To think women who enjoy choking during sex should know the risks?

[ImTheGoat]

In a different thread the topic of choking during sex has come up repeatedly. Some women say they enjoy it and it's none of anyone else's business. Others have said it gives abusive men an excuse to hide behind if and when they murder their partners- see here for some tragic stories but bear in mind they're upsetting https://wecantconsenttothis.uk/

My own point of view is that choking during sex is dangerous. Study after study have pointed out that it can cause death or lead to brain damage. It's easy to find this information online but here's an article about it https://www.webmd.com/sex/what-is-sexual-asphyxiation I do think people should be able to do what they want sexually if it isn't hurting anyone. But I also think people should be aware of the risks. In the other thread people who raised any objection to choking during sex were called "pearl clutchers" or "sex police." AIBU to think no, knock yourself out if that's what you want to do but at least acknowledge it isn't a safe sexual activity?

I enjoy it. It feels nice. Have had some partners who have refused to do it as they aren't comfortable. But yeah feels good to me.

I honestly find it strange but each to their own.

Yes, after going back on the dating scene in my mid-forties, it is clear that there are a lot of men who are now looking for stuff they have been watching on porn.

I avoid them like the plague.

@NotBadConsidering the only way to have any sex is to have a nice man do it to you. Full stop.

Women end up in all sorts of abusive relationships. They’re reported on his very website all the time. It would be interesting to hear, of those who are physically abused and at risk of death from their partners, how many of them choose to partake in rough sex. I bet there’s no correlation whatsoever.

Same for stats on murderer women - how many times is that during sex? Probably not many compared to the amount actually killed.

Either way, I’m content that I’m safe with my partner, and yet another woman, with no interest in rough sex, isn’t.

Exactly this! I am in my mid 50s, and never EVER heard of this shit when I was a young woman. I think strangling as part of sex play is horrible and dangerous, and I can't fathom why ANY woman would want to take part in this. I bet no woman EVER suggests it. And it's funny how men are never the ones being strangled eh? I am sure some (female) posters will now claim they do it to their men, but I doubt that very much.

So much weird shit, and dangerous shit has been normalised (in sex) these days, and young women are made to feel like they are dull, boring, or frigid etc if they don't want to do it. Same with anal sex. 21st century porn has made these horrible dangerous practices 'normal' and has made some young women feel they should do it. Like 'strangulation,' anal sex is horrible. Dangerous and horrible. And I struggle to believe any woman who says she enjoys either one.

I am sick to death also, of some posters (who are probably men) spouting crap like women are boring if they don't want to do weird stuff, and they are pathetic for only liking 'vanilla sex,'

Sex is not 'vanilla' because a woman doesn't want a stiff penis rammed in her anus, or because she doesn't want to be choked til she passes out. 'Breath play' indeed!

YANBU @ImTheGoat

Exactly this. The guy I see knows what’s off limits and just because I like being spanked and choked doesn’t mean I want anal. He knows that that is one of my boundaries.

However from online “dating” I have found that anal seems to be a big thing for guys and have been asked multiple times if I like it and you know what I say no. It’s easy if you have your own firm
boundaries of what is acceptable to you. I can see though that younger women and girls or people less confident, who aren’t comfortable with saying no to sexual stuff could easily end up being coerced into it (I know that was me 15 years ago) it is crazy at how popular that seems to be with guys. I find less so with the restraint and choking etc. I think there should be more done to make women/girls aware that they have a choice

Same - but it seems to be most of them. Single men in their 40s or 50s are for the most part spectacularly repellant.

I have enjoyed this activity on previous occasions, with two partners. With both partners I suggested it. The first time because I was curious, and subsequently because when in the mood I find it both arousing to think of and very pleasurable to do.

I am a grown up and can understand risks.

If anybody ever wanted to do this against my will, that would obviously be another matter entirely.

I think people should try to resist sexual practices that cause themselves or others harm. Strangulation even if it gets you off can be damaging so not a good idea. I don't care if its kink shaming, some kinks should be shamed otherwise we'll be paedophile apologists.
Personally I can't think of a greater turn off than being hurt or worse my partner enjoying hurting me.

I bet no woman EVERsuggests it. And it's funny how men are never the ones being strangled eh? I am sure some (female) posters will now claim they do it to their men, but I doubt that very much.

@FreshWinterMorning already beat you to it and confirmed earlier in the thread I do dominate my man sometimes, and have and do “strangle” him sometimes. And yep, wrong again - it was me who first raised this preference with DP as well.

Your view doesn’t surprise me, based on several other threads if someone had said “what would FreshWinterMorning’s view be of this?” I have known immediately 😂😂

You could do with opening your mind a bit, rather than living in such constant ignorance.

@SkySecret The problem is there is "evidence" of assault (bruises, cuts etc etc). But it stops being "evidence" and becomes "one persons word against another" because of idiots (and those with bad intent) pushing the narrative that lots of women really enjoy it, so just because she's got a black eye doesn't mean she didn't ask for it.

The fact remains that if I walked up to a man in the street and asked him to punch me as hard as he could in the face, or asked him to do extreme body modification surgery, and he did so he could still technically be guilty of assault/affray (or probably murder) because outside some heavily controlled environments (boxing, qualified surgeons etc) such acts are illegal. Bare knuckle fighting happens. It is not legal. Just because something happens during sex shouldn't change that. Thats why the principle that "we can't consent to this" matters so much.

You want to talk about Trust in a BDSM relationship. FINE. Then just as the woman "trusts" the man not to go to far and kill her, the man has to "trust" the woman not to report him to the police for assault. That makes the law fairer for everyone else. Rather than undermining years of work on getting DV taken seriously for a small minority of people.

I'm not a 'try hard pick me' type. I just happen to enjoy anal sex. Just because you don't doesn't mean no one else does.

But the point is if a woman dies, all a defence barrister has to do is convince the majority of a jury that it’s a) a normal practice that the victim could easily have been into and b) it doesn’t take much for it to go a bit awry.

Your posts alone on this thread are examples of that.

It’s a get out of jail free card.

How many men have died from choking during sex?

@anothernamitynamenamechange @NotBadConsidering

I’ve not suggested that it should be, or is reasonable to be, a “get out of jail free card”. And don’t agree that it’s right to be. But that’s a whole other issue that would need to be addressed by the relevant bodies.

banning people from having whatever type of consensual sex they want is a) not going to change that, and b) impossible and invasive.

Just what I was going to say.

I don't think any woman really enjoys this.

Some tolerate it because they feel they have to.

I agree but you've got to be pretty thick to not realise the risks of being strangled! I do want this topic out there though so young boys and girls get that this is not normal sex and what is expected. I have a 13 year old and when she becomes sexually active she needs to know that what lads have seen in porn videos is not how regular people have sex.

@Emotionalsupportviper might help to read the thread first then 😄

Please let's work on teaching our kids about consent and respect for one another, and how to communicate about their feelings and relationships.

They need to know that porn is not real, that either partner can draw a firm line and say No to anything, at any time.

This sort of thing just makes my dislike of pornography, and its effects on us all, even stronger.

Legally, it really isn’t anything like a ‘get out of jail free card’. A defendant might try the argument but it would be very likely to fail, in a fatality case or a non-fatality case.

In fatality cases the medical evidence will almost always be decisive on charges of murder. And even if the ‘consent’ argument was successful there would still be a manslaughter verdict. Which can be many, many years of imprisonment.

@SkySecret
Can I ask about this "We did have a little accident once where DP nearly choked me out (the elbow round neck from behind technique). He wasn’t squeezing really, just holding me but his muscles were tense and it obviously must have cut my blood supply. I started seeing stars but had plenty of time to tap out then fell forward on the bed confused. I was probably seconds from passing out, took me a minute or two to come back to reality. He was horrified may I add. "

This is a weird question but how did his being horrified make you feel? Because actually, the line between that being a story on mumsnet and that event having had very serious repercussions (brain damage etc) is huge. You make it sound like a loving relationship so surely that would be completely life ruining for both of you.

And the chokehold is used by bouncers/law enforcement but there have been numerous issues with it. e.g. the man being tried for manslaughter because he used it to restrain a violent man on the NY subway and killed him. This was a man trained in using this method of restraint and the man who died was conscious and moving right before his death. Whatever the outcome of the trial will be, the man (and all the people on the subway) will have to live with that death the rest of their lives. It blows my mind that (especially in the US) there is such a push to make this a method of last resort for law enforcement but a simultaneous push to normalise it within the bedroom.

TL/DR if its dangerous/murder for a man to use it on another man its is surely also dangerous for a man to do it to a woman. And no, I don't think people do enjoy the risks.

It's weird the shit that turns some people on. How could being choked possibly feel nice? And why would anyone be that desperate to feel 'nice'? When did having an orgasm stop being enough?

some women do enjoy it, not just doing it out of expectation. It’s a kink, like any, some people don’t understand why people enjoy it, but they do

I know you’re not making a get out of jail free card. But the normalisation of the practice is.

And I do consider it possible that women can die unintentionally at the hands of men.

And I agree it can’t actually be policed.

And it’s been demonstrated that no one has a solution in the bedroom to prevent death completely. No one can answer what to do when your brain is oxygen deprived. I don’t believe “it’s alright, you’ll pass out safely before you die as long as your man isn’t murdering you” is true.

So the answer is that the death of a woman should result in automatic conviction and jail time as was suggested earlier in the thread. A specific crime with a specific minimum term served. Kink away, but if it goes wrong you’re dead and your partner goes to prison.

I’ll never understand why people get so bothered by things that other consenting adults enjoy doing