To think we wouldn't have as many MH problems if we lived differently

[Ginlette]

Panic attacks, anxiety, depression...

How much of this is happening because of the way our society is set up?

If we all lived in fairly small communities and had good relationships with friends and family near by, would we have these issues? If we had stable work that didn't feel like an impossible workload and paid fairly?

I'm even beginning to wonder whether "positives" of modern living are actually subtly undermining our MH as a society.

• The obvious examples being the Internet and phones, but also..
• Mobility: looks good on paper, but maybe the idea of the world being your oyster subconsciously is anxiety inducing?
• Travel: fun but frequent travel again contributes
• Home ownership and improvements, style & beauty inprovements: again this idea of we have choice, but is it contributing to a low level sense of always chasing?
• More freedom of partner and freedom to have children or be childfree: but does it create a "What if?" sensation past generations wouldn't have had fluttering at the edges of their mind?
• Remote working/self employed: I have done this for over a decade but does it maybe contribute to a sense of no base, no community?

Collectivist societies often mean living with your MIL!

Yeah, collectivism usually means a workload for women tbh, regardless of what we may want.

Being able to choose to be childfree, to travel and live where I want to, to have relationships on my terms are all positives in my life.

That's thought-provoking - thank you.

The obvious examples being the Internet and phones, but also..

This is it. Nothing else IMO.

Lots of people live their lives via social media or through their friends. They see what other people ‘have’ (even though we all know most of social media is a lie) and want it. A lot of it is comparing your life to someone else’s and only seeing the surface, not what’s happening inside, and thinking their life is better than yours and that caused jealousy, then eventually depression and anxiety.

People spend lots of time of social media instead of (say thirty years ago) being out and about. It’s made more people introverts as a result and people won’t step into the unknown as they like the safety of their own ‘life’ and try and live vicariously through others - again, contributing to MH issues.

Social media and the internet more broadly has, IMO, done a lot of damage to people.

I think the internet is an absolute boon, personally. I would not be able to work or live without it, as my family is scattered.

I do sometimes think we should go living back like pre-historic people, like those remote tribes in the Amazon region of Brazil and also in the Sentinel Islands in the Indian Ocean.
Loin-cloths, bows and arrows and spears. Only traditional plant medicine. Fresh food you grow, catch or hunt. Small village communities. The outside world is of no consequence.

*studies have shown that as humans. We must interact. Social media has stopped us talking face to face which has a HUGE part to do with mental health and how we work as humanity.

we need to get rid of social media which not only stops us talking but we are different behind a screen….this is a proven fact.*

I disagree. Social Media hasn’t stopped people from talking face to face. Where’s the personal responsibility?

People make the choice to use SM.

People make the choice on what they engage or not engage in on SM.

People make the choice on who they want to talk to face to face.

People are often different behind the screen because it is easier and more comfortable to say what they really think anonymously than it is in real life.

Why not question why people feel the need to be on SM vs talking face to face to those around them?

Getting rid of it would be detrimental to many imo because of the positive reasons people use it for.

I think people nowadays are really strange about talking to strangers...I've seen lots of threads were posters are very aggrieved that a random person in the shop queue or in a cafe dared to speak to them or make some innocuous comment about their baby etc etc. Its so strange

I remember watching a documentary about supermarkets, and the limited stock and variety they used to have and honestly I think that sounds great. Now it’s 32 different types of bread? Hurts my brain trying to do life sometimes and things like this really do work there way into my head 😂

Yes - modern life is very isolating. People interact through a screen rather than face to face, which means the shitty bits of life are filtered out and so everyone else seems to be managing better than you.

We're a very social species, it's harmful to have so few real interactions with others on a daily basis.

Sorry, haven’t read the whole thread yet but I agree with a lot of the OP.

I think the main thing that is ruining our MH is technology.

I think, in that regard, we were a lot better when you couldn’t hold a computer in the palm of your hand every minute of the day. Not saying I am some sort of Luddite who wants tv banned… but I think there was a sort of sweet spot when people watched what was on tv when it was on, phoned people when they were at home, sent the odd email perhaps. Unfortunately this sweet spot came at a time (mid 90s I’d say) when homophobia, sexism etc were still very prevalent and lots of people’s MH suffered in other ways.

Technology as it is now is an absolute blight on our lives. Even the simplest task is full of frustration, different log-ins, passwords, glitches etc. The technology giants are deliberately making it virtually impossible to share devices (whereas you could in the past easily log in and out of different accounts in the same device). Business software has become too clever for its own good and constantly tries to merge things and second-guess everything. It’s an absolute mess.

I know it sounds a bit ‘tin foil hat’ but I believe the companies running this have one aim in mind: everyone online all the time with their own (expensive) devices that become obsolete and unworkable at least every 12 months.

We'd have had different problems - not necessarily fewer.

It has definitely happened to me before where I want to buy say a serum, so I go to Boots, look at the 30 options available and leave empty handed. I'm wondering whether that's a bit of a symbol for life as some of us are currently experiencing it, I do recognise that's a privileged position and it's down to your personality too

No, you can't say it's personal choice once something becomes the norm in society.

Refusing to use social media or massively limiting it wouldn't work unless your friends and family did the same.

For me personally the geographical mobility has been a blight. We grew up bouncing around countries and now my immediate family is scattered across 5 different countries, I also find it difficult to settle and keep bouncing around although what I actually crave is a hyper local family set up

but social media/internet has made the world smaller, my dd travel/live abroad and i can speak to them, via video if i want like they are next door

Your list makes a lot of sense to me personally, and I know a lot of people who are miserable with wfh, but then I know others who are happier than they’ve ever been. The ‘you can do anything/go anywhere’ definitely has a LOT to answer for too! Great post op

I think that's the point and it really comes down to personality, but although my family are in touch daily by eg WhatsApp I don't see it as it being like they are next door at all.

that is true @Ginlette i would prefer a physical touch

I think this has probably always been the case.

I think the lockdowns are a really good example.
Even when you compare people in similar life situations, like families with kids.
Some enjoyed the lockdowns because of the slower pace, more time together as a family etc, while others really struggled with having to juggle homeschooling and work, and also the general sense of being restricted.
Same goes for other groups.

i had to work in lockdown, the anxiety of covid was like nothing else

Yeah, or say you had a messy break up... Just head to your aunts and stay over night. Feeling a bit down for no reason...Just pop over to your mums and slump on the sofa watching that god awful "one born every minute" she loves while listening to the sound of a dishwasher....Meet your brother for a pint last minute...
Those are the sort of casual interactions things like video calling can't replace for me, because with the latter you have to be very present. The former is about just being physically near people who love and support you (recognise this only works if you're close to your family)

Having 32 types of bread and cereals (when it used to be white loaf, hovis loaf, cornflakes or weetabix) is the price we pay for capitalism, competition and choice. The consummerism nowadays is the scourge of society, the damnation of the environment but it lines the fat cats' pockets nicely.

Add social media on top and you have a toxic mix of FOMO, self-doubt and inadequacy to add into it.

I've rejected most of it a long time ago, I can think more clearly and zero feelings of FOMO, by ridding myself of the constant distraction and chatter of people who aren't real friends and sensationalist media that clamours for attention and destroyed my MH. The game changer is setting those healthy boundaries!

Over medicalisation of normal feelings, emotions snd difficulties. Lack of family support when raising children. Lack of knowledge about managing simple childhood illnesses ( see regular MN threads about pyrexia in children and the rush to phone 111 attend A&E) Poor sleep and poor appetite/food intake in children being medicalised.
Parents and children rushing to label themselves with ‘social anxiety’

All much worse since Covid but I honestly despair for society. No resilience, no desire to self help and so many people living in utter misery.

Diagnosed depression and genuine mental health conditions are a completely different ballgame but the care and management of those conditions is being adversely affected by the soaring demands placed on services by the former.