AIBU to think we NEED to repair society however we can

[Puffalicious]

I occasionally see posts from the local FB page- good to keep up with things happening etc. Recently there have been many posts with people helping each other for Christmas- signposting people looking to donate toys/ food etc, the odd person asking (very mixed area, big city, so wealthy folk mixed with people struggling & everything in between).

Yesterday a post grabbed me, an anonymous post looking for food to tide them over until 29th when paid. Seemed very genuine. They asked for a PM, which I did, along with a few others it seems. It was a young girl, pregnant who had no-one & no food. I usually give to the local food bank- had just Yesterday done a larger, Christmas donation whilst doing my shop- but she seemed outside the system, working with unexpected costs.

We exchanged a few messages & she said she wasn't fussy, eats most things & whatever I thought would be great. She wasn't askimg for anything else. I did a week's shop including items for breakfast, lunch & dinner & some treats, including plenty fresh fruit & veg, milk, bread, washing powder & shampoo. She said she had no plans for Xmas day, so I offered to plate up & drop off.

When I went to drop the food she met me at the door with a joint in her hand. She's 6 months pregnant. Unfortunately her hallway was full of filthy stuff & the stench that hit me was unbearable. We chatted a bit: she had lived there 4 years & had 5 other children- the eldest lives with the father, the other 4 with her mum. She would be at her mum's for Xmas, she 'never misses one', so did have someone cooking for Xmas. The father of her child is in a city hours away- she's just back from visiting & wants to distance herself.

I wished her a Merry Christmas & asked if she needed things for the baby- I gave her details of local places to contact if needed. She says she cannot work - another thing she was untruthful about, but she may have her reasons.

I know I can't save the world, & I'm pleased she has food, but I feel that I won't do this again? I'm not sure why I feel like this, but I think I'll stick to giving to the local food bank. I feel like I'm not judging, maybe I am in my own way?

Where has society got to where a 25 year old will have 6 children, 5 of which are not in her care & the 6th probably under social work watch? How can we fix this? I work in education & see ACES & trauma in the young people who come from such situations. Where are we going wrong? What can we do? She seemed pleasant & perhaps with half a chance she may have had a different path.

I'm wittering now.

YABU- Society is how it is, we can't change people.

YANBU- We need to try to change society for the sake of that unborn baby & many like it.

FFS.

But then her parents can't be that bad if they have custody of all her other kids between them by social services.

I had a very similar experience a couple of years ago. The woman didn’t even say thank you and tried to demand more and more and more.

Im very much on the fence with sterilisation. Who should be centred in this decision, one person’s bodily autonomy or the numerous babies she will no doubt go on to have and that fact they will grow up with trauma and neglect, likely perpetuating the cycle. I agree on the face of it the idea of sterilisation is horrific, but is it worse than endless neglected children who grow into damaged adults and the effect that has on society?

Why do you?

Why do you "need to get to the source"

Do her a favour or don't.

Honestly, the handwringing on your part is weird.

You are not her saviour because you took her a bag of shopping.

poor girl probably doesn’t know better, it’s a generational cycle. Very possibly she saw her own mother have children from different fathers and living in benefits, now her own children are learning that is what “women do”. the government is financing dysfunctional families and aiding with continuing the cycle. I come from the US and always thought the benefits system was a smart invention by the powerful to keep the poor poor while stopping them from rioting.

It is her choice to live like this, you can't force people to live to your standards. Her children have been removed and the next one probably will be as well. She won't change unless she wants to. That's the thing about charity, it doesn't always go to good people or the most deserving.

As long as society provides for people in need (whether it does or not is questionable) you cannot compel people to live a certain way.

Too many people fall through the net and are left to flounder. I don't know what the answer is

the answer is funding for professionals who’s job it is to pick up those falling through the net - midwives, health visitors in the first instance, social work and family support in the second. Sure Start was a way of getting people through the doors where ‘stay and play’ sessions helped build trust so bigger issues could be managed effectively. Having such centres located within communities so users don’t have to travel far, where a cup of hot tea is free or very low cost and the statutory and voluntary sectors work together to help plug gaps and pick up pieces is essential. Staff and volunteers need to be solution-focused and able to work without judgement (which this thread shows is hard for many to do). Education, apprenticeships and training opportunities need to find these parents where they’re at, grants and other funding readily available as well as affordable childcare which is open probably 24 hours a day so parents can get jobs such as healthcare assistants, in 24 hour retail, care homes, out of hours cleaning etc. Support to navigate things like DLA applications and to understand how Universal Credit works when you are in work should also be an integral part of what such centres provide. And finally, therapy and counselling opportunities for those who have experienced or who are experiencing violence and abuse with the aim of stopping that never ending circle of violence begets violence in its tracks. Give such parents the tools with which to improve self esteem, gain self respect and the tools with which to positively contribute to society. In other words, a staff and resource intensive system which your Tory Government has sod all interest in funding.

Indeed, I have also reported the OP and hope the thread is taken down soon - it's a bit blatant even for a bell ringing saturday!

Contraception is freely available in this country . Hand me my arse on a plate if you wish but some women need to keep.their legs shut and stop bringing yet more children into already fraught situations, then answer the door for a load of free food whole smoking a joint.
It's not really rocket science is it

I agree about the need to repair society (or anything) rather than try and create a replacement), society isn't completely broken although it appears that it is; just keep on doing the little bits wherever we can, the big stuff in an emergency too, if we keep up with the basics that cement/glue/hold communities of random/unconnected people together, then the 'divisive' stuff is held at bay.

I agree with every word of this. It comes down to money; as it always does.

I don't know why you think the thread should be taken down. It's discussing a relevant and topical question, with some posters coming up with sensible suggestions.

Yes, you're right, but in our society they're not taken care of.

Were you like this at school?

Miss, miss she's saying something I don't agree with..will you tell her off!!

If people let themselves down to the extent of the woman described, we also need to ask ourselves who, how and why are we enabling people to survive live like this?

I'm similar to you- a working class, very loving family with an emphasis on education. I and my 4 siblings have all done well, and our children in turn/ will do well with a support system around them.

👏

You can still “spread your legs” and not get pregnant, have you heard about contraceptives? If you really DON’T want children you won’t have them.

I seriously don't understand why I'm being accused of 'peering into someone's life' or thinking I'm a 'saviour' or being 'blatant' - about what I may add?

I just helped someone, I don't want applause FGS. I am just concerned for her & others like her. MN loves to pull someone around for daring to ask a question.

The problem with this is that those people living feckless lives are empowered to have 6 kids, as per this woman, and responsible, self-sufficient people have very few kids (e.g. zero kids if they never find a suitable partner).

The benefits system naturally results in people that could never afford to have large families, having large families. If those people are also antisocial, feckless scumbags, then society has a big problem.

As i previously said, I'm not sure what the solution is.

Contraception is freely available in this country . Hand me my arse on a plate if you wish but some women need to keep.their legs shut and stop bringing yet more children into already fraught situations, then answer the door for a load of free food whole smoking a joint. It's not really rocket science is it

Sure. Aside from your charming (not) wording, there are major issues with your thinking. Not all women have both access and control over contraception. Lots of men out there who will refuse sex with condoms, hide contraceptive pills, demand contraceptive-free sex as a means of ‘proving’ love. They may also hit, beat and ultimately hospitalise a partner who wants to use contraception. Now, you may have the self-esteem, financial capability and that little extra something that means you’d never get into a situation like that in the first place; or would run in the opposite direction at the first sign of it. But not everyone does. Many saw their mothers treated badly and accept it as normal and more still will consider the anger and violence as some kind of demonstration of just how much he loves them . Persistent abuse lowers self esteem and finding the strength to walk away when you’ve had no role models do the same doesn’t help.

Empathy costs nothing. Wanting better for all children is something we should be seeking to achieve as a society. And we should absolutely want to fund it and hold our MPs accountable for having good quality support in place.

I’d say it shows low intelligence - it seems to be a pretty basic logical decision not to have 6 children if you can’t feed them or look after them. I can’t see how you could really think otherwise.

in fact, I don’t know many people (if any) who could effectively manage 6 kids. I know I couldn’t. That’s what contraception is for.

thats then assuming that even if ££ was shared out, how long before some save, some spend and some invest before its back to square one, you only have to look at some people that win the lotto early on eg twenties etc and what they did with it,