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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

unruly kids

110 replies

xxxJess123xxx · 06/01/2024 21:05

hi all my kids are just turned 8 and just turned 5, oldest girl and youngest boy.

their behaviour is actually driving me to depression and I genuinely cannot cope.
it starts from the moment they wake. DD won't get out of bed, dressed, teeth you name it, so won't do it. iv tried numerous punishments and it works for an hour then back to square one. She can be rude, defiant and answers back. Pushes the boundaries constantly. Talks in an annoying deep loud voice (purposely) when over excited, which is constantly.
Is apparently an angel at school and doing well in all areas, excelling actually so its obviously just me.

DS is an absolute nightmare. Taking him to the shops sees him run off, pick things up from the shelves, not listen, I tell him off or hold him hand so you throws himself around/on the floor and screams blue murder. I have had people tut and huff and stare at me which is actually soul destroying.
Indoors he runs full pelt everywhere, does front flips on the sofa, is so loud and doesn't listen to a word I say. Again I have tried all sorts of punishments, time out in room, taking toys away, taking weekend screen time away (not allowed any Monday to Friday as makes behaviour 10x worse) but again nothing works.
I have even tried the over the top love bombing parenting but it only works for a short time and it just back fires in my face.

Together, they fight constantly, with hitting, kicking, shoving and slamming doors in faces. Just before bed is the worse, with them genuinely acting possessed running and fighting.

No one wants to come round and see me.
I hate taking them anywhere
I hate being at home.
im so embarrassed by how much I have failed as a parent.
I just feel like I am slowly loosing my mind.
I have a husband, he works long hours. I work school hours. They behave the exact same for him.

Im so sorry for the essay and writing it all on here but I don't know how to carry on xx

OP posts:
Summerbee3 · 06/01/2024 21:13

That’s sounds hard. I have 2 very full on DS’s who also fight a lot so I can sympathise. It sounds like they have loads of excess energy, could you take them out to parks or sign them up to clubs to burn off some energy? I expect you’re also burnt out from not getting a break and maybe they pick up on that.

illovefisk · 06/01/2024 21:19

That sounds truly awful. Do you have a partner, do they help? I think in your shoes I would go to GP and ask for support and I would go to the school and lay it out for them too. You need help and support.

Katemax82 · 06/01/2024 21:26

Maybe try being referred to early help?

Merryoldgoat · 06/01/2024 21:34

You perhaps need some intervention - does your LA have any parenting courses?

You can turn it around OP but it feels hopeless I know.

Original poster
xxxJess123xxx · 06/01/2024 21:42

Parenting courses? Have I failed that much?
Whats early help please?
I try take them out on their bikes and to the park for burn off energy etc but obviously much harder now in the poor weather x

OP posts:
Merryoldgoat · 06/01/2024 21:53

It’s not failure - it just helps with techniques.

I’ve done two - it’s different as my boys have additional needs but I needed help and I was glad of it.

Your kids are still young and you can turnaround the situation but what you are doing hasn’t worked and if you don’t make proper changes it will get worse.

ShoePalaver · 06/01/2024 21:56

xxxJess123xxx · 06/01/2024 21:42

Parenting courses? Have I failed that much?
Whats early help please?
I try take them out on their bikes and to the park for burn off energy etc but obviously much harder now in the poor weather x

Parenting courses are to help you learn, not because you have already failed.
Think of it like any other aspect of life, if you wanted to learn how to do first aid or maintain a car or cook better you would do a course or read a book. Good parenting is about caring obviously, but after that it's about techniques and understanding the way children think. All this talk of punishment for a 5 year old sounds like you don't really know what you're doing. Punishment doesn't work and makes children defiant and angry, I suggest reading some Janet Lansbury. She has written 2 books and there's lots of free stuff online too.

Original poster
xxxJess123xxx · 06/01/2024 22:39

where would I find these parenting courses?
of course a 5 year old needs punishment. If he is hitting or punching or being rude or not listening in shops, that needs punishing

OP posts:
Maray1967 · 06/01/2024 22:45

xxxJess123xxx · 06/01/2024 21:42

Parenting courses? Have I failed that much?
Whats early help please?
I try take them out on their bikes and to the park for burn off energy etc but obviously much harder now in the poor weather x

This where you’re going wrong, in my experience. Kids need to be out and about whatever the weather. Yes it’s not great running around the park when it’s wet but I did it to wear mine out and get fresh air myself.

Get coats and old trainers on and get them out. Try it for a couple of weeks and see if it makes a difference .

Original poster
xxxJess123xxx · 06/01/2024 23:07

Maray ok I’m willing to try. Even after school? X

OP posts:
sonicmum2002 · 06/01/2024 23:19

Have you tried star charts and rewards for good behaviour, eg no hitting?

Strictly1 · 06/01/2024 23:25

School can get you signed up for a parenting course - we have TACs (team around the child). Parenting is hard. Taking action now, which will be hard, will be well worth it. You don’t want a 15 year old, possibly bigger than you, hitting you if they don’t get their own way. Good luck

Dragonflyhelper · 06/01/2024 23:40

Yes I started something called the "Heart Chart" when my middle dd was 5 as she was hell on earth getting out of bed in the morning and I had an 8 yr old to get to school too and a toddler.

I explained to all the kids that if they did certain behaviors (I started with getting up and ready for school on time as that was the major issue) they could put a sticky heart for that day on the weekly chart I made. If they made it to 3 or 5 days they got a reward (I started with very small achievable goals and small rewards such as sweets). I then had stages of achievement up to if they changed that behavior it for a month or more they got to go out with mummy or daddy ALONE and have ice cream.

TBH I had very little faith it would work but it had a magical affect on my 5 yr old and she absolutely LOVED it. Years later she was still asking if we could do the Heart Chart again.

It's very important to understand that behavior you give attention to (even negative attention) you will see more of.
So you need to "catch them being good" and shower them with attention while ignoring bad behavior or if you can't ignore it (bad behavior in a shop) you don't start screaming, freaking out etc etc but stay incredibly boring and inexpressive but remove the child from the situation.
Bad behavior should get natural consequences as much as possible.

Be very honest with yourself and think about if you are showing the most attention to your kids when they are badly behaved and ignoring their good and peaceful/cooperative behavior by not rewarding it with smiles, hugs "thank yous" etc.

Whenever one of my kids would act up I would think about what we were doing as parents. Sure enough most at the time we unwittingly were only giving this kid our full attention when they were behaving badly. So our own change of behavior was essential.

eatpiedrinktea · 06/01/2024 23:45

I have no words of wisdom but i hope it gets better.
Your not the only one going through this there are plenty of mums and dads going through it.
Do see a GP for yourself.
My son is an adult now but i know how hard them days were.
Your doing your best but think you fail your doing a grate job.
People staring huffing and tutting look at them and say you never kids then or want a pitcher!!!

notvirginiawoolf · 06/01/2024 23:52

123 magic great book which gives lots of practical suggestions. It's easy to implement and gives you strategies and phrases to use at the most difficult times. It also helps you understand why your children might be behaving how they are and most importantly your role in their behaviour. Good luck.

Useruser1212 · 06/01/2024 23:53

Instead of trying 'various punishments' why not try positive reinforcement? So when they do behave well (without being asked), really affirm it with them and let them know that you're proud of them (without being too obvious or over the top). Psychologists will tell you that research shows you get the desired behaviour faster with rewards than you do punishment. It's just trial and error figuring out what rewards they respond best to.

Dragonflyhelper · 06/01/2024 23:55

Also be very clear about what expectations are and explain/model it before it happens.

For example when we were going to visit somewhere before we arrived or went in I would sit in the car and ask them how a good guest behaves.

If they were baffled I would say: "saying please and thank you", "picking up after yourself" "sharing" "being friendly" etc etc. If they all behaved well I.would tell them afterwards how proud I was of them give them big hugs and point out certain things they did that were great "I saw you took your dirty dish into the kitchen" "I saw you being so kind to the little brother" etc. etc.

Kids are often a lot more clueless than we realize and need very clear expectations. It's also much easier to discipline if the boundaries and expectations were clearly explained beforehand and they asked questions and agreed they understood what to do and how to behave before you start.

Also the natural consequences of bad behavior somewhere fun are the child leaves immediately. Sometimes this is harder on you than them but it's the only way they learn that you mean it.

JMSA · 06/01/2024 23:55

That sounds so hard Flowers
I'd never stare at you or tut.

Bladwdoda · 07/01/2024 00:04

op you have my sympathies. I struggle with my kids at times. They are either getting on amazingly well or awfully. I used to run a parenting course, but that hasn’t made me immune from struggling…though it has helped me with different ideas to try out etc.

I think you need to shift your mindset from “I have failed” to “what can I (and my husband) do to make life easier and nicer for our children and family”.

Are there any practical things you can do to make life easier?
Things I have found have worked for us are…
*DH and I splitting up kids at the weekend and each taking one with us for half the day so they get a break from each other.
*Using to do lists boards for each child that they can tick of things as they do them in the morning.
*Reducing/managing screen time, particularly for youngest who seems to go wild if she has too much (we’ve not been as successful as we need to be at this).
*Making extra massive effort to model what behaviour I want to see from them, and pointing out when they do nice things for each other.
*working to keep myself calm and focused on getting the best outcome with the kids rather than just punishing for the sake of punishment.

A parenting course is a great idea, even if only to pick up a few extra ideas. the weirdest one I picked up from leading the course was from a mum of a teenager who used a gong to call her kids down for food. She hated shouting up to them and being ignored, the kids hated her shouting at them so she now used a gong. Bit of fun for them all and avoids shouting.

Also though op try to find time for yourself, keep yourself as well and recharged as you can. Things are always easier if your own tank is as full as possible.

N4ish · 07/01/2024 00:05

Well, your punishment approach isn’t working so maybe you need to try something different. Your children sound very disconnected from you and acting out in an attempt to get some kind of reaction so I think that’s what you need to work on.

I agree with previous posters suggesting a parenting course and also recommend Janet Lansbury and Dr Laura Markham. Found both very useful when I was going through challenging times with my kids.

Dragonflyhelper · 07/01/2024 00:09

Every parent has hellian days when all you can say as your head hits the pillow (or you hit the whisky) is "everyone fed, nobody dead".

Moier · 07/01/2024 00:12

ADHD. My daughter was the same.. never realised until she's now nearly 40 and just got diagnosed herself.. but her consultant contacted me and asked me questions about her childhood.. this took two hours.. looking back now and with more knowledge about ADHD..I can now see she had it from being a child.

Original poster
xxxJess123xxx · 07/01/2024 00:23

I do give clear explanations before heading into the shops. I say, I would like you to be a good boy and hold mummy’s hand please when we are in the shop it just doesn’t go in.
I understand completely the mentality of positive parenting, but when your children are unruly nearly all the time, what is there to praise

OP posts:
whiteboardking · 07/01/2024 00:31

ADHD. Buy the book 'how not to murder your ADHD child'
Great for ideas to change this

coxesorangepippin · 07/01/2024 00:33

Can you avoid taking them to the shops? Go alone? If you can't change the behaviour, change the situation

They need more outdoor exercise, rain or shine