, it was a whole hotdog and some crisps. Her comment to go with said picture was ‘felt like shit today so really didn’t have time to make something proper for dinner, fed is best and other parents need to not pressure themselves into fancy meals every night’ a whole hotdog and crisps is not ok for an 8 month old, massive choking risks aside it’s not good for them what so ever.

This is the issue with the simple platitudes, people take it and run, then they go and tell others the same and it spirals into whole groups of parents not thinking food before one is important, and therefore you don’t need to try.

It was decided babies couldn't sleep in their own rooms for 6 months to prevent cot death. Putting babies on their backs and at the end of the cot have all brought cot death rates down.

And I agree about milestones. I think parents have got a bit too passive about teaching babies things, maybe it’s part of the extended babyhood culture now where 3 year olds have dummies and bottles of milk. But they seem to just assume that they’ll pick things up, when that’s not the case, particularly with speech:

https://inews.co.uk/inews-lifestyle/how-speak-your-toddler-put-down-phone-2346821

@Annacondas well I disagree . I spent years working in sectors spanning a lot of vulnerable clients getting across the fact based messages have reduced infant morality.

You clearly have absolutely no idea of what some vulnerable people's lives are like.

Ironically you don't appear to have the critical thinking ability to actually acknowledge this.
There really is no point trying to educate you so I am stepping away. I've lectures to prepare for.

There is no official advice that would lead that woman to conclude that was a good meal. All of the simplified advice is very clear about choking risks and salt. Yes idiots use platitudes to justify their behaviour but those platitudes probably came from the same shit social media groups. Do you really think that woman is going to listen to the official advice however it’s phrased? which she’s already ignoring. Confirmation bias is a big thing. Idiots on Facebook validating your approach is always going to be more compelling that a HV telling you you might need to change things up.

My baby’s the same age as yours and I totally agree. But the very first reply nailed it tbh, they communicate to the lowest common denominator.

I joined a few Facebook groups (just out of curiousity to see if they provided some entertainment) and wow the stick HV’s get is unbelievable. I’ve seen about 10 different ones over the year and they’ve all been lovely, informative when asked questions - I can understand they’re not all good ones but I really think people are so nit picky and don’t want to be told what’s best for their baby.
For me, it ties into the rise in anti vax levels and covid conspiracies, people don’t want to listen to medical professionals so they have to “dumb” themselves down to cater to people.

Milestones are just that. Milestones. They're there to help you know if your child is developing at the usual pace and not some kind of achievement or race.

If your child is not meeting milestones, they likely have developmental delay. Which is caused by genuine conditions such as autism or cerebral palsy. Yes, you do interventions but no amount of intervention is going to make the condition disappear. It's very insensitive to talk about milestones the way you have to be honest but that judgy tone is reflected in everything else you've covered.

I'm sure someone has already told you why fed is best is a useful phrase. Babies have actually died because mums not producing enough milk or babies unable to latch have refused to give them breastmilk. And I say that as a extended breastfeeding mother. (although I couldn't with my first because of developmental delay) see above.

I agree with the general sentiment that health visitors etc are shit, but the way you've presented it absolutely screams of ableism and judgement.

I think if you make already exhausted, anxious, sometimes depressed parents feel like they're enough, it can carry them through the next day. And that's what's best for the kid- to have a present, sane parent.

Sometimes these phrases are tiny boosts in confidence that mean the difference between a parent making it through the day- or not.

To be fair, at an instinctive level I can understand why an outsider to the family coming into your home and telling you how to look after your baby can put people on edge.

@tralalalalalalalal is that best though? Or just better than the alternative.

Id argue having a parent who isn’t so anxious or depressed they need to be lied to, to get them through the day is ‘best for the child’

I am a health visitor.
I am not sure which professionals have told you "Fed is best" but it is not something we have been trained to say. We would provide evidence based information, communicated in a way that best suits the individual family we are working with at the time.
Yes we promote breastfeeding, we also provide information about formula feeding and combined feeding.
We promote healthy nutrition, but also recognise that some families are unable to meet optimal standards and are therefore supported to ensure the basic requirements are met instead.
Yes we ask about benefits, because we want to ensure that all families are claiming all that they are entitled to.
And yes it could possibly come across as simplified and infantilising but that's because some people don't have that level of understanding, and sometimes even the most intelligent educated people, when faced with sleep deprivation and brain fog will benefit from simplified communication.

Honestly I think you’ve misunderstood the intent of the service being provided. Do you also complain about signs that say “wet floor” or “mind the gap”? These prompts are to help those who haven’t registered what’s needed, or to redirect those meandering into danger, not to Uber educate you on childcare. The suggestions offered are generic and should be based on the latest understanding not your “feeling” that manipulating a child’s limbs to mimic crawling might make them (for example) crawl a bit earlier than they would have. I think your thinking is quite woolly and you are failing to distinguish between your opinions and facts.

@TomeTome what are you on about?

It’s not my ‘feeling’ about manipulating a child’s legs

Factually there are exercises you can do to promote children to learn certain skills. That’s not my ‘feeling’ it’s a fact. One which the NHS also believes since they have an entire website filled with videos on the activities and exercises you can do to help your child learn to roll, crawl etc.

That sounds like physio. It's a way to help child reconnect their body control after, for example, a stroke resultant in cerebral palsy. It's a way to optimise movement not to cure developmental delay.

Do they have evidence that the children crawl earlier and evidence that that is beneficial? Perhaps add a link.

I agree. But you are being far too reasonable to gain much traction here.

I hear where you are coming from OP.

I think the truth is, collectively as a society we seem to have less of a thick skin and it doesn’t just apply to motherhood but I think that somewhere over the past few decades we hate hearing “hard truths” and we are so much more influenced by the lives of others because we are exposed to what “perfection” should look like because of platforms like social media.

Nobody wants to offend anyone as mental health is at an all time high and what you could say 10 years ago is no longer acceptable (the amount of posts on MN alone bashing the previous generation and grandparents because of their opinion - they came from a different time and have raised children - of course they will have an opinion).

It’s led to a stale communication method which I find very unhelpful if you want to know facts and truths as it’s easier to share a simple message. The rest of us end up in a rabbit hole in places like Google.

Im a millennial that had a baby pretty young and I formula fed when my baby was about 2 months old - breastfed for 3 months and mixed - of course breastfeeding is ideal - but if you cannot do it - it’s so important to know that your baby will be fine on formula.

As for diet and food - My dd had chips when we were out and veg and our food mushed up at home (she hates chips now though as a child haha - but also I felt it was more important to guide “good” and “bad” foods when she was older and we just don’t buy junk so that we don’t eat it). Yes we have frozen food for the odd lazy day but we always have veg ready to stir fry and fruit - but we have open conversations about how certain foods make us feel.e.g. Dd will eat McDs and then we will both moan about how bad our stomach feels.

I think all mums know what’s best for their babies but also we all need help and guidance - especially if it’s all new to you.

Breastfeeding is nutritionally better and this is quite well publicised, but fed is best means if you are struggling to Bf, if it puts the mothers mental or physical health into jeopardy or you cannot breast feed your child then it is better to FF your child.

I don't think that's what a lot of people actually when they 'fed is best' though @ThreeTreeHill.
It's often used to mean it doesn't really matter how you feed your child.

The professionals are communicating the national guidance, if they were lazy or lying they’d just say whatever they fancied that day.

Guidance like this is developed by a group of clinical experts and refined based on feedback and insight from parents and carers. It’s reviewed regularly, as well as when there’s a significant piece of research published or a serious incident/event. It may not meet everybody’s needs (eg you feel patronised as could manage/need more detail) but it’s designed at population level to meet the needs of the majority.

When it comes to ff/bf, does it "matter". I breastfed 2 of mine, the 3rd I couldn't because of chemo. There's very little difference between them health wise, ff baby is the healthiest out of the bunch.

The attention of ff/bf is mad when you think about how much nutrition matters once they are off of milk.

If every baby in the UK was ff, it wouldn't have as significant impact as every child eating processed, low nutritional value food - that's my theory anyway!

Being out of the baby stage really makes you see how little it matters. It's great if you can, if not, formula will provide enough to keep baby healthy.

I didn't say it mattered whether a mother bf or ff @borisjohnsonsforgottencondom.
I said that pp's understanding (and thus definition) of 'fed is best' isn't necessarily shared by others.

Well yes, quite obviously? Your point is getting lost I think

Social media has a big part to play. It reinforces these silly phrases and ideas for those that want to believe them. The cutesy poems that talk about, if you are really tired as a Mum it's OK if you don't get your child dressed and your eldest eats crisps off the floor some days as their main meal.

Problem is A) people like to be kept off the hook about not putting the effort in & B) I'm continually surprised about how little people look Into what is best for their children. The biggest example is that people put babies in jumperoos & Bumbo seats, without seemingly being aware of how atrocious they are for babies development.

Gruffallowhydidntyouknow
You're right.

I'm sure that the original HCP who said something like "happy mum equals happy baby" were using it in the context of "don't feel bad about putting baby down in their pram so you can wee in peace for a couple of minutes or have a cup of tea. Looking after yourself is an important part of looking after baby".

What actually happened is that it became the get out clause for anything for some people at baby groups and socials. Whatever you did for an easier life in the moment= "course it's fine hun, happy mum equals a happy baby". The sibling phrase "mum shaming" seemed to get bandied around a lot as well, which was rarely used when there was actually mum shaming, but was literally used when someone suggested checking out proper health and development advice.

I left some parenting groups because the amount of thought-terminating soundbites were depressing.

I'm continually surprised about how little people look Into what is best for their children. The biggest example is that people put babies in jumperoos & Bumbo seats, without seemingly being aware of how atrocious they are for babies development.

I'm going to try and be as unpatronising as possible (but fail, I think) but it is so obvious that some of the posters here are new parents. I think many of us were a bit like this with our first children - researching everything, astounded that not everyone else was and that they were therefore Doing It Wrong. You just care a lot less about all this with time and perspective. Mine are only a few years older (5 and 3) but it is so obvious that some of the things I got really het up about - overuse of car seats, weaning, so many aspects of 'baby development' - matter not a toss in any sort of medium-term and that you will have to, pretty quickly really, abandon any hope of getting it all right all the time because the choices get a lot more complicated very, very quickly and you can't 'research' them all.