To think this isn't sexual assault...

[harerunner]

I saw a story on the BBC about Jenni Hermoso testifying in a sexual assault case about her kiss with Luis Rubiales. Not having seen the kiss, I decided to look at a video of it, a link of which I've put below.

Firstly, i need to say I think sexual assault is extremely serious, and it's appalling how low the conviction rate is for sexual crimes. Men get away with far too much, and it's sickening.

However, in all honesty, i wouldn't class the kiss here as sexual assault. This is a lengthy full body embrace followed by a very brief peck of a kiss.

If something like this is classed as sexual assault, then it surely makes it impossible to initiate anything physical at all without explicit verbal consent.

Surely there's much more to this... i reckon she hated the guy before this incident and this was a way to get him back for other shitty and belittling treatment from him over the years.

AIBU?

How do YOU define sexual assault then OP?

YABU

yabu.

there is a serious victim blaming tone to your post too. Nobody should have to put up with physical contact they haven’t consented too

She received unwanted sexual contact to which she didn’t consent. He held her head in place to kiss her. What else do you think this was? Would it have been different for you if a man she didn’t know had done this to her on a bus? Would you think it was okay if a man came up and did this to you in Tesco?

No wonder women are reluctant to report sexual assault.

No, not sexual assault but crossing a line.

Yabu
You should have activated voting.

YABU big time.

Ok, so even if she did dislike him beforehand…

How is it ok for a man you dislike to grab you in a full body hug, hold your face and kiss you?

"then it surely makes it impossible to initiate anything physical at all without explicit verbal consent" yes correct this is how it should be. YABU

Not again. There were plenty of threads about this at the time. I disagree with you anyway.

then it surely makes it impossible to initiate anything physical at all without explicit verbal consent

Yes exactly, do not initiate anything physical at all without explicit verbal conset. It's not that hard. Keep your hands to yourself.

If he’d apologised when challenged about it I have no doubt it would have blown over. It was sticking to his right to manhandle women whether they like it or not which was the issue.

I don’t think it’s sexual assault either, certainly not right but I wouldn’t put it in the same category as sexual assaults. I guess I’ve been sexually assaulted a fair few times if a kiss is a SA

YABU

I thought the same when this story broke. Then I had to go & find loads of videos, because I really do not like to be the person who says "sexual assault? 🤔"

The conclusion I came to:

That kiss was unnecessarily grabby. He clenched her really firmly, body to body, then held her head still so he could get more kissing done! He also smacked her as she left - I don't think it was on the bum, but it did actually look like he was aiming for it.

So: by holding & grabbing her, he removed the element of consent. She couldn't have pulled away to minimise the kiss, and the fact he grasped her so hard suggests she was trying to pull back. The slap was an added statement of "who's boss".

Managers hug and kiss male players, but not at all like this.

A small assault, but an assault. That level of dominance over the woman's body, demonstrated in public, suggests it's a lot worse in private.

YABU

here is the BBC article you mention

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67861492

Go and watch that cup of tea video and come back

"If something like this is classed as sexual assault, then it surely makes it impossible to initiate anything physical at all without explicit verbal consent."

Yes that would be perfect. Noone should be grabbing and kissing anyone unless they know the person is 100% enthusiasticly consenting.

Also if he's comfortable doing that in public with the entire world watching, imagine what he gets up to when behind closed doors. Utterly grim.

Of course it's sexual assault, especially holding her head in place to make it harder for her to get away from him.

You don't kiss (or touch) someone without permission. It isn't hard.

I don’t think it is BUT I have been a victim of sexual assault and I think victims can have a skewed view of what is and isn’t ok.

YABU

I kind of agree with you OP. I do think he was presumptive and the peck on the lips was completely inappropriate. If he had simply hugged her or shaken her hand, all would have been fine. However I'd say it is more about male arrogance and assumption than an actual sexual assault. I don't think he was looking for sexual gratification and probably just got carried away. He was a fool not to have apologised though. I'm not sure she was right to go after him as she has - it does suggest she's out for revenge for more than just the kiss.

Not consensual, therefore assault. Totally gross to watch!