Uncle's reaction to education discussion

[Krankopi]

Family gathering in Southern England over Xmas with extended family and we drove over from West Wales where we've lived for past 18 months. I'm chit chatting to aunt and catching her up on our lives and tell her about plans for DS education.

Our DS turns 3 next year and we're opting to send him to a Welsh-speaking pre-school from September and then if all goes well to Welsh speaking primary school.

The school is very good, recent investment and a few neighbours whose kids go there really rave about it. I studied French at uni and have very open attitude to other language so think it would be great opportunity for DS to be bilingual From young age.

If there were any unforeseen issues and it doesn't work out then there are English speaking primaries and secondaries in area also.

Uncle overheard the conversation and chimed in 'but you're not Welsh!' and 'it's a dead language'. I attempted to explain benefits of bilingualism, fact our area has quite a lot of Welsh speakers and DS will grow up there etc but fell on deaf ears and he really went for it at that point.

He seemed properly offended by the whole thing as if we were somehow betraying our roots (we're English and DS also born in England). It was completely ridiculous. He then proceeded to insult the Welsh, their language before aunt told him to cool it and convo moved on.

His opinion about DS education is irrelevant but thinking back to his reaction has really angered me. It wasn't just that he didn't agree, his blood seemed to really boil. He is a bit of a little Englander type who voted for Brexit so I shouldn't be surprised but I can't understand how someone could take such offense to going to Welsh school in Wales.

The more I think about it, the more I want to say something to him to put him in his place. I find his attitude disgraceful and I'm so close to writing or calling to give him piece of my mind. AIBU? Should I just forget the whole thing?

Maybe making my point another way will work better, like writing next years Xmas card in Welsh.

I'm bilingual in an uncommon language only spoken by the natives (ie nothing useful like French or Spanish). I understood learning two languages as child is really good for brain development. My parents made me go to a Saturday school to learn the language. It did become quite a chore unfortunately as it was an extra day of school so an actual bilingual school like the OP is presumably considering, would be amazing as the child would absorb two languages without really noticing.

Go for it OP. It can only be beneficial - for brain development, for joining in in a Welsh speaking area, and for the full enjoyment of Welsh culture especially poetry and music in later life. It is no mental effort for a baby to grow up bilingual or even tri-lingual, so the earlier he starts hearing Welsh, the better. There seem to be a lot of quite ignorant little Englanders on here - surprising!

I appreciate he was in full rant mode, but did you tell him what you have learnt about language acquisition? I think that's the only thing you can do if he starts up again (e.g. if your son initially spells better in Welsh than in English and he remarks on it). Frame it as "Well, I didn't know this before I looked into it, and a lot of people don't realise, but interestingly..." - not as "How can you be so ignorant and bigoted when obviously..."

Either he will be receptive, or he won't and you can just drop the subject and privately roll your eyes.

Nothing weird at all with showing Welsh in Wales or being educated in Welsh. I do think it's a strange choice for your child to be educated through a language you don't speak yet though when there are other options available. It's hard enough to unpick my 5yo's take on her school day when we're all speaking English!

teacher in an Irish medium school where several Ukrainian families have joined us in the past 12 months. Children picking up both languages from basics.

Why?

That was so annoying

YANBU, OP, and your uncle's a tit.

Learning 2 languages from an early age will make it easier for your DC to learn other languages later on, and I think it's great that Welsh is being taught in schools.

When I was young, there was a very real fear that the language would die out, so few people spoke it and it wasn't being taught in schools.

Because English people think the whole world should communicate in a language they understand, which means they don't have to be arsed learning any others. They always have.

Hmm not sure about that. Also spent time
in wales myself so no axe to grind but it’s not somewhere I would passionately want my children to live forever. Personally if I was going the dual language route it would sure as hell not be welsh (one of my own dc is learning dh language privately but it’s a useful one). Agree the uncle is rude those views are to be expressed to your spouse in the car in the way home…

My English niece lives in Wales with her Welsh husband and their Welsh children, and teaches maths. I'm not sure whether in a Welsh medium school like the children. It seems fine to me.
I have one doubt, though. My English teacher of French had a French education and was qualified to teach chemistry in France, but when politics compelled her to come to England, she could not switch to teach chemistry here because the vocabulary was so different. I hope that sort of thing doesn't occur with specific subjects between Welsh and English.

Don’t do the telling him or the card, but if it comes up next Christmas smile really earnestly and helpfully say oh no we haven’t moved here, we LIVE in Wales!! It might seem strange here but lots of people speak welsh in Wales.
Big smile, condescending. Pull out your phone and show him where wales is on the map. So he knows you live in wales hence your child is doing school in Welsh.

Not sure why the son wouldn’t thank his mum for sending him to good schools that help him become fluent in a second language, while his brain is still the squishy sponge that can pick up anything at that age.

I speak eight - the first one outside my native tongue was a bitch to learn, the rest were a piece of piss, even though they’re mostly completely different, including different alphabets. When I was at uni, I hung out with a big group of kids from all over the world and we all spoke multiple languages.

She’s unlocking a door for him, giving him options when he’s older and setting him up for a crucial skill early in life.

But I’m sure her son will think that’s a terrible thing when he’s older 😂

Well my daughter has benefited from this. Born outside UK no exposure to Welsh until 8, now fluent and using it daily at Uni. It has opened doors already and friendships.
Not dead at all.
Go for it he will thank you one day.

I am bilingual and went to a Gaelic medium primary and secondary school.

My father was a native speaker, but my mother learned as an adult (the school that I went to offered lessons to parents and were really supportive of adult learners). She's not fluent, but can hold a reasonable conversation and follow native speakers' interactions fairly easily.

As an adult, I also speak fluent French, Spanish and Italian to a decent standard, reasonable tourist German and was able to pick up enough Japanese and Korean when I lived in East Asia for a while for work to make myself understood.

I also find it easy, when travelling, to quickly learn enough of a new language to be polite.

I think my ability to learn new languages is down to the fact that I spoke two languages from a very early age and I think you're doing a great thing for your son!

I think your concerns are reasonable and well-intentioned, but I think what's rubbing people up the wrong way is that there is a lot of knowledge and research about language acquisition and bilingualism and language-immersion schooling, and you don't seem to acknowledge that or be curious. It feels like you've written the idea off without necessarily knowing much about how it works, or considering the known advantages. That's going to be frustrating for people who raise bilingual children (or were raised that way) and come up against these assumptions all the time. Or is that unfair of me and you do have knowledge and experience of this?

Living Welsh is the best revenge.

Pretty useful to people living in Wales!

Syniad da OP, da iawn! Some very ignorant responses on here 🤣 Bilingualism is fantastic for brain development and Welsh is very much the first language where I live. It's also a very important part of the culture. Your uncle is a tit, pay no mind!

Were you hoping for an echo chamber?

Not a fan of the Welsh (long story) but absolutely if I lived there I would want my DC to learn the language why ever would you not and would give it a go to learn myself. He will be totally disadvantaged if he doesn't learn.

De-railing the thread but basic Welsh and Gaelic should be taught in English schools even if it's only for a term or so. Sign language should absolutely be taught

Well played.

I also grew up in Wales, but I wasn't taught Welsh as my school was only English speaking. (We lived in the south)
I really regret that. I think it's a great idea.

Germany is however, the 3rd largest global economy with a wide array of work opportunities - Wales, not so much.

You've addressed my only concern with the homework support by learning the language yourself!

I don't think you should actively reopen the wound with your uncle now the moment has passed but I absolutely support sending the Christmas card in Welsh (because I'd just find it very, very amusing if it were me!)