Page 25 | Trans women do not have periods.

zaazaazoo · 2023-12-19T18:12:55+00:00

According to period pants maker Modibodi, transwomen can have 'periods'. Periods which are just as valid apparently. Whilst I'm not going to suggest I know what hormone treatment tied to a trans woman, I can confidently say that no, they don't have periods. Periods involve blood. Trans women don't bleed. Modibodi seem to acknowledge that there is no bleeding involved I transwomen's 'periods' but bizarrely under a section on how to manage their periods, trans women should ^wear period pan^ts. For the life of all God's WHY???! Wtf would wear period pants if they didn't have to?

BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn · 21/12/2023 09:17

It's worse than that, @BrightGreenMoonBuggy. They aren't even redefining it as 'bleeding of any type'. They're redefining it as 'any sensation or emotion at all that you think happens regularly'.

Got a headache? That's your period.

Farting more? That's your period.

Have the urge to upset people? That's your period.

Ate a piece of chocolate? That's your period.

[Edit: impressive telepathy skills! How did you manage to reply before I'd posted?]

MargotBamborough · 21/12/2023 09:23

Lelophants · 21/12/2023 09:14

Wow this thread is still going.

Maybe there are… more important things going on? Yes it seems a bit ‘silly’ but if period pants are more comfortable then maybe just let transwomen wear them?
Pretty sure the (very few) transwomen I’ve met wouldn’t want anyone else to know what underwear they’re wearing. These threads are something else.

Let’s also not attack people who label themselves as non binary. No I don’t get it either, but there is so much nastiness laced in this.

I agree there are more important things, such as the fact that female rape survivors in many parts of the country no longer have access to female only support because that is yet another thing that must be inclusive of trans women.

TheKeatingFive · 21/12/2023 09:24

Maybe there are… more important things going on?

Personally I think that biological accuracy and respect for the dignity and experience of women and girls are pretty important. But you do you. No need to read if you have so much more important stuff to be doing.

Helleofabore · 21/12/2023 09:24

Lelophants · 21/12/2023 09:14

Wow this thread is still going.

Maybe there are… more important things going on? Yes it seems a bit ‘silly’ but if period pants are more comfortable then maybe just let transwomen wear them?
Pretty sure the (very few) transwomen I’ve met wouldn’t want anyone else to know what underwear they’re wearing. These threads are something else.

Let’s also not attack people who label themselves as non binary. No I don’t get it either, but there is so much nastiness laced in this.

So you happy to dismiss misinformation then? And dismiss a brand using that misinformation to sell a group, one that we are told is one of the most vulnerable in the UK , products that they don’t need?

And you believe that you should be able to attempt to shame women pushing back by telling us that we should be speaking about something else? That is a deflection tactic and is commonly used to silence discussion that you don’t agree with.

Do you have anything of substance to contribute? Or just here to do a drive by scolding?

HoneyButterPopcorn · 21/12/2023 09:27

BrightGreenMoonBuggy · 21/12/2023 09:13

@BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn yeah, exactly as I said. None of that is a ‘period.’ That’s nothing to do with menstrual bleeding. That’s redefining what a period is so it includes the side effects of men taking female hormones. No womb, no bleeding = not a period.

So if they decide that the pants are for ‘periods’, not periods - and that they will redesign them include a wee pouch for your chocolate, a warm pad to heat your tummy, tissue pocket for your emotional outbursts… but take away the bulky gusset for, y’know actual bleeding?

wear them all month!

HoneyButterPopcorn · 21/12/2023 09:28

And yes marketing - as a friend of mine (marketing in an international form which is well and truly rainbow washed) ‘if it was ‘on trend’ to kick puppies and kittens, that would be our next campaign’.

EtiennePalmiere · 21/12/2023 09:29

BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn · 21/12/2023 09:17

It's worse than that, @BrightGreenMoonBuggy. They aren't even redefining it as 'bleeding of any type'. They're redefining it as 'any sensation or emotion at all that you think happens regularly'.

Got a headache? That's your period.

Farting more? That's your period.

Have the urge to upset people? That's your period.

Ate a piece of chocolate? That's your period.

[Edit: impressive telepathy skills! How did you manage to reply before I'd posted?]

Edited

Those things actually do happen more often on my period 😂
I do shed womb lining at the same time though.

Chersfrozenface · 21/12/2023 09:39

EtiennePalmiere · 21/12/2023 09:29

Those things actually do happen more often on my period 😂
I do shed womb lining at the same time though.

Show quote history

But then they didn't used to coincide with my periods, when I had them.

Not all women experience PMS Indeed, studies report that only 20% to 32% of women do.

So it's not universal even amongst women who do have periods.

Merrymouse · 21/12/2023 09:40

Lelophants · 21/12/2023 09:14

Wow this thread is still going.

Maybe there are… more important things going on? Yes it seems a bit ‘silly’ but if period pants are more comfortable then maybe just let transwomen wear them?
Pretty sure the (very few) transwomen I’ve met wouldn’t want anyone else to know what underwear they’re wearing. These threads are something else.

Let’s also not attack people who label themselves as non binary. No I don’t get it either, but there is so much nastiness laced in this.

To reply in similar language:

Wow, your response is something else! Maybe women’s ability to use language to describe their experiences is quite important to equality and protection of their rights!?

What people do in their private lives is up to them, assuming it only involves consenting adults and breaks no laws.

However, Modibodi is owned by Essity, a global corporation with a multi billion EUR turnover.

Their website is asserting that women have a duty to affirm that periods are just a hormonal fluctuation that could happen to anyone, completely divorced from female physiology. This obscures the reality of the impact of menstruation on women as a class and limits understanding.

(Having said that this thread would be a lot shorter if more people used ‘OP posts:see all’ even if they don’t want to RTFT…)

Baldieheid · 21/12/2023 09:43

MargotBamborough · 21/12/2023 09:23

I agree there are more important things, such as the fact that female rape survivors in many parts of the country no longer have access to female only support because that is yet another thing that must be inclusive of trans women.

Show quote history

Or the female patient who was raped in a women's ward of a UK hospital and gaslit for a full year that it could not have happened, seeing as there were only women on the ward.

It took the hospital an entire year to admit there was a male individual as a patient, but that this person wasn't a man as he had girlie feelz. His feelings were more important than the woman he raped.

A year where they lied to the police and the victim of the attack. Told her it couldn't have happened.

But we're to "be kind"???

Who to?

it's certainly not women.

Is compassion for her a step too far for you?

This won't be the last time either, if single sex services are allowed to disappear because the "be kind" ninnies are complacent.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/03/17/hospital-told-police-patient-not-raped-alleged-attacker-transgender/

tennesseewhiskey1 · 21/12/2023 09:43

The world is slowly going mad. I fear for my poor children with this sort of rubbish they put out.

Slightlyboredandseverlyconfused · 21/12/2023 09:44

I am a woman. Born that way. I am taking HRT to deal with peri symptoms. I get period like symptoms with no bleeding during my two weeks on progesterone. I get cramping, I’m full of rage, feel emotional, get bloated and windy. But don’t bleed. I then get my natural period at the end of the progesterone two weeks. All the same symptoms but with a bleed too. Hurrah! I am trying to sort it out so the progesterone times better with my natural cycle because it’s miserable! But that aside…

I came on to post this to say that I don’t know what the addition of female hormones would do to a male body, but hormones are pretty powerful. So may be that is the experience of trans women? May be you can have some menstrual symptoms from taking female hormones when you have a male body with no uterus? My female friends following an hysterectomy still have cycles and feel the ebb and flow of their hormones. Im not an expert but I think it sounds possible, but haven’t researched it.

It looks to me like the blurb about period type symptoms is unnecessary and a bit virtue signalling, (but nowhere near as awful as the greenwashing I see everywhere I look) but the marketing
of the pants is aimed at ‘anyone that menstruates’ and seems focused on trans men to me - which makes sense.

Whether or not you agree with people being trans is a separate question. I’m in the ‘live and let live’ camp and want everyone to be able to express their ‘true selves’ as long as it doesn’t interfere with the safety and well-being of others. But in terms of this company and it’s marketing - I can’t get too het up about it TBH. I get more angry about greenwashing and marketing at children.

runningpram · 21/12/2023 09:57

I think it’s clear what Im getting at. But for those
struggling: There are spaces and experiences
that should be the preserve of women that were born women.

HootyMcBooby · 21/12/2023 09:58

" So may be that is the experience of trans women? May be you can have some menstrual symptoms from taking female hormones when you have a male body with no uterus"

But transwomen who claim to "get their period" also complain of all the typical female symptoms associated with that, INCLUDING CRAMPING.

WHAT THE FUCK IS CRAMPING?
This is itself proves that this is at best, psychosomatic, and at worst, delusion or pisstaking or "thou that shall not be named" on this site.

If you watch some of the videos on popular video sharing sites of these people, a lot of them even have a huge grin on their faces while writhing around on a bed with about water bottle clamped to their imaginary uterus. And no I'm not joking, go and have a look and then come back and tell me this isn't a colossal appropriation of womanhood.

EtiennePalmiere · 21/12/2023 09:59

Chersfrozenface · 21/12/2023 09:39

But then they didn't used to coincide with my periods, when I had them.

Not all women experience PMS Indeed, studies report that only 20% to 32% of women do.

So it's not universal even amongst women who do have periods.

Show quote history

I never said they were universal, just an amusing coincidence that your examples happened to be my main personal symptoms.
A lighthearted aside to a serious topic, apologies for any offense.

Baldieheid · 21/12/2023 10:02

runningpram · 21/12/2023 09:57

I think it’s clear what Im getting at. But for those
struggling: There are spaces and experiences
that should be the preserve of women that were born women.

If that were respected, I suspect none of the argy-bargy would be happening. Trouble is, saying what you just said makes you, in the eyes of TRAs and their "allies", a "raging transphobe". How DARE you "other" TW by excluding them for each and every aspect of the female experience?

I agree with you, BTW, except I do not include TW in "women". They are TW, with their own health care needs, social challenges and requirements. These overlap with mine only so far as any other male's needs would. I'd prefer TW and TM to be catered for specifically, so that they receive the appropriate care suited to them.

Chersfrozenface · 21/12/2023 10:03

EtiennePalmiere · 21/12/2023 09:59

I never said they were universal, just an amusing coincidence that your examples happened to be my main personal symptoms.
A lighthearted aside to a serious topic, apologies for any offense.

Show quote history

I doubt if anyone was offended, I certainly wasn't.

I was just pointing out a fact about PMS, on the back of your remark and my own about our individual experiences

MrsTwatInAHat · 21/12/2023 10:05

I was thinking about his thread and it occurred to me that Modibodi probably aren’t doing this just for sales to period-appropriating TW. They are appealing to the masses of young “ally”/“be kind” women and girls who they hope will choose Modibodi In admiration of their wonderful modernity and inclusiveness. As well as the many trans-identifying/non-binary females who do need period products.

Even if they are aware that this will lose them some sales, GC feminists tend to be older and so less of a target for brand loyalty.

Mornusting · 21/12/2023 10:06

They also carry this on every page so are obviously wanting to be seen as super all inclusive.

We acknowledge the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia and their continuing connection to land, sea and community. We pay our respects to them and their cultures and to their elders both past and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples today.

Baldieheid · 21/12/2023 10:12

Yeah, it's cynical marketing aimed at the younger audience who are now used to Dylan Mulvaney gurning his way through a tampax advert.

I'm old and jaded and remember Gerald Ratner spectacularly blowing up his own business. I doubt this crap will have as much impact on their bottom line. I quite like that they're being open - it gives people a choice.

Tatumm · 21/12/2023 10:13

MrsTwatInAHat · 21/12/2023 10:05

I was thinking about his thread and it occurred to me that Modibodi probably aren’t doing this just for sales to period-appropriating TW. They are appealing to the masses of young “ally”/“be kind” women and girls who they hope will choose Modibodi In admiration of their wonderful modernity and inclusiveness. As well as the many trans-identifying/non-binary females who do need period products.

Even if they are aware that this will lose them some sales, GC feminists tend to be older and so less of a target for brand loyalty.

Absolutely. It’s young women that this bollocks appeals to mainly.

Merrymouse · 21/12/2023 10:16

Slightlyboredandseverlyconfused · 21/12/2023 09:44

I am a woman. Born that way. I am taking HRT to deal with peri symptoms. I get period like symptoms with no bleeding during my two weeks on progesterone. I get cramping, I’m full of rage, feel emotional, get bloated and windy. But don’t bleed. I then get my natural period at the end of the progesterone two weeks. All the same symptoms but with a bleed too. Hurrah! I am trying to sort it out so the progesterone times better with my natural cycle because it’s miserable! But that aside…

I came on to post this to say that I don’t know what the addition of female hormones would do to a male body, but hormones are pretty powerful. So may be that is the experience of trans women? May be you can have some menstrual symptoms from taking female hormones when you have a male body with no uterus? My female friends following an hysterectomy still have cycles and feel the ebb and flow of their hormones. Im not an expert but I think it sounds possible, but haven’t researched it.

It looks to me like the blurb about period type symptoms is unnecessary and a bit virtue signalling, (but nowhere near as awful as the greenwashing I see everywhere I look) but the marketing
of the pants is aimed at ‘anyone that menstruates’ and seems focused on trans men to me - which makes sense.

Whether or not you agree with people being trans is a separate question. I’m in the ‘live and let live’ camp and want everyone to be able to express their ‘true selves’ as long as it doesn’t interfere with the safety and well-being of others. But in terms of this company and it’s marketing - I can’t get too het up about it TBH. I get more angry about greenwashing and marketing at children.

If you aren’t menstruating you are having symptoms that women who menstruate also get, but that isn’t a period.

It’s important because clear language is important - when you are going through menopause it’s important to distinguish between symptoms you experience because of your menstrual cycle and symptoms you experience because of HRT. It is dangerous when doctors speak in euphemisms because they assume everyone knows something.

People wouldn’t question this if they were talking about religion or age. There is no similar web page for post menopausal women who don’t identify with their age. The expectation is that they just get on with things. The similarity with other situations where women are expected to affirm men at their own expense are just too obvious.

I’m concerned because it’s a societal default that is dangerous for women.

MargotBamborough · 21/12/2023 10:18

runningpram · 21/12/2023 09:57

I think it’s clear what Im getting at. But for those
struggling: There are spaces and experiences
that should be the preserve of women that were born women.

You know that most of them would consider you a "TERF" for that view though?

OneTC · 21/12/2023 10:23

Mornusting · 21/12/2023 10:06

They also carry this on every page so are obviously wanting to be seen as super all inclusive.

We acknowledge the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia and their continuing connection to land, sea and community. We pay our respects to them and their cultures and to their elders both past and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples today.

Edited

What's wrong with this?

Merrymouse · 21/12/2023 10:23

HootyMcBooby · 21/12/2023 09:58

" So may be that is the experience of trans women? May be you can have some menstrual symptoms from taking female hormones when you have a male body with no uterus"

But transwomen who claim to "get their period" also complain of all the typical female symptoms associated with that, INCLUDING CRAMPING.

WHAT THE FUCK IS CRAMPING?
This is itself proves that this is at best, psychosomatic, and at worst, delusion or pisstaking or "thou that shall not be named" on this site.

If you watch some of the videos on popular video sharing sites of these people, a lot of them even have a huge grin on their faces while writhing around on a bed with about water bottle clamped to their imaginary uterus. And no I'm not joking, go and have a look and then come back and tell me this isn't a colossal appropriation of womanhood.

Given the severity of the pain some women experience because their womb is contracting to expel blood, it seems dangerous to suggest that this is normal in TW with a different internal physiology.